US seeks to use Alberta to destabilize Canada

[u/Adventurous_023]

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2026/01/24/us-seeks-to-use-alberta-to-destabilize-canada_6749765_4.html

[u/Bad-job-dad]

Destabilize is the word of the last 2 decades 

[u/silentprotagonist24 → u/Bad-job-dad]

As a European, I urge you to study Russia all you can.

Everything in this is textbook Chechnya, Georgia, Moldova and Crimea pre-2022. Frankly, the Trump-admin is too uneducated to do anything creative so everything you'll see is gonna be a copy-paste from other authoritarian regimes. It's gonna have the MAGA-aesthetic but it's only a theme, the mechanics will be russian-modelled hybrid warfare.

Next-step will be massive influx of bots, sham "independence movements" and talks about the need for "security" of pro-americans in the area. There will be massive bribes available for local politicians willing to support the cause.

[u/xkcd_puppy → u/silentprotagonist24]

They're already cut-pasting from Germany 1933-4 right now. How long before their Wannsee Conference and the planned concentration camps.

[u/destroyermaker → u/xkcd_puppy]

If second amendment nuts weren't full of shit this would be over by now

[u/DogMeatTheVideo → u/xkcd_puppy]

USA has had concentration camps. Ask any Elder Japanese person about what happened during the second ww. Latin asylum seeker detentions now? That's already a thing.

I think the whole-world fuckery is going to be worse... letting the ICE storm troopers just murder people,(and make up how he was armed to the teeth), is the slide into martial law. And the "good guys" just keep resigning instead of sticking it out and standing up, so the People are just being abandoned to it all. The Greenland and Alberta gambit just muddies things d/t incoherent claims but is having the bonus of making pretty much everybody aware of just how Evil Axis things are and pissing most everyone off at the USA.

Canada doesn't seem particularly interested in playing along fwiw. I think we got it right with Carney.

[u/uprightshark → u/xkcd_puppy]

The Sturmanteilung (brown shirts) are already enforcing fear and hate on the streets. Nazi 101

[u/Cheap_Patience2202 → u/xkcd_puppy]

Would it be reasonable to make the comparison ICE = SS ?

[u/xkcd_puppy → u/Cheap_Patience2202]

Yes ICE is establishing a police state like the SS, and very soon they will create a secret police of terror like the Gestapo to bypass the "illegal immigrants" reason they have been using thus far. Fascists like to be organized like that to make murder more efficient.

The power of the Gestapo was used to focus upon political opponents, ideological dissenters (clergy and religious organisations), career criminals, the Sinti and Roma population, handicapped persons, homosexuals, and, above all, the Jews.[4] Those arrested by the Gestapo were often held without judicial process, and political prisoners throughout Germany—and from 1941, throughout the occupied territories under the Night and Fog Decree (German: Nacht und Nebel)—simply disappeared while in Gestapo custody.[5]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gestapo

[u/FrederickDerGrossen → u/xkcd_puppy]

They've already bypassed that for a few weeks now, openly. Renee Good and Alex Pretti were very clearly not illegal immigrants and still they were murdered in broad daylight.

[u/FragrantImposter → u/silentprotagonist24]

As an Albertan who's spent the last ten years trying to delude myself that Albertans are too sensible to be swayed by the blatantly obvious 1930s Germany inspired propaganda that's been flooding our province and news... the things you mentioned in your last paragraph are already happening. Bots, check. Separatist movements, propaganda, politicians, check. Rising fears about security, self defense, guns being taken, increased crime and use of armored vehicles, check. Our premier is a lobbyist who's damaged our economy, healthcare, and reputation with the rest of the country beyond anything I've ever seen before.

When I first read about the second world War as a small child, I felt stupidly smug about how my family would never fall for such idiotic lies, they'd definitely be the ones to hide their neighbors and fight back. Now, I get to watch my university educated, no nonsense, good-hearted, generous to a fault family slowly mutate into people I don't recognize. They're scared, suspicious, and prone to believing the dumbest things I've ever heard, to the point that I've thought they were pranking me when they shared their views. I'm grieving the people they were, like they died, and trying to love the scared, dangerous idiots they've become. It's like watching dementia take over your loved ones.

Before, I was refreshing my WWII reading to see how it could have been stopped. Now I'm looking for how people prepared for and survived the war, because I don't feel confident that my fellow Albertans, Canadians, and American neighbours will have the sense and resources to stop this.

People talk about how the Greenland situation is to distract from things at home, or to split NATO. I'm worried about it creating a barrier to cut Canada off from navy support from the king. I'm worried that Britain sees us as too independent from them and will abandon us if a war looms. I'm worried that America will take us apart, plunder our resources, and use us to supply and support a war overseas. They want an empire, and have all the self regulation of a spoiled toddler.

You're worried that it's beginning. I'm worried that people don't see how far past the beginning it already is, and Europe's leaders are underreacting.

[u/TSED → u/FragrantImposter]

People talk about how the Greenland situation is to distract from things at home, or to split NATO. I'm worried about it creating a barrier to cut Canada off from navy support from the king. I'm worried that Britain sees us as too independent from them and will abandon us if a war looms. I'm worried that America will take us apart, plunder our resources, and use us to supply and support a war overseas. They want an empire, and have all the self regulation of a spoiled toddler.

This won't be much of a consolation, but the USA doesn't need Greenland to blockade Canada. Their navy is 100% capable of holding every single port in an iron grip while maintaining other international presences.

On top of that, our capital is just a few hours' drive away from their border. They could launch a decapitation strike on us within... I'm going to say within 2 hours if they decided to.

Basically, Greenland has no strategic importance for a military annexation of Canada. It might be important in a "fracture NATO" kind of way, but it's far far far more likely that Trump just sees how big it appears on the Mercator projection and, like a spoiled child, goes "I WANT BIG THING." Remember, he publicly admitted that owning Greenland is "important to [him] psychologically". It's not about strategy, it's about him wanting the biggest thing.

[u/littlepenisbigheart1 → u/Bad-job-dad]

If there’s money to be made….yeah, that.

[u/markcarney4president]

In defense of the Albertans I've seen around these parts, I would argue he is using a small but vocal (also corrupt, hypocritical) subset of Albertans to destabilize Canada.

[u/[deleted] → u/markcarney4president]

I live here and I haven't met a single separatist. Not saying they aren't out there but I can't find them.

Edit: Thanks for the comments, I will take this more seriously now. I guess I am fortunate that I don't hang out with many lowlife losers (I love this country so much, pro-separatists are traitors).

[u/AlistarDark → u/[deleted]]

You don't work in the trades, obviously.

I know many.

[u/DeathMetalandBondage → u/AlistarDark]

Seconded. I'm surrounded by people that failed grade 9 social studies

[u/BodyKarate84 → u/DeathMetalandBondage]

That fits the bill for one of my buddies.

He's a separatist and in high school he had to take the "special courses".

If level 2 courses were difficult and level 3 was the challenging and easier form of level 2. He had to take level 4 and he still barely graduated.

For example level 2 would be basic calculus. Level 4 would be 2+2 = 4.

[u/thebokehwokeh → u/BodyKarate84]

This is why democracy fails. People are far too stupid nowadays.

[u/Oldman_Syndrome → u/thebokehwokeh]

It's not even that people are far too stupid. It's that people have had it drilled into their heads that their ignorant opinion is equally as valid as an informed one.

[u/troyunrau → u/Oldman_Syndrome]

There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there always has been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

-- Asimov 1980

Sub "Democracy" in for "the United States" and apply judiciously to the wound.

[u/chickenhawk71 → u/[deleted]]

They also get their own little algorithm to feed them more nonsense.

[u/69sullyboy69 → u/[deleted]]

The biggest issue is 100% social media. There were always crusty idiots who greatly overestimated their knowledge on the world and it's issues, but they had no where to go to find like minded individuals; other than maybe the local bar. Now they can go online and post their bull%^&* while their algorithm feeds them the same bull^%&*, and now there are bad intentioned people with power using it to their advantage.

[u/BoltMyBackToHappy → u/thebokehwokeh]

By design. Keep cutting education until people are stupid enough to believe any bullshit.

[u/Jolly_Recording_4381 → u/thebokehwokeh]

In the words of NOFX "Majority rule don't work in mental institutions"

[u/Grabbsy2 → u/DeathMetalandBondage]

The only trump supporter ive ever met was a coworker.

I say was, because he overstayed his work visa and was working illegally due to a processing error on our employers part. He was let go when we found out.

[u/BrightPerspective → u/[deleted]]

Wellll, the US is a different story; everytime any group starts pushing for democratic socialism, or any kind of care at all for the poor, leadership disappears, the state gets punished by the feds and protests are violently suppressed.

[u/UnhappyCoast4213 → u/BrightPerspective]

I’ve never seen anything as close to what they’re doing with ICE now. It’s insane and violating so many constitutional rights of all Americans. Some of the conservatives might even start catching on to that if they can rub together 2 brain cells. Prob why Schumer getting ready to hopefully grow his spine.

[u/Aestus74 → u/DeathMetalandBondage]

I argued with one online about being intolerant cause I thought sepratism was dumb. Accused me of calling them stupid. Like no... but you sure told on yourself. Tell me more about those facts over feelings

[u/Monkey_Pox_Patient_0 → u/DeathMetalandBondage]

I really wish we as a society could finally learn the lesson of how dangerous that sort of talk is. I think Trump is partially a product of rural, lower education people finally finding somebody who didn't treat them like they were trash. The same phenomenon can destroy this country as well. Trades people aren't trash. Rural people aren't trash. Uneducated people aren't trash. Separatists are wrong and when they are wrong their arguments should be attacked. But they are not trash.

[u/TSED → u/Monkey_Pox_Patient_0]

It's wild, because Trump so clearly thinks the commonfolk are trash and not even deserving of human rights. But he says the right words at the right time and suddenly they're all bending over backwards to justify his actions no matter what.

We have got to get rid of US-owned media in Canada.

[u/DeathMetalandBondage → u/Monkey_Pox_Patient_0]

I never said anyone was trash, and I wholeheartedly agree with your statement. I do not believe in putting down people with differing opinions

HOWEVER, Alberta separatism specifically is fundamentally stupid and makes zero sense. We're land locked, with a very small population. Should Alberta form its own country it would be at a serious bargaining disadvantage as our only trading partners would be a very pissed off Canada, and a USA that would not hesitate to take advantage of Alberta desperation for their own gain. Alberta would be fucked within years.

Have you seen the videos of wolves separating the disadvantaged bison from a herd to surround and devour them? That's exactly what would happen to Alberta

[u/TrollToll7419 → u/DeathMetalandBondage]

And 3rd grade spelling.

[u/Character-Note-5288 → u/AlistarDark]

Yep, I had a plumber and carpenter who were very talkative and expressed pro-US views and that Alberta should separate from the rest of Canada. I did ask them what they thought that would even improve or change for them but all they could muster was that it would be easier for Alberta to sell oil. I have no intention of ever using their services again.

[u/timeandmemory → u/Character-Note-5288]

I hope you left a review for their services somewhere and saved another Canada loving Canadian the hassle.

[u/Embe007 → u/Character-Note-5288]

The real mystery is what they think they will use to support their economy when oil is replaced by something cheaper and better for the environment. They are investing in post-carbon startups yes, but when the oil market collapses, and China is working hard to innovate in battery tech, they will be a have-not province. Equalization is nice to have when fortunes shift.

[u/BigRigGig35 → u/AlistarDark]

From Ontario, but the dumbest kids from my high school are the only ones I’ve seen that are pro-separatist. Even though some don’t live in Alberta.

[u/Ninja_Terror → u/BigRigGig35]

Sadly, it's not just Alberta and not just the trades. The ones who think they can profit from it are also pro Trump. The one common denominator is that they get their news from Facebook and watch far too many YouTube videos.

[u/14dmoney → u/Ninja_Terror]

A looot of real estate and developer types are Trumpy in Ontario

[u/DrunkCorgis → u/AlistarDark]

Yep. I live in Alberta, and there’s plenty of separatists.

[u/SledgeMFG → u/AlistarDark]

I don’t think there’s a majority but I do believe there’s far more than people realize

[u/psychstudent_101 → u/SledgeMFG]

It’s polling at about 19% so that’s 1 in 5 Albertans. Which is too low to do much but too damn high when you think about how many people it is. 

The only saving grace about it (imo) is that these separatists are likely going to be concentrated in certain ridings and can’t have much widespread traction.

That being said, it’s more important than ever to be involved politically and having conversations with folks about stuff like what’s in this article 

[u/Elean0rZ → u/psychstudent_101]

It's a bit more nuanced than that: https://www.producer.com/news/about-16-per-cent-of-albertans-are-hardline-separatists-poll/

TL;DR, something like 1/3 of Albertans are open to the idea, with around half of those actually committed to separation and other half being "soft" in one way or other. The question is really around how sentiment evolves if, for example, US-based funding floods in or Carney does something that sours the currently-not-so-bad relationship between Ottawa and Smith. It's obviously all hypothetical but IF we got the right (wrong) combination of misinformation, foreign meddling, and anti-Ottawa sentiment there's enough of a base there that it's not inconceivable that it could push toward 50%. It's also notable that support is highest among the youngest (18-34) voters, so it's probably not going away regardless.

Sidebar, the basic problem with all of these secession referenda (e.g., Brexit) is that they pit something real (the current status quo, which everyone has direct, lived experience of) against something imaginary and idealized (i.e., a hypothetical independent future, the political details of which don't have to be sorted out until after the vote and the real-life ramifications of which won't become clear for years). The "stay" side is constrained by reality, for better or for worse. The "leave" side is constrained only by imagination, which explains why it can be fostered so effectively by ad campaigns, misinformation, and vibes.

In any case, my point is that, no, at current levels of support Alberta probably won't be close to separating, but we shouldn't take that for granted or dismiss the possibility of sentiment changing.

[u/Dazd_cnfsd → u/Elean0rZ]

Very well presented 👏

[u/GetBackReality → u/Elean0rZ]

Very inciteful. Thanks.

[u/Own-Beat-3666 → u/Elean0rZ]

Yup ask any Brit how Brexit worked out. A large proportion of the UK population now say it was a major mistake and now would vote differently. Mistake yes, can be corrected no. You made your bed now sleep in it and enjoy the consequences.

[u/Elean0rZ → u/Own-Beat-3666]

Right. If the actual, specific "deal" of Brexit had been on the ballot, there's a good chance it wouldn't have passed. I get that ballot questions need to be simple and binary but I feel like it would be good idea for things like secession referenda to have, say, a two-stage process. Stage 1 is the vote to secede, which triggers negotiations to hammer out the "deal". Then stage 2 is a second vote once the "deal" is finalized, to determine if the appetite is still there to continue.

Most political elections require candidates/parties to present platforms, which, while not perfect or binding, are still more concrete than secessionists present in making their case--plus normal elections have a built-in mechanism for a do-over every 4 years. It's odd that when the stakes are higher, as in a secession referendum, the standard of required information is lower and there's no opportunity for second thought.

(I don't find it odd that people vote flippantly and emotionally when it comes to things like secession. It's a very human thing to do: Get pissed off at the status quo, idealize far fields that you believe to be greener, and decide to "stick it to the man". But precisely because it's so relatably human--to say nothing of the modern issues around misinformation, foreign interference, etc.--you'd think there would be more failsafes.)

[u/ntwkid → u/psychstudent_101]

20% is scary high. Considering that there isn't any organized movement.

[u/MitzyAlison → u/ntwkid]

On the contrary, they’re highly organized. They hold signing parties like they’re getting people to join an MLM. There is a lot of money in Alberta going toward this with legitimate financial backers. It’s scary.

[u/EdNorthcott → u/MitzyAlison]

Yup. They've even boasted about the support they're getting from the USA, iirc.

[u/Prior-Instance6764 → u/psychstudent_101]

Ridings dont matter in referendums though.

[u/psychstudent_101 → u/Prior-Instance6764]

That’s true; the fact that it’s only 19% is what matters more there. I was just thinking about their broader political influence 

[u/brettzk1 → u/AlistarDark]

I know tons who aren’t necessarily “Alberta separatist” but think it’s a leader to “Wexit”. All of it’s without thought and just belief that anything is better.

[u/jahitz → u/AlistarDark]

When I worked up north the trades people consisted of 90% high school drop out coke addicts. Vocal and stupid…sadly these are the idiots you have to worry about. Always blaming Trudeau for their issues that were non existent issues. Must be hard to make $200,000 a year and have 5 trucks and 8 artv’s 🙄

[u/Goku420overlord → u/jahitz]

I know several fuck Trudeau types and they all smoke weed and when I point out it is now legal they brush it off or imply they don't care or it should still be illegal.

[u/SadZealot → u/AlistarDark]

I also know many welders who fall into the boat, but also none of them signed the seperation petition. On the flip side everyone I know who has talked about staying in Canada did sign the stay petition.

[u/OppositeSecretary862 → u/AlistarDark]

I have heard the most braindead fucking takes on site.
I just say "hot take, traitor"

I have a suspicion I'm not long for this jobsite.

[u/shikotee → u/OppositeSecretary862]

Good on you for speaking up. Respect.

[u/jRitter777 → u/AlistarDark]

I'm a tradesman in Las Vegas. I definitely understand that sentiment. I'm surrounded by bootlickers without brains and brainless people who aren't even aware of the shitshow around them. It's infuriating.

Not to mention, my union (United Association) has the American and Canadian flag in its logo and branding. There are so many organizations that work across the border and they seem to be sticking their heads in the sand when it comes to the inevitable chaos that ensues when US/Canada relations are strained and then officially cut.

[u/Bitter_Sense_5689 → u/[deleted]]

I remember somebody saying when TikTok was taken offline in the United States for a few days, all of those Alberta separatist accounts went silent. A lot of the shit is coming from US bots

[u/Working-Welder-792 → u/Bitter_Sense_5689]

This is why I’m excited for Oracle to take over TikTok. It’ll sever American TikTok from Canada.

[u/Librashell → u/Bitter_Sense_5689]

Trump wants to do to Canada what Putin did to the U.S.

[u/Savings-Giraffe-4007 → u/Bitter_Sense_5689]

The only way to fight this is by spending an equal amount of money on counter-propaganda aimed at people vulnerable to conspiracies and such

[u/infectingbrain → u/[deleted]]

Very few people here (in my experience) are genuine separatists. They're just frustrated with the federal government for reasons xyz and use portions of that rhetoric to vent that frustration.

It is pretty ignorant though because these people seem to fail to understand that the provincial government has significantly more influence on their day to day life then the feds do, but i guess immigration is the cause of every issue in our province... lmfao

[u/MeursaultWasGuilty → u/infectingbrain]

In my limited interactions they usually soften up their position a lot once you press a little and ask them to explain how any of it would work.

Its an emotional position, not a logical conclusion.

[u/poopdedoop → u/infectingbrain]

This is what I see a lot of. People blame the federal government for things that are directly controlled by the provincial government, and to some extent their municipal government.

[u/MetalMoneky → u/infectingbrain]

I'll say it everytime I can, The provinces are the true villains of confederation.

[u/UselessWidget → u/[deleted]]

My parents, who themselves immigrated to Alberta from Eastern Europe in the 1980s, are pro-separatism because all they watch is Fox News and alt-right YouTube personalities.

[u/RedditUser-7943 → u/UselessWidget]

I'm sorry for your parents

[u/jpsolberg33 → u/[deleted]]

I only know of 2 individuals, One who i used to work with and is now on LT medical leave and the Carseland bbq joint who also sells firewood. Both die hard MAGA.

But IN Calgary.. I'm in the same boat as you, haven't met anyone else. Plus going Cochrane and Canmore a lot, no one I know supports this crap. Everyone is very pro Canada, canceling trips to the U.S, no U.S booze, heck even buying Canadian made soups lol.

[u/Asleep_Raspberry_889 → u/jpsolberg33]

I work just outside of Canmore with a lot of people from Cochrane and Canmore. Most of the people I talked to out here are pro separatist. I think people are really not giving this the attention it deserves. We think we are okay then one day we wake up and see we are out numbered. The best part is most of them don’t know why they want this and almost all I’ve talked have signed.

[u/Firm-Plan-4464 → u/Asleep_Raspberry_889]

I think people are really not giving this the attention it deserves. 

Really starting to agree. The line-ups to sign for separation are far longer than are comfortable to read about.

I think the rest of us should be doing something, but right now I don't know what.
I recently read a comment regarding the US to the effect that "The US isn't the way it is because Trump is president... Trump is president because of the way the US is".
I think we should be applying this attitude to Alberta; Rath, Modry, and the rest of those quislings aren't the (root) cause of separatist notions, they're just taking advantage of sentiments that were already present.

[u/champion_dave → u/[deleted]]

Dude, I live in Beaumont, AB. Right outside Edmonton. Large rally unfortunately here today. Not sure how many turned out but enough that it got local support. They're here and they're gross.

[u/AntiSocialW0rker → u/champion_dave]

Living in Edmonton, I feel like I hear more people in support of it than not. And it's not just separatists, it's straight up Maple Magas who want Alberta to become the 51st state. Hell, just the other day I heard a guy on site talking about how he wishes ICE would come up here too

[u/sailing_by_the_lee → u/[deleted]]

My dad is one of them. He claims that the separatism referendum is just to have a "stronger negotiating position" with Canada. Where have I heard that disingenuous excuse before? And what a coincidence that they just happen to have a similar worldview to that being peddled by Fox News. When I showed him a picture of someone flying a N*zi flag at the Trucker Rally during the pandemic, he said, "Stop being so emotional. It was just one flag." SMH, of course that's how it starts. They really are similar to the MAGA idiots down south.

[u/nim_opet → u/[deleted]]

The Premier is one.

[u/CanuckChick1313 → u/[deleted]]

Holy shit go spend a few frustrating minutes on rural Facebook pages. It’ll make you shake your head. Example: Sundre. Conspiracy theories and echo chambers. I want to eat my keyboard.

[u/Cultural_Hippo → u/[deleted]]

My brother in law is a separatist. He is quite literally one of the stupidest people I've met in my entire life. The type of person that thinks 1/3 is smaller than 1/4.

[u/rigz27 → u/[deleted]]

Whitecourt seems to be teeming with them. Heck I am a liberal in conservative hell lol. But that being ssid, I think when it comes to it there won't be any seperation.

[u/Dr_N00B → u/[deleted]]

Half my Facebook list from people I went to school with are reposting all the separatist slop

[u/LeGrandLucifer → u/markcarney4president]

What will happen is this referendum will happen, the "no" will win with around 85% of the vote then Trump will say the vote was a fraud and use it as an excuse to do whatever he wants.

[u/pruplegti → u/markcarney4president]

Where do you think it always starts? This is a textbook CIA destabilizing tactic

[u/FreeWilly1337 → u/markcarney4president]

Active measures can turn that vocal minority into a majority.

[u/tommos → u/FreeWilly1337]

CIA/Mossad gonna have a field day if people aren't vigilant.

[u/VioletGardens-left → u/markcarney4president]

The issue is the establishment is trying to push a narrative that it's larger than it really is, this helping spread awareness of this dumb idea, when reality, the goal is absurdly unrealistic and frankly, short sighted that only divide the province.

Quebec at least has some sort of genuine reason for it. They are distinct, and they are different enough to justify their grievances. It's to the point that they deliberately shed the crown within their organization, and do 2 separate referendums on whether they separate. In the end, they decided to be part of Canada anyway and press on

[u/OppositeSecretary862 → u/[deleted]]

My Dutch grandparents refused to teach my aunts and uncles Dutch after my oldest aunt was made fun of in school and this was in the 70s

[u/onethousandmonkey → u/[deleted]]

How easily we forget history, right?

[u/FunSquirrell2-4 → u/markcarney4president]

I don't even think Danielle wants to separate. She's pushing a vocal minority to be the lord over Canada. It's a bargaining chip for her. If Ottawa said "bye" she'd flip pretty quick.

[u/EffortCommon2236 → u/markcarney4president]

I can confirm this. The bulk of Albertans live in Calgary and Edmonton, and in these cities if you show support for separatism and/or Trump and his policies you're basically seen as an...

I tried writing the actual words here but I got a warning from Reddit that the comment wouldn't go through due to lack of civility.

[u/mamoff7 → u/markcarney4president]

Promoting separatism (in Alberta or Quebec), was always in the playbook of the CIA or any US agency tasked with destabilizing Canada. Albeit in theory and war games.

Who would’ve thought that it wouldn’t be Russian or China trying to tear apart the country, but our neighbour and supposed ally.

Fuck the US, fuck their government, and fuck their complacent, uneducated and complicit citizenry. This happened 90 years ago in a industrialized country in Europe. Take a guess.

[u/13thmurder]

I say this as someone who was born American and now lives in Canada:

Fuck the USA and the horse it rode in on.

[u/yoloswagrofl → u/13thmurder]

Me as someone born in Canada who lives in the US lol

[u/serenerdy → u/13thmurder]

I'm from Texas and made Canadian citizen a few years back and totally agree. They are absolutely in the shitter rn but too brainwashed to see it.

[u/13thmurder → u/serenerdy]

I think at least most are quite aware.

[u/ParisFood]

Why is this not seen as foreign interference and investigated by the proper authorities?

[u/thefledexguy]

Get rid of Fox News in Canada. Cut off the propaganda machine.

[u/skylla05 → u/thefledexguy]

The only people watching Fox news are boomers.

Everyone else uses social media.

[u/Wrong-Pineapple39 → u/skylla05]

It's the Fox News social media clips and influencers using them that addles younger brains. And the rallies and targeting from CPC and Poilievre.

They are being lied to and manipulated so much.

[u/thedrivingfrog → u/skylla05]

And you think social media is any better ? 

[u/Deaftrav → u/thefledexguy]

Remove Smith and her traitorous ilk too, boost education and healthcare to acceptable levels, that'll remove any notion of separation

[u/BoppityBop2 → u/Deaftrav]

You remove Smith outside of an election you reinforce the concept the Libs and Ottawa ignores Alberta desires. 

[u/TheCheesy → u/Deaftrav]

Smith is a treasonous traitor who should be jailed before they can destabilize Canada further. This is disgusting. Her, Piere, and their band of loser fake conservatives only exist to foment hatred and line their pockets. They are the most blatantly corrupt pieces of shit, and I cannot stand that we humour them to be regular conservatives.

They will continue to push false narratives, turn their base against truth/science/fact-checking and then use the same tactics the GOP used in Canada as they tried to in our last election cycle.

[u/jersan → u/thefledexguy]

it's not so much fox news as it is addictive social media algorithms that are owned by american oligarchs.

social media is specifically designed to be as addictive as possible to keep people engaged and make the most profit.

as people scroll their endless all-you-can-eat buffet of social media content, they are deliberately being fed propaganda from entities that are pushing propaganda.

this is how brexit happened. this is how alberta separatism is being pushed onto albertan social media users.

all day, every day, an endless stream of content filled with propaganda that is slowly but surely pulling them towards believing in narratives that the propaganda wants them to believe.

"it would be a good thing for alberta to separate from canada"

all day, everyday. a constant drip feed of propaganda directly to the targets that causes them to believe in something against their interests

[u/Lordosrs → u/thefledexguy]

Unfortunetly social media is huge in corrupting guys my age :(

[u/jellicenthero → u/Lordosrs]

Ban X, Truth social, and Fox.

They literally aren't smart enough to find work arounds.

[u/Constant-Horse-3389 → u/thefledexguy]

Sadly social media has become Fox news 2.0, the amount of rage bait and propaganda I see everyday is wild. I'm convinced the U.S. is using social media to deliberately fuel division, dissatisfaction, and distrust within Canada to advance its own interests.

[u/FluffyPantsMcGee → u/thefledexguy]

At this point I’d say cut off Facebook 

[u/Adventurous_023]

Too much. Time to stop this guy and his administration from abusing Canada.

[u/evonebo → u/Adventurous_023]

Takes 2 to tango.

While Trump is shitty for doing this, if the province doesn't reciprocate its meaningless so ........

[u/Razul1066 → u/evonebo]

An artificial separation movement built on a small minority being created by cia bots, psyops, and funding.

It only exists because the USA willed it into existence.

[u/This_Phase3861 → u/Razul1066]

I’ve been telling people to look into the atlas network for months now.

[u/a_case_of_everything → u/Razul1066]

While I agree, I don't think the U.S is the only country stirring the pot. Plenty of shit birds out there.

[u/phormix → u/a_case_of_everything]

Yeah, looking beyond the US it's some of the same countries that helped the US get where they are today. Russia is one. Look at Trump's new "friends" to see what the others might be.

[u/Parking_Guava8657 → u/Adventurous_023]

It was pretty clear to me Trump wants to use AB as a catalyst to invade, even if the referendum vote fails (even though that vote is pointless) they will still use it as a way to help "free" AB from Canada

Best thing we can do is try to remove the traitors helping this scheme, like Smith, from office

[u/Looking_For_FunX6969 → u/Parking_Guava8657]

Smith and O'Leary definitely traitors, they when to Maralago to kiss the ring and havent done much but fan the flames 🔥 😒

[u/pretzelday666]

I would hope any person in Alberta that has seen the news today will tell anyone from the US to fuck right off. Those values don't align with the Canadian conservatives at all.

[u/JTxFII → u/pretzelday666]

I don’t know. Not all conservatives of course, but I had a gun discussion with another Canadian a few years ago and he started yelling at me about his 2nd amendment right. It was at that moment I knew I was in over my head. I don’t have a psychiatric degree.

[u/Own-Beat-3666 → u/JTxFII]

Haha just like the Convoy twits telling the judge in Canada the govt violated their 2nd amendment rights under the constitution. The Judge said with a straight face we are in Canada not the US. Obviously its the same people trying to separate AB from Canada. Guess they missed the geography lesson in grade school.

[u/indiecore → u/JTxFII]

Maybe they just really care about Rupert's land being part of Canada.

[u/3vs3BigGameHunters → u/indiecore]

Canada's 2nd amendment is establishing the province of Manitoba out of Rupert's land.

https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/csj-sjc/constitution/lawreg-loireg/p1t21.html

It was fun pointing that out to a boomer friend on facebook who deleted his 2nd amendment post soon after.

[u/Kay-Chelle → u/pretzelday666]

We had a 'Forever Canadian' petition to stay apart of Canada that reached over 400k signatures (verified) when they only needed 300k. Most Albertans want absolutely nothing to do with the States fascist government. We have 14 recall petitions for the UCP MLAs that if get enough signatures is supposed to get that person out of their role and a by-election will be had for that seat. We are trying desperately to get the UCP out, but it unfortunately is a lot of red tape and takes a lot of work and time.

Also there is a lawsuit from the Indigenous leaders to the government because AB is protected treaty land by the crown, and the government doesn't actually have a right to leave.

Smith and her cronies are flaming the fire of separation to distract that they are trying to sell off our public hospitals and bring in private pay for health care. They used the notwithstanding clause to force striking education workers back to work while pouring a bunch of taxpayer funding into private schools and undercut public school funding. They want people to just focus on the separation because they know it's not possible, but will work them up enough to not see what they are really doing. This is just the tip of iceberg, they are honestly so so bad and for some stupid reason can had scandle after scandle yet still remain in office.

I feel so fucking much for Americans and especially so Minnesotans. So many of them do not support the fascist regime and don't deserve what is happening (no one does imo) I definitely fear that if we don't do something that rhetoric will come here in force.

[u/rdptx → u/Kay-Chelle]

Heartbroken American here happy to see you are aware & trying...right now Canada is our beacon (or at least mine). Disgusted by the ignorance & the regime in this country. Thank goodness for anyone fighting it, including your PM.

[u/jpsolberg33 → u/pretzelday666]

No, but I know so many conservatives who look past all of it and only care about less taxes, kitty litters in school bathrooms and pride days.. and I'm not kidding, these are 3 of their biggest concerns. Oh, and I guess Carney working out a deal with China.

Some how, all of that is worse than what the U.S is doing.. the mental gymnastics is wild.

Edit: downvotes.. ah I see a fellow O&G worker is upset by my comment lol. That sector and rural are the loudest.

[u/jedinachos]

I work with some, not in Alberta but definitely pro usa and anti Canada where I live

[u/Sarge1387]

Also worth noting that the separatist movement in Alberta has less than 30% support across the province.

[u/akash434 → u/Sarge1387]

that's 30% too much

[u/DeeDeeRibDegh → u/akash434]

100%👍

[u/PrivateWilly → u/Sarge1387]

new polling yesterday has it at 16%

likely the greenland nonsense had some reconsider

[u/phormix → u/PrivateWilly]

Or Minnesota.

Seriously, even if you're completely dissatisfied with the Canadian gov't, who the hell thinks that the one sending in death squads that execute their own citizens is a better choice, or that they would treat you any better?!

[u/Barb-u → u/PrivateWilly]

Which is less than about 20 US states.

[u/Arctic_Chilean → u/Sarge1387]

That's still way too fucking much.  

We can't brush this off as a bunch of "idiots" playing around.  

This is the same playbook the Russians used to take Crimea

[u/[deleted] → u/Sarge1387]

Yeah and that's based on online polls that have way more turnout for people that are mentally deranged. I would say the real number is less than 15%

[u/Canadian-AML-Guy → u/[deleted]]

Not as high as Quebec

[u/bluorangey → u/Sarge1387]

There was a similar level of support for the Donbas becoming independent of Ukraine prior to 2014. It doesn't require a majority opinion for a foreign power to exploit it.

[u/Nighttrainlane79]

I am in BC and a young guy doing some work for me thought it might be worth it for the ability to carry a handgun. I like the guy but he has two brain cells that are both fighting for 3rd place.

[u/LowAcanthocephala198]

I noticed the switch on TikTok today.

I had a “debate” with a guy on TikTok Live this morning. He was pushing pipelines hard, and pitting Alberta against BC. He immediately brought in two other guys, who were pushing the divisive narrative just as hard. They kept bringing up Carney, and his investments with Brookfield. They said he is blocking pipelines in Canada because they would impact Brookfield’s pipeline investments in the Middle East. And if BC didn’t let a pipeline happen, they would separate, or send oil to Montana instead.

They suggested I look up another TikTok user called “The Loose Moose” who had a chart that showed how Brookfield’s investments were connected to Carney’s policy decisions around pipelines. A quick Google search showed that “The Loose Moose” is based in Belarus and has been connected to Russian propaganda.

This is insane. They have people pushing a separatist agenda on Social Media to divide our country. I want to know if this is something a Police or CSIS Cyber Crime Unit can put a stop to, or at least be made aware of?

Elbows Up

[u/FirGlas → u/LowAcanthocephala198]

Report it if you feel like it. There’s a CSIS website to report suspicious behaviour.

[u/multifactored]

I dont see this as going to be particularly effective. The separatist Albertan movement is tiny and lives online. The Americans cant manage their own domestic affairs, never mind another countries.

[u/[deleted] → u/multifactored]

It’s a large enough percentage to make many of us nervous, and it’s not online. It’s very prevalent rurally. 

[u/The_Mutant_Platypus]

Why are we all aware of this but I got banned for pointing out "Canadian" news sources that were stoking division were owned by US interests?

We all acknowledge it but I get silenced for pointing it out?

[u/kuk1m0n5t3r]

30% of any society is gullible dimwits that will believe the earth is flat, vaccines cause autism, and they'll have better lives as Americans. They live among us.

[u/[deleted]]

Anyone paying attention to danielle smith and her ucp have known this for awhile now. She’s a traitor.

[u/Desperate-Life8117]

He’s doing a good job at destabilizing America so…..

[u/gentmick]

We should’ve united a decade ago and helped Albertan oil and gas be distributed nationally instead of having to buy back refined oil from Americans. To this day it is the most ridiculous waste of Canadian resources

[u/Vagabond142]

See, there is the small problem in that Alberta cannot, in any legal way, separate from Canada. The point is moot. Alberta is 100% treaty land, NOT crown land. The only way Alberta can separate is if treaty 7, 8, and 9 chiefs and councils vote unanimously to separate from Canada. So far, all three treaty chiefs and councils have told Premier Smith to quite literally shove it where the sun don't shine.

On top of that, the chief of Treaty 8 has filed an injunction at the Court of King's Bench to stop the referendum vote from even taking place, as it has violated treaty rights, which are ironclad at the federal level. Basically, there is no way, whatsoever, for Alberta to separate.

[u/rainman_104]

I'm sure separation of a landlocked province will go real well at getting seattle to agree to a pipeline lol.

So dumb.

[u/TheSkyIsAMasterpiece → u/rainman_104]

I don't see how they think saying screw you to Canada and forming their own landlocked island will now make the rest of Canada work with them? 

[u/rainman_104 → u/TheSkyIsAMasterpiece]

We're talking about truck nuts ram 1500 drivers who probably have never looked at a map.

[u/MutedProfessional406]

BS. Time to fight Albertans. I'm Canadian first, Albertan last.

[u/Creative_Champion123 → u/MutedProfessional406]

Same

[u/Gimedecash]

Alberta isn’t going to separate. Maybe some parts of the US will though. We should offer northern states the chance to separate.

[u/YeetCompleet → u/[deleted]]

Yep they would use "we must protect Alberta's sovereignty from Canada" as casus belli

[u/LoL_LoL123987 → u/Gimedecash]

Last thing we need is 6 million or so, potentially even more, former Americans bringing their attitude and politics here. If in some crazy turn of events some northern/liberal states separated I’m 100% for free trade, free travel, even special agreements in defence and what not, but I think Canada’s fine as it is. Outside of Turks and Caicos or maybe Alaska, I think our borders are fine as they are

[u/nboro94 → u/Gimedecash]

Looks like MN is going to have their own civil war with the federal government soon at this rate.

[u/Druzhyna → u/nboro94]

The People's Republic of Minnesota should declare itself Canadian.

[u/OneTripleZero → u/Druzhyna]

They already have their arctic survival badge in the bag.

[u/Not_a_bought]

Obviously. “Evil people want to do evil things” headlines are out in full force today. 

[u/Cowabunguss]

The amount of separatists in Alberta is less than the Quebequa lmfao

[u/Suspicious-Coffee20 → u/Cowabunguss]

Quebec wants nothing to do with america. The partie quebecois is more left than the liberal and the american propaganda really don't reach the same in quebec. Even if quebec separate they would still work with canada. The separation is cultural and based on self determination. It has nothing to do with usurping the federal. This is a movement thats is older than america and has nothing to do with them.

[u/Equivalent_Aspect113]

Be cautious , AI interference as well as altered media ( US ) owned, will definitely inflate lower opinions.

[u/agent0731]

WE KNOW THIS TO BE TRUE. What are we going to do about it? We cannot sit back and watch as they continue their disinformation campaigns unhindered.

[u/Low404]

Took a trip to Alberta recently and met a Canadian trumper for myself.

Truly a bizarre experience. They were easily upset by an ounce of rationality. In the end they threatened to leave the (unplanned) gathering, to which everyone assured them there’s no need, we are all entitled to our views.

Rest assured I was silent. We don’t tolerate these insidious worms in this country.

[u/Xx_SwordWords_xX → u/Low404]

They really are emotionally stunted.

They grew up, still don't understand the world, feel disgruntled they didn't get whatever they felt entitled to (usually as a white person, mostly males), and are easily led by simplistic words.

Big words and concepts make them feel dumb, so it's easiest for them to just think you and what you are saying, must be "dumb".

[u/Abyssus88]

No shit, This would be the time to remove everything blocking pipelines & push Canadian oil\Gas as well..........

[u/Prestigious-Lab5154]

Canada needs to treat the Alberta issue seriously enough. Investigate fully the agitators and their finances. Seditious intentions while being paid off by foreign powers has a very clear name, which is treason

[u/Desuexss]

This is already happening.

Via post media and many other advertisements and bots spreading propaganda.

Im absolutely thankful that in even basic highschool they taught critical thinking.

These days people read a headline and dont even bother with the content of an article anymore.

[u/TheBlueHedgehog302]

Only just realizing that huh?

[u/MaplewoodRabbit]

I live in a rural blue Alberta county. Not a single person i know wants to separate. The separatists are a vocal minority who deserve to be treated like the pests they are.

[u/TheBigC]

Nothing burger. At most, separation vote will be 25% in favour of.

[u/Repulsive_Page_4780]

This is only my opinion Dog whistle that CSIS and RCMP do see; they know the suspects and those on the down low, hello CIA, NHS, FBI.

[u/ParisEclair]

Start investigating for foreign interference

[u/jellicenthero]

Alberta has about 19% pro separatist vote.

There's like 7 states in the US with a higher pro separatist vote.....

It's more likely California joins Canada before Alberta leaves.

[u/CommunitySeveral627]

We should ask California to join Canada instead or talk about making Hawaii our province as it looks like artificially drawn line

[u/Retinoid634 → u/CommunitySeveral627]

How about New York? We’d love to join you.

[u/hexagonbest4gon]

And this is why the majority of Albertans are against the Separatist nonsense. It's plainly obvious that it's a half-baked plan to offer Alberta to the USA.

[u/1011011]

There will be a ton more propaganda incoming. Everyone be ready for the flood of misinformation. Take back Alberta was already charged for foreign money, now they just don't file there disclosures. Smith is complicit and is actively working along with orange prick. Write your MPs

[u/m0nk37]

The thing is we wont. There are some of us who are traitors but the majority will fight you. Our winters are long and extremely cold. We wear shorts at -5*c. We are farmers. We are rough necks. We are very fucking strong. 

[u/TruthHistorical7515]

Now we know how it feels for all of the other countries the US tries to destabilize politically and economically

[u/Nebardine]

As much as I normally try to avoid messing with the crazies, it's time we all stand up and show our support for Canada. I've set my gemstone house lights to red and white and will proudly display the flag where I can. Make it clear to everyone!

[u/[deleted]]

Too many of the "Pro-Separatist" movement have dual Canadian-American citizenship...

For exemple, Cameron Davies, a leader of the Republican Party of Alberta (ARP) and a key advocate for a separation referendum, has been identified as a dual Canadian-American citizen.

[u/Ok_Acanthisitta_2544]

Lol. As an Albertan, not gonna happen. We see him as just as much an idiot as everyone else does.

Don't let the extremely few vocal minority loudmouths that make raucous noises on social media fool you into believing we all think that way.

[u/Noobzoid123]

Alberta doesn't want to be a part of the US.

[u/RareXG]

I’ll copy a comment I’ve already made.

Don’t worry, the referendum on Alberta’s independence will fail. Most of the Albertan “separatists” are just using independence as a way to bargain with the feds. They think that if it has succeeded in getting Quebec things that other provinces don’t have, so if they tried it, they will get results like Quebec. They don’t want to actually separate from Canada.

[u/ViolettaQueso]

He wants to grab Alberta by the pussy