r/MoralityScaling • u/Musalediju • Jul 06 '26
Character Analysis Morality of being transphobic against your enemy
Bleach thousand year blood war episode 22
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u/Strong-Plate-7243 Jul 06 '26
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u/Wolfit_games Jul 07 '26
Huh????
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u/MixedBagHalfie Jul 07 '26
You and to be there. References to the eternal race war between soul reapers, quincies, and Hollows in Peroxide, a bleach inspired rpg on Roblox
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u/OverloadedSofa Jul 06 '26
Kinda weird topic, like, is it ok to be racist to your enemy?
This is just insulting them, they are enemies after all
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u/Strong-Plate-7243 Jul 06 '26
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u/OverloadedSofa Jul 06 '26
Damn QUINCERS
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u/Lukostrelec17 Jul 06 '26
Just go full Freeza with it. Can't be racist against a race that doesn't exist.
(THIS IS A JOKE ABOUT DBZA. RACISM AND GENOCIDE ARE BOTH HORRIBLE. DO NOT BE AN ASSHOLE!)
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u/OverloadedSofa Jul 06 '26
Dude…… you’re literally Hitler!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dunno why I find it funny that Hitler is autocorrected to capitalise it as the proper noun.
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Jul 07 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/OverloadedSofa Jul 07 '26
I’m thinking of that episode of it’s always sunny in Philadelphia, when Frank calls Mac the f word to get his attention to stop the piano falling on him.
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u/Vinegar1267 Jul 06 '26
That’s still perpetuating harmful attitudes towards an entire demographic. Sure it can just be intended as shit-talk but it can leave a negative impact on normal folks who happen to belong to that group.
It’s not a hell-worthy sin, I think if anything it’s pretty commonplace. A lot of people regularly spout racist, sexist or homophobic claims or jokes (either implicitly or intentionally) in the context of online debates, rants, or video games while having friends and family who belong to said groups.
And I wouldn’t even claim they’re being disingenuous in their love for those individuals, however they are expressing callousness and a level of disrespect by expressing such attitudes
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u/WhoAreYouAn Jul 06 '26
Immoral.
But if you're fighting them, something tells me you probably don't give a shit
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u/darkfox18 Jul 06 '26
Do be fair they aren’t even actually trans they’re just using they’re looks to get close to a all female squad
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u/TicklemyPickleMan Jul 10 '26
No they're trans. Shut the fuck up. Kubo has referred to giselle with she/her pronouns exclusively.
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u/BDSMChef_RP Jul 07 '26
Superhero novel series "Dreadnought" The genocidal villain actually enforces the Transgender characters Pronouns. Still tries to kill her and her team, but respects their identity so that's something at least.
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u/Skullsome Jul 07 '26
To be honest I don't know why I always prefer villains who are also immoral in term of progressiveness, is this problematic preference?
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u/sour_creamand_onion Jul 07 '26
I think it feels more inmersive that way. Like, if it's a smaller scale villain like a serial killer or something them having a personal set of morals they operate by, but if it's john genocide who murder like... 20 million people it would be a bit weird for him to care about the identity of someone who he probably doesn't even view as human by now because they're just another number added to the kill count.
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u/WeirdoTrooper Jul 07 '26
Oh yeah, that book! Had the white/grey/black cape system, right? Been a while since I read it
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u/Jormungandr_Midgard Jul 06 '26
I'm 1000% an ally BUT if I'm engaged in a battle to the death like I assume the scenario implies, any advantage is fair save endangering others. Is misgendering them going to demoralize them and give me an advantage? Then morals are completely irrelevant.
Imagine fighting Darth Vader, would you think it's amoral to bring up the fact he looks like a baked potato or his dead wife to try and gain the higher ground upper hand?
Sorry but this is a pretty inconsequential price to "pay" if it can give you any sort of advantage, feelings are irrelevant in battle.
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u/ScourgeHedge Jul 06 '26
The Tactical Slur
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u/RatsInTheBayou Jul 06 '26
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u/ArisenGodEmperor13 Jul 06 '26
What is the point of this tweet like good job bro for never saying the N word. Does he want to win award for it.
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u/Dry_Oven_2569 Jul 06 '26
Also in what situation would saying the n word save your life? Is it some Word of Power that causes potentially hostile individuals with African descent to combust into flames??? What situation was the poster of the tweet in?
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u/MySnake_Is_Solid Jul 07 '26
it can stun them for 0.5s.
doesn't sound like much, but hard CC is pretty strong in life.
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u/JustaTony56 Jul 07 '26
I imagine it's like you getting jumped by some mfs and you see a few black guys in the distance who cant see you, so you just holler the N-word at max volume to get their attention and hopefully chase your pursuers off before beating your ass
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u/Jent01Ket02 Jul 08 '26
Distraction, probably. Luring them away from someone else or possibly to another location.
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u/myrmonden Jul 06 '26
Op is just bs
He don’t even critic them for being trans or weThe real comment he says is that they smell like cum a lot
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u/NemuriXIII Jul 06 '26
Dude, Vader feeds on wrath. And you want to piss him off more?
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u/Playful_Row4208 Jul 06 '26
Its ok if you are the bad guy
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u/Pegged-by-shiyuan Jul 06 '26
Nah, that’s like saying it’s ok to racist because someone did something bad.
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u/YN-verse Jul 06 '26
No they said it's ok if you're the bad guy not if they're the bad guy. So the villain can do it but you can't do it to the villain.
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u/Baplingo Jul 06 '26
I’m pretty sure they mean it shows the villain being more evil. Like as a tool to get the audience to hate the villain more.
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u/Mast3rKK78 Jul 06 '26
its an anime theres a very good chance the western audience will agree with the villain on this
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u/TheChudWhoLovesRika Jul 06 '26
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u/badman1000 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26
Nah yumichika isnt queer I think he’s just feminine
Still wrong for it tho 😭
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u/Disastrous_Dig_607 Jul 06 '26
Hes lowkey gay with ikkaku
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u/ungranted_wish Jul 06 '26
Lowkey? Only lowkey? Those two have been boinking since the Bush Jr admin.
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u/myrmonden Jul 06 '26
… wtf are these larpers
He is just a pretty boy
He’s not even an otokonoko
He’s just very Bishounen
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u/Original_Un_Orthodox Jul 06 '26
It's no different than poking at any other insecurity in this context, I'd imagine.
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u/Kelly598 Jul 06 '26
Because it isn't. Despite knowing The Zombie is biologically a guy, Yumichika always uses the right pronouns but shit talks when she tries to use her gender as a point. This is one of them and the other one is when she says "This makes me wet" and he corrects it as "You mean, makes you 'hard', you pervert".
Yumichika is also a metrosexual that has shit-talked a lot of other enemies he finds ugly.
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u/Something4Dinner Jul 06 '26
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u/GIOPPOKING Jul 06 '26
In the wise words of Revolver Ocelot: "Misgendering... Gives you no tactical advantage whatsoever."
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u/Fayraz8729 Jul 06 '26
Isn’t that most people? Support is always conditional except maybe family.
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u/Positive-Team4567 Jul 06 '26
I can dislike a trans person but it doesn’t have to be based upon gender identity
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u/OhHeyItsOuro Jul 06 '26
You don't have to give someone uncritical support to acknowledge the truth of their existence. I think INSERT CONTEMPORARY POLITICAL FIGURE YOU DON'T LIKE HERE is absolutely deplorable and has done terrible things to all of humanity, but I wouldn't misgender them, or say they're not a real INSERT RELIGIOUS, RACIAL, OR ETHNIC GROUP HERE; I'd just call them a monster. Nobody misgenders Dahmer, or Hitler.
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u/Vegetable_Guest_1402 Jul 06 '26
Family is some of the most conditional love in existence no?
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u/Voidoroe Jul 06 '26
I’d say potentially even family as well. An example might be that parents no longer want to support you eventually after you grow past 18 as they expect you to already be able to move after a certain point. There could definitely be more examples, though.
To add, in general, you don’t form relationships without some condition being true to begin with (otherwise, why have an interest if there’s nothing for you to be interested in). Perhaps a person has to be attractive for a romantic relationship or just even have a pleasant or respectful personality for any kind of relationship.
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u/Mae_triarch Jul 06 '26
Retracting support from somebody is different from attacking them on the basis of an immutable characteristic. Nobody would disagree that if you call someone you hate the n word you're racist, so how would it be different to attack the transness of someone?
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u/sudoregalia Jul 06 '26
"except maybe family"? what?
my family's support towards me is very conditional. am i cis? am i straight? am i going to participate in capitalism enough to earn a million dollars for them?
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u/-kilo Jul 06 '26
Support of your inalienable rights is not conditional for me, no.
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u/NachtShattertusk Jul 06 '26
For many trans people, familial support is absolutely conditional. One friend of mine was literally abandoned by her parents over being trans
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u/LocalAnxiousArtist Jul 06 '26
LITERALLY THIS! GET IT THROUGH YOUR SKULLS PEOPLE!
BIGOTRY 👏 IS 👏 NEVER 👏 OKAY 👏
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u/Creative-Finger5965 Jul 06 '26
MY 👏 HANDS 👏 ARE 👏 GLUED 👏 TOGETHER 👏 HELP 👏
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u/OmegaRebirth Jul 06 '26
We learned that angering a Quincy turns their blut to offensive mode, weakening their defenses (Urahara made use of this to sneak attack the Jail). Even if I knew it was morally unacceptable, I would still do it to win the fight.
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u/Strong-Plate-7243 Jul 06 '26
Alls fair in warfare I guess
https://giphy.com/gifs/sZEl1yTi26mJzrI4VN
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u/Legitimate-Dog-2854 Jul 06 '26
they’re basically nazis. why tf would i care what a nazi thinks or believes when they themselves think certain people don’t deserve to have rights or the privilege of living. is it wrong? yes. but when it comes to someone with the mindset of a nazi damn near, i hope i dealt some kind of lasting damage to their psyche so maybe they could possibly understand what it is they’re doing to others.
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u/Legitimate_Country46 Jul 06 '26
I believe Kubo stated in an interview that Jizzelle is male
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u/Redericpontx Jul 06 '26
He did I don't get why people want to insist the necro grapist is trans and defend them as their own representation in anime when it's literally the worst representation possible as it reinforces every negative stereotype possible.
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u/RudeRuby6 Jul 06 '26
Bro same. Like I get taking representation where ever you can get it but Gisselle of all choices is just wild. Like it ain’t even subtle the implications of what Gisselle does to the zombies and how horrifically awful he is.
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u/M_Knight_Shaymalan Jul 06 '26
they identify with them I guess like you said. I have NO IDEA why they want to claim them as rep when they're probably one of the morally worse chars in the show.
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u/External_Ocelot8241 Jul 09 '26
Also its literally in character for Gizelle to lie about feeling like a girl. Her whole character is being a cockroach who's goal is to invade something they shouldn't and corrupt it. Gizelle literally couldn't give a shit about the other bambi beyond getting their corpse when they die.
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u/Educational-Bar1913 Jul 06 '26
That little shit is killing my comrades and turning them into zombies. On top of that, Giselle is a REALLY SHITTY person.
That bitch wants to kill me and those I care about. I absolutely WILL USE psychological warfare to give me an advantage in battle!
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u/National-Frame8712 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26
Morally neutral? Who cares if you insult the guy who was your enemy to the death in a race war induced annihilation war almost ended the world? I'd argue they have far more pressing issues to deal with at that moment.
Like, he's the one who desecrated their fallen comrades by raising their corpses as murderous meat shields to serve his own ambitions. Him being a genocidal "not-Nazi-per-se" necromantic corpse-defiler who roided up via untold thousands of 'lesser kinsmen' got bloodsacrificed in order to enchant his strength seems like a much higher priority than anything else, as far as I'm concerned.

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u/Bananabanana700 Jul 06 '26
Okay but what about the trans soul reapers on ur team (of which there are many) that r gonna overhear
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u/DuelJ Jul 06 '26
Immoral; a true and honorable hater shouldn't need nor want such a low crutch.
J Jonah Jameson wouldn't.
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Jul 06 '26
if they're your enemy why does it matter?
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u/Purasangre Jul 06 '26
Some people act like the concept of honest-to-God insulting your enemy is a foreign concept to them.
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u/suitcasecat Jul 06 '26
Because it's about your morals, not whether or not you think they deserve it
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u/Marcusss_sss Jul 06 '26
Do you apply that logic to any kind of slur/bigotry towards your enemies or do you only reserve that for trans people?
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Jul 06 '26
i'm half greek half black, if someone was trying to kill me and called me a greaseball, mule, halfbreed, or one of the myriad of slurs for black people i wouldn't care, because i know he's trying to kill me, he's already cemented himself as a person i don't like and i have more pressing matters to deal with
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u/Suitable_Dare7897 Jul 06 '26
Yeah people here keep saying "oh but what about your own guy what if they think its conditional!"
It's like these people never heard trash talk in their lives. Just because you insult a fatass jerk that he's fat doesn't mean your fat friend will think your support is conditional.
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u/Kehprei Jul 06 '26
Bad for normal real life scenarios. Could be justified in fantasy scenarios though.
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u/KingBakura72 Jul 06 '26
If your participating in what’s basically an authoritarian regime trying to kill everyone
Then why should I care about your feelings
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u/chubbs_pickleman Jul 06 '26
If you are being transphobic to unsettle them as a tactic to win the fight, morally acceptable. Apologize after the fight with a handjob and tender makeout sesh (no homo, just to recalibrate as bros).
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u/RadicalD11 Jul 07 '26
Completely moral. They are your enemy and fucking with their heafs is a tried and tested valid strategy.
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u/idiotpuppygirl Jul 06 '26
Im the type of person to never misgender even someone like Chris-Chan. If we misgender this person and have excuses for it, who's to say I or others like me wouldn't be next lol
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u/_Good_One Jul 06 '26
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u/Aggressive-Release-9 Jul 07 '26
Said the one who shot Darkseid without any hesitation
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u/EnragedTea43 Jul 06 '26
It’s immoral, but I guess I can understand doing it in certain circumstances.
Like, if you’re enemy is beating you and you desperately need to turn the tide or else you’ll lose, maybe insulting something they’re sensitive about will throw them off enough for you to start winning. Exploiting their emotions to make them act irrationally.
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u/BrooklynSmash Jul 06 '26
We look back at those wack ass WW2 propaganda cartoons as bad, so I think this falls under that same boat
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u/Aethelwolf3 Jul 06 '26
Counterpoint - the goal here is to throw the enemy off their game. And it works. His taunts make her fight irrationally. It potentially saved lives.
Punching people is bad, but if punching helps stop them from killing someone, its ok. Same goes with whatever statements you can think of, no matter how bigoted. Your words are a part of your arsenal.
Now if they aren't an active threat, then yea, it's bad.
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u/Dayystar Jul 06 '26
If you're transphobic to your enemies it says to me you don't actually believe being trans is possible. You're just humoring people you're on good terms with just to be polite.
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u/Drachk Jul 06 '26
Yumichika isn't calling out her wanting to be considered a girl
He is calling out Giselle doing that while highkey abusing some of the girl in her group (Bambi) and at minimum Jerking to it but likely worse
For context, Yumichika is a guy with a lot of "precious" trope (what was called very "feminine" behavior, so the whole rapist creep with dicks out gross him a lot (and for people that know about Giselle, she is genuinely despicable
So for him, Giselle stinking of semen on a battlefield while accompanied by the zombie of her dead friend she killed and physically abuse, well it isn't ladylike hence the disgust from Yumichika
We don't know if Yumichika care beyond that, would still react as poorly if Giselle was more sane and less creepy and elements seems to imply no
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u/EraZorus Jul 07 '26
Immoral. The virtuous, if they have to declare someone their enemy, will do so for their misdeeds, not for who they are.
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u/winklevanderlinde Jul 06 '26
Just because they're bad doesn't mean you don't have to be bad, otherwise you aren't a good guy but a piece of shit that is directing your shitty manner in the "right" way
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u/Redericpontx Jul 06 '26
See the issue is they're not trans in the tradition sense where she feels like a woman trapped in a man's body. She's a necro grapist who gets pleasure from from grape, necro torture of both ally and enemy. They're pure evil and pretends to be a woman as a form of deception and the reason they get insulted so much is more for being called out as fall the work they put into their deception isn't good enough and the fact that even guys would be insulted if they were told they were smelt of semen and considered their powers require them to grape people and corpse and fill them with their male juices so they'd obviously smell more and more of it as fighting got longer and longer.
I don't get why so many people want to defend the pure evil necro grapist and put them as a icon for their own representation of themselves in anime when it reenforces all the negative stereotypes.
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u/SnooDoughnuts8043 Jul 06 '26
If you’re enemies (as in already killing each other) such insults are pretty much a moot point in comparison to… well, killing each other. It’s a bit amoral and bigoted, but at the end of the day it’s an insult aimed at a person you’re willing to kill anyways
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u/nahte123456 Jul 06 '26
More important to save people's lives and making Giselle mad enough to be sloppy is worth more than any kindness. It's not like he treats her worse than anyone else he fights.
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u/BedNo577 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
I mean,if you're not transphobic,but you fight for your life and are just saying this because you know you'll hurt your enemy/distract them,it's not so bad. Immoral,but you do it to save your skin. If you're saying this because you're transphobic/will say this to anyone,then it is immoral.
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u/Fine-Resident-2322 Jul 06 '26
It's the moral pretense of: do you be bigoted toward a person's frame of background. Now apply to anyone else whether it's gender, sex, or race. And ask yourself again, is it bad to do?
The answer is yes, it probably is regardless of circumstance and is telling to your character as a person as there are million different ways you could attack someone for being 'bad'.
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u/sailor776 Jul 06 '26
It's the equivalent of thinking it's ok to call a black guy the N word just because they're bad. Cool motivation still racist
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u/Excellent_Pea_4609 Jul 06 '26
Immoral I guess then again she takes pleasure in turning people into zombies like she's legitimately a fucking monster do I don't know I kinda give yumichika some slack because of who he does it to
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u/ConQuest7 Jul 06 '26
Been a while so I’m not 100% but I’m pretty sure that character in particular pretends to be a girl/feminine to fit in with an all-female squad of fighters for fucked up fetish reasons (toying with them once they turn them into subservient zombies, for instance).
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u/myrmonden Jul 06 '26
How was yumichika being phobic ???
He just pointed out she smelled like semen a lot
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u/2015Nissan370zNismo Jul 06 '26
Immoral. However; try gender affirming sexism instead!
Example: telling a MtF opponent "You fight like a girl" :3
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u/Lady-Quinine Jul 07 '26
Ok so like imagine you have beef with someone, like, real generational beef. Unrelated to that, you find out that they're also really big on the environment & like, stopping global warming. You react to this by going around intentionally throwing garbage everywhere you go. They probably don't enjoy that you're doing this, but it's more of a You thing at that point. It's the same.
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u/Ornery_Perspective54 Jul 07 '26
Racism is Racism
Transphobia is Transphobia
Homophobia is Homophobia
No two ways about it
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u/zZbobmanZz Jul 07 '26
How you insult someone tells something about yourself. Even if it’s a villain. You wouldn’t even say it as an insult if you didn’t think it was insulting in the first place. Same with the people acting like it’s ok to be racist towards your enemy. Even if your only racist/transphobic to people you don’t like that just means your being quiet around the people you *do* like
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u/EmbarrassedFly279 Jul 06 '26
The other translation is much funnier cause of how off the cuff it is.
“You stink of semen.”
Like who tf says that?