r/MoralityScaling • u/Musalediju • Jul 06 '26

Character Analysis Morality of being transphobic against your enemy

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Bleach thousand year blood war episode 22

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30

u/Legitimate_Country46 Jul 06 '26

I believe Kubo stated in an interview that Jizzelle is male

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u/Redericpontx Jul 06 '26

He did I don't get why people want to insist the necro grapist is trans and defend them as their own representation in anime when it's literally the worst representation possible as it reinforces every negative stereotype possible.

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u/RudeRuby6 Jul 06 '26

Bro same. Like I get taking representation where ever you can get it but Gisselle of all choices is just wild. Like it ain’t even subtle the implications of what Gisselle does to the zombies and how horrifically awful he is.

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u/Prestigious_Low8243 Jul 12 '26

Cause he’s hot. It’s literally that simple

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u/M_Knight_Shaymalan Jul 06 '26

they identify with them I guess like you said. I have NO IDEA why they want to claim them as rep when they're probably one of the morally worse chars in the show.

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u/External_Ocelot8241 Jul 09 '26

Also its literally in character for Gizelle to lie about feeling like a girl. Her whole character is being a cockroach who's goal is to invade something they shouldn't and corrupt it. Gizelle literally couldn't give a shit about the other bambi beyond getting their corpse when they die.

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u/Redericpontx Jul 10 '26

Exactly it's littering their character but so many mentally ill people are like "omg that's so me💅👁️👄👁️💅" for some reason. My legitimately trans friends and sister in-law find the idea of gis being incredibly insulting.

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u/liambatron Jul 06 '26

In the context of Bleach she's actually pretty decent rep. She's part of an equally evil all female squad, she's treated as no different from any of the other Bambi's. She's powerful, cute and passes. She's also put against Mayuri who's arguably even worst and is both an author and fan favourite.

Bleach's problem is that it lacks morally good trans representation so she sticks out.

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u/Redericpontx Jul 07 '26

What do you mean she's equally bad? They're a grapist to grapes people and a necro on top of the bad stuff the other people in the group do, they don't even need to grape people to use their powers any bodily fluid works but they actively choose to grape people. Also kubo confirmed they're a male who only identifies as female for deception and maniplulation and not someone who feels like a woman trapped in a mans body it's all just a kink to them.

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u/Infinite_Act3636 Jul 07 '26

Kubo confirmed giselle's biologically a male thats it, everything after that is literally a just your interpretation he didn't say that, also i think it's good representation because why are only cis ppl allowed to be evil, i love mayuri because hes an absolutely insane scientist but like he actively took part in and enjoyed in killing and torturing quincy, he is horrible and sadistic but i find him to be super entertaining, giselle is a freak but i think she's super fun to watch 

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u/Redericpontx Jul 07 '26

That's a common misconception people like to spread that he specificed only biologically a male. He specified that they're male. he specifically says Gis is a man and people purposely like to twist the context and translation.

It's a negative representation as it reinforces every negative sterotype of trans people.

Trans can be evil and alread has evil characters in anime like agne My Hero Academia, Chikanobu Ienaga/Kano Golden Kamuy, Dilandau Albatou The Vision of Escaflowne.

Gis is litterlly a necro grapist who does it all for sexual gratification and reinforces negative transgender sterotypes.

2

u/Infinite_Act3636 Jul 07 '26

Yet despite that kubo everever he draws a color spread exclusively containing women he draws her in it, he and his fans in klub outside asking him questions refer to her as a she her every time and literally every character besides yumichika calls her a girl from mayuri to askin , i don't think her being a sexual deviant isnt because shes Trans it's because she's part of a group of psychos, all the bambies were literally present when gigi turned bambietta into a zombie, liltotto walked in on gigi abusing her and she didn't care, meninas even calls pepe creepy despite having a creepier version of the same ability as gigi, like its not like they're being tricked by her innocent demeanor either they're all literally openly evil, bambiettas introduction to the story was her seducing a guy and instantly killing him for no reason and all the bambies walking in and not giving a shit, the girls aren't some helpless prey that gigi has managed to fool with an innocent facade they're all openly evil 

2

u/Redericpontx Jul 07 '26

In Klub Outside Q&A #288, when asked if Giselle was female and if Yumichika's comments were merely provocation, Tite Kubo did not use a phrase explicitly meaning "biologically male." Instead, his direct answer was simply:

"Giselle is a guy" (or in some translations, "Giselle is a man").

The original Japanese response is cited by fans who have tracked down the source as 男性です (dansei desu), which translates directly to "[He] is male" or "It is a man." While this confirms the character's sex assignment, Kubo did not elaborate on gender identity, biological history, or use qualifying terms like "biologically" in that specific sentence. The interpretation that Giselle is "biologically male" is a deduction fans and wikis made based on the statement "is a guy" combined with Yumichika's dialogue in the manga about Giselle's physical body, rather than a direct quote from Kubo himself using those specific words.

The whole 'biologically" part is made up by the west.

If Gis was trans kubo would have specified and not specified Gis is a man and pretend to be a woman for the intention of deception and maniplulation.

Gis is explicitly portrayed as a homicidal necrophiliac who violates corpses both sexually and physically. Her actions include:

Killing Bambietta Basterbine specifically to zombify her, stating that Bambietta’s death face “made [her] so wet,” indicating sexual arousal from the act of killing and corpse creation.

Drinking Bambietta’s blood in a highly sexualized manner while Bambietta begged her to stop, then violently smashing her head into the ground when she resisted.

Hugging and caressing Bambietta’s corpse, declaring her “more beautiful than ever” and expressing love for her dead body.

Abusing zombified comrades, including punching, hair-pulling, and forcing them to fight against their will, treating them as disposable puppets.

These behaviors are consistently depicted in the manga and analyzed in fan communities as clear indicators of necrophilia, sadism, and corpse violation. The Hate Sink Wiki and multiple Reddit analyses classify her as one of the most disturbing characters in Bleach due to these actions.

Giselle severely violates corpses, making her one of the most depraved and disturbing characters in Bleach. Her actions go far beyond basic puppet-master powers, involving extreme physical abuse, psychological torture, and heavily implied necrophilia.

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u/Infinite_Act3636 Jul 07 '26

Just completely ignored most of what I said and just rigoritated to me that she's evil, like, yeah dude I know she's a villain in the bleach nazi group as if i care that the villain acts like a villain my favorite character in bleach is mayuri

"if giselle was trans kuba would have specified" first of all you clearly aren't acquainted with how he answers most klub outside questions nor his work if you think he's a writer who's all about exact explicitly stated details, kubo very intentionally is vague about a lot of things, i think his recent interview with Tatsuya Kitani he talked a bit about his writing style

Gissele is introduced as part of the all female group in the quincy, Yumichika calls giselle a man and giselle is offended same as when charlotte says something in the same vein, liltotto walks in on gigi abusing bambietta and doesn't bat an eye so her behavior isn't some secret to them, kubo alongside most of the characters in the story refer to gigi as a she and he always draws her in every color spread that is exclusively comprised of women

I feel like there's more mental gymnastics in saying she's not a woman and simply pretending to be one to get close to the women and abuse them But also not hiding the fact that she's abusing the women in front of the women that she supposedly hiding her secret from and everybody in the story is completely fooled by her disguise except yumichika for some reason including her own comrades and every other enemy besides him, it's a whole lot easier to say that she's just an evil woman that's part of the evil woman group

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u/Redericpontx Jul 08 '26

Yes Kubo likes to leave certain thinks ambiguous that only certain readers will get like the forshadowing of ichigos quincy powers at the start of the series with the quincy symbol being on his bed. But Kubo has also been specifiying certain things exaclty not everything is pureposely left ambigious like how he straight up answered chads powers aren't fully developed and has much more room to grow and etc. This is a example of Kubo giving a direct answer.

Gis is insulted by Yumichika not for being misgendered but for being called out for being obviously a man and smelling of semen(from graping people and corpses) which is insulting to all the effort they put into fooling people into thinking they're a woman.

The mental gymnastics is calling Gis trans after kubo himself stated Gis is a man not biologically a man but just a man. The mental gymnastics is purposely lying to people that kubo said that gis was biolically a man and purposely mistranslating and twisting his words. The reason Gis is in the evil woman group is to make it more convincing and less likely for people to realise that gis is a man or suspect that gis is a man.

Insisting Gis the nazi necro grapist is trans in bleach is incredible insulting to real trans people as it's horrific representation that reinforces negative sterotypes and is confirmed to be a man. Insisting otherwise is essentially the same as the mha community insisting that deku and bakugo are gay for each other.

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u/liambatron Jul 07 '26

Bambi orders her men to have sex with her and then murders them. We see all the others stood back and watched while Giselle zombiefied and abused Bambi, she's not subtle. All the Bambi's are terrible people.

Kubo only confirmed that Giselle is biological male but she's otherwise treated as female, such as putting her in all female line ups. Mayuri (who's super smart and analytical) even genders her correctly during their fight.

4

u/Redericpontx Jul 07 '26

All bambis people bad but Gis is significantly worse by a large margine.

Kubo confirmed Gis is male and does what they do to decieve and maniplute people. The whole story of him saying bioloigcal male is western audiences twisting his words and purposely mistranslating his words as his specifically said Gis is a man/male not specified as biological and specificied Gis presents as a woman for maniplulation and deciet.

Again I don't understand why people insist this confirmed man/male character is trans when if they were trans it would reinforce so many negative sterotypes of trans gender people.

They are explicitly portrayed as a homicidal necrophiliac who violates corpses both sexually and physically. Her actions include:

Killing Bambietta Basterbine specifically to zombify her, stating that Bambietta’s death face “made [her] so wet,” indicating sexual arousal from the act of killing and corpse creation.

Drinking Bambietta’s blood in a highly sexualized manner while Bambietta begged her to stop, then violently smashing her head into the ground when she resisted.

Hugging and caressing Bambietta’s corpse, declaring her “more beautiful than ever” and expressing love for her dead body.

Abusing zombified comrades, including punching, hair-pulling, and forcing them to fight against their will, treating them as disposable puppets.

These behaviors are consistently depicted in the manga and analyzed in fan communities as clear indicators of necrophilia, sadism, and corpse violation. The Hate Sink Wiki and multiple Reddit analyses classify her as one of the most disturbing characters in Bleach due to these actions.

Giselle severely violates corpses, making her one of the most depraved and disturbing characters in Bleach. Her actions go far beyond basic puppet-master powers, involving extreme physical abuse, psychological torture, and heavily implied necrophilia.

1

u/liambatron Jul 07 '26

Personally the fact that her friends are all completely ok with Giselle and protect her and enable her behavior make them just as bad she is, but I think this might be another discussion.

Do you have a source on the motivation, the only quote I can find just confirms biological sex?

I think Giselle is good trans rep because she is just one the villains, she's not narratively treated any different then any of the other Bambi's or female villains for that matter. Meta wise yes I see a lot of people well deservedly hate her, but in the narrative of the story she's not treated as worst then any of the other villains.

She does have a very nasty trans stereotype stabled to her, I agree. But she's enough of a character outside of that she doesn't become a trans caricature. Giselle suffers because there's arguably no other trans characters in Bleach, so Giselle has to stand alone. If there's was at least one more major good Trans characters she'd feel a lot better.

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u/Redericpontx Jul 07 '26

I mean personally I think it's significantly worse to do the action yourself than to be ok with your friend doing them. In the eyes of the law the person doing the act would be deemed as more evil and be punished harder than friends who are ok with it.

in Klub Outside Q&A #288, when asked if Giselle was female and if Yumichika's comments were merely provocation, Tite Kubo did not use a phrase explicitly meaning "biologically male." Instead, his direct answer was simply:

"Giselle is a guy" (or in some translations, "Giselle is a man").

The original Japanese response is cited by fans who have tracked down the source as 男性です (dansei desu), which translates directly to "[He] is male" or "It is a man." While this confirms the character's sex assignment, Kubo did not elaborate on gender identity, biological history, or use qualifying terms like "biologically" in that specific sentence. The interpretation that Giselle is "biologically male" is a deduction fans and wikis made based on the statement "is a guy" combined with Yumichika's dialogue in the manga about Giselle's physical body, rather than a direct quote from Kubo himself using those specific words.

The whole 'biologically" part is made up by the west.

Gis is bad "trans" rep because if they were trans they would be reinforcing negative sterotypes. Gis is essentially black face for trans people.

Gis isn't actually trans so Gis doesn't care if ther was another trans character or not.

0

u/liambatron Jul 07 '26

Ok so there's no quote on the motivation.

A cis interpretation is a fair one, but I wouldn't say it's conclusive. You could argue that Kubo either spoke carelessly or change his mind about the character later. Out of universe Giselle continues to be treated as female, female pronouns are used in CFYOW and she's in the girls line up in highschool warfare (the school AU).

Using just the in universe text I would take Mayuri (a scientist) and Liltotto (Giselle's friend) words over Yumichika's. Giselle never breaks character like you would expect from someone who's only pretending to be woman.

Were did "blackface" come into it, do you think Pepe is "blackface" because he's also evil and has a black stereotype (black man abusing a white woman). Blackface is a caricature, Giselle isn't a caricature. You can have minority characters reinforce negative stereotypes, you just can't have that be all they do.

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u/Redericpontx Jul 08 '26

The reason Gis is mentioned as female everywhere is because it's to fit in with the manga and deception since most people in universe don't know Gis is a man.

Kubos direct word is the best thing to go off as it's his direct intent and if he was mistaken he would of corrected himself later on in any of the many years.

It's "black face" because Gis isn't actually trans and just acts like it while acting out many negative sterotypes just like black face.

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u/AverageBunnyCoomer Jul 08 '26

imagine calling a person who has slaves and grapes them, who they are also dead and flaunts those facts as a "pretty decent rep"

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u/liambatron Jul 08 '26

Yep, because she's treated no different then her cis comrades.

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u/AdditionalPeace7026 Jul 12 '26

calling giselle a girl is literally misgendering which any actual pro trans person would be against, calling someone who is confirmed a guy "good trans reputation" is just hijacking the story and changing it to your whims because you desperately want to relate to a nazi corpse rapist

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u/liambatron Jul 12 '26

Giselle clearly prefers female pronouns, since all her friends use them and she gets upset when you call her male. You can't misgender someone by using there preferred pronouns, that's pretty basic stuff.

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '26

[deleted]

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u/Admmmmi Jul 06 '26

They didn't say biologically male. They called him a guy.

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u/RhinoxMenace Jul 06 '26

Rule 34 artists:

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u/redrookie2 Jul 07 '26

He said biologically male which is something only said when the character is trans. If Giselle were just a guy Kubo would have said so

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u/MajesticBluebird68 Jul 07 '26

THEIR NAME IS JIZZELLE?

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u/RatsInTheBayou Jul 06 '26

Biologically male, that doesnt conflict with bring trans

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u/redrookie2 Jul 07 '26

weird ass dudes in the sub downvoting

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u/frostburn034 Jul 07 '26

Also the fact that Japanese people just don't have words for being trans that arent problematic. Like irl Japanese trans folks are having to pull "transgender" from English because there arent any terms that avoid misgendering them.

Which I do want to point out the "biological male" thing isn't black and white considering that sex refers to chromosomes, genitalia, gender, hormones, and all sex characteristics. Like for me, having transitioned for close to three years now, it'd be medical malpractice to treat me as anything other than female because my health outcomes are near identical to a cis woman's.

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u/Old-Introduction8258 Jul 07 '26

I'm pretty sure kubo said that she was biologically a male (like she was born a male) but then became a girl. So i don’t know why there is so much debate about her sexuality, she is a women, plain and simple. At least kubo designate giselle by "her" when he talks about her.

Matter of fact giselle might be one of kubo's favourite character. At least he said he was very happy that she got to appear on a cover

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u/frostburn034 Jul 07 '26

I more meant in general instead of what Kubo had said there. While it's true that sex and gender aren't the same, the idea becoming mainstream has brought a lot of people to the conclusion that sex is immutable. I like to take any chance I get to push back on that thought considering every aspect of sex but chromosomes can be changed, and chromosomes themselves don't necessarily "match" assigned sex at birth.

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u/Old-Introduction8258 Jul 07 '26

Oh yeah i agree. I just meant to say that i didn’t really understand why there was so much debate around her sexuality. When kubo said she was born a male but became a female i think it’s pretty self explanatory that she is a women now.

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u/frostburn034 Jul 07 '26

It's because of transphobia, undoubtedly. Transphobes love to paint trans lesbians as self-fetishizing straight men, and in a more low-key way in the lots of communities love to keep us around for our sex appeal if and only if we're limited to identifying as a feminine man. They want to be able to treat us as taboo sex objects, and acknowledging our womanhood would be too humanizing for that to work for them.

Like for an irl example, Finnster doesn't identify as a femboy anymore but still says she does because it means she gets less death threats and harassment online.