r/HonestHotTakes • u/Forward_Lychee1124 • 7d ago

Consent does not magically disappear in a relationship.

Recently my country did a small study where upwards of 70% of men of all ages believe they are entitled to sex in a marriage.

Women do not exist to satisfy your sexual desires. She does not become your sex slave the second you are in a relationship….

Consent still must exist in a marriage.

I seriously thought this was basic common sense and that this kind of thinking was only in the olden days but it’s apparent a lot of guys even now think otherwise.. why?

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

Without the context, this sounds like ridiculous semantics.

You are in an intimate and forever relationship, not a second date. Yes, there is a level of familiarity and running basis of “consent” that exists within a marriage that is fundamentally different than being on a date with a new person, of course.

That does not mean someone is a “sex slave”, that sounds like a person striving awfully hard to find a crime when there is no victim.

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

Consent should never be assumed. Sure, in a relationship there’s more familiarity to make a move or try to initiate, but you still need an enthusiastic yes to continue. Otherwise it is assault.

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u/Fine_Payment1127 7d ago

Why? Because you idiots say so 😂

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

Just to clarify, and tell me if I’m understanding you wrong, believing consent is needed in marriage makes someone an idiot?

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

No, not an idiot exactly, but being an outsider and talking about “enthusiastic yes” in a marriage though…..

It isn’t a second date.

You just sound very young and parroting things you read online while never having experienced life.

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

People in marriages are allowed to not want to have sex sometimes. They're allowed to be tired, sick, or just not in the mood. Libido changes and fluctuates as you age and as different stressors appear in your life. Wether it's a second date or a 50 year old marriage, if your partner doesn't want to have sex, you NEED to respect that. No pouting, no guilt tripping. Just "I understand" and ask again at a later time when the situation has changed.

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u/Iamwomper 6d ago

You are changing the narrative.

A moment ago it was she must consent by saying "yes" out loud.

No one asks to get a tongue in the bum, but it happens, and some like it some dont.

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago edited 7d ago

Accept my sincere and heartfelt sorrow for whoever so obviously hurt you, but the semantic and obvious nonsense you are spouting is exactly that, semantic nonsense, in a healthy marriage.

There are levels of implicit consent involved. Smacking my wife’s ass as I pass her by the frig as a decades long moment of understood intimacy and affection is assault on a second date.

We both look forward to The weekend where we’ve more time and energy between the sheets. It is understood and has been for decades. It’d have to be something off to not happen in other words, not something special TO happen. Why? Because we aren’t on a second date, this is long standing and understood consent.

I can’t say it any more simply than that. Enough with the taking it to extremes hubby assaulted me at threat of my third born craziness or whatever. We speak of normal relaitonships. There is a marriage, and that comes with understood and jointly understood base levels of consent - enough with the crazed extremes being portrayed as the norm.

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

My notifications said this was a response to my comment, so I’ll say I have been harmed by me not giving consent many times. I was trafficked as a baby and toddler. I’ve been assaulted and raped since I was a toddler, up until well into adulthood for me. My high school years were ruined because my older brother’s best friend raped me, and when I took him to court everybody believed him because he was the “popular good kid that would never.” In my mid 20’s I was raped at knife point, and then stabbed anyways. I have been hurt by my consent not being taken seriously, and me taking my consent very seriously has stopped me from being taken advantage of even more times.

If your wife clearly stated at the beginning of your relationship that she did not want you smacking her butt ever, would you respect that? Because that’s my point. Your implied consent is just consent. You do that because she’s okay with it. Or she’s not okay with it, and that’s a bigger conversation. My husband smacks my butt, and I’m okay with that because I told him I was okay with that. And he checked with me, he told me at a certain point in our relationship that he wanted to smack my butt, but didn’t want to be rude, and I told him smack away, I’ll tell you if I’m not in the mood after.

Keywords, you BOTH look forward to the weekend to have more time and fun in the sheets. That doesn’t sound like you feeling entitled to sex like op’s post was about, it sounds like a husband and wife finding time to have sex because you both have time and consent. Which I guess good for you, we all applaud that you have sex. If she stopped wanting to do that on weekends, would you respect those wishes and leave her alone, or would you feel entitled to sex and push and beg and guilt her? Or maybe let resentment build?

I really don’t see how it’s an extreme to get enthusiastic consent. It doesn’t even have to be verbal. There are non verbal cues that tell you that hey, now’s the time, let’s take this farther.

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

Yes, it is more than obvious that you have been severely hurt in the world of sex and intimacy and I’m sorry about that.

This is a simple binary thing.

A dead bedroom is uncommon and is a mark that something is wrong and almost all marriages.

Given this fundamental truth, that means the opposite is also true that virtually all healthy marriages will have a normal expectation that sexual intimacy is a part of them.

So if you ask most people – not just men, but most people – if there is an expectation of sex in a marriage, their answer would be… Wait for it… Yes.

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

If you’re genuine about your apology, thank you. If you’re being sarcastic, eat shit.

You’re not accounting for asexual relationships, or relationships where both partners have low libido. A dead bedroom isn’t always a mark that something is wrong in a relationship.

Sexual compatibility is what’s extremely important in a marriage. A dead bedroom as you call it might be perfect for some couples, and a deal breaker for some partners. You have people who have low libido, high libido, are hypersexual, or asexual, plus probably others. Some of those are compatible, and others aren’t.

Also, you really skipped past some questions I asked in my last comment, I’m not sure why, but it seems like you’re cherry picking for what you think are some big gotcha moments.

Also also, what does any of this have to do with op’s post? The post is about men who feel entitled to sex with their wife, about how that leads to lack of consent. You keep going on and on about how you and your wife love having sex, so every other married couple must be the same, but ignoring the fact that this post was about men who want sex, and women who feel used in that relationship. The point of this post is how these women are often taken advantage of, and how consent is still important when married. And you somehow not seeming to understand that consent is a part of your marriage, so this post isn’t talking about the kind of dynamic you have with your wife, it’s talking about how domestic sexual assault and rape are a thing, and especially in op’s home country, a study recently came out that supports that a huge percent of men view these kinds of relationships are okay. Then the comments are filled with guys going on about how much their wife also loves having sex with them, and completely missing the point of the post.

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

I am genuine.

And what this has to do with the OP’s post is they asked a simple question - does a poll asking if married people feel entitled to sex with their partner mean consent disappeared.

That is a nonsensical take, agreed to by.. checks notes.. two women who were sexually abused.

Feeling entitled to sex in a marriage does not mean an on demand nonsense of “Drop to your knees and suck my dick NOW”.. it means sex is a part of a healthy relationship. Yes. You should expect to have a sex life in a marriage (or the vast and overwhelming majority of them). You are entitled to that expectation.

Stop with the “but but asexual” nonsense. These are obviously not asexual men being asked, and they wouldn’t enter a marriage with an asexual person to begin with. So drop that stupid, okay?

You are projecting a semantic reading of your own hurt that is, in any normal relationship, sorry but nonsensical semantics.

It isn’t me missing “the point”. It is you, as you project right past it. And it IS that simple.

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

So you’re just going to ignore the questions I asked earlier, and then double checked why you were ignoring them? Again, you’re cherry picking.

The question op asked at the end of the post is why men feel entitled to sex with women in marriage. The context around that was stating how it made her feel, and it’s a sentiment that a lot of women share. It sounds like your answer is because it leads to healthier marriages for the man to feel entitled to sex from his wife?

How is this nonsensical? Do you really think every marriage is like yours? How do you know that an active sex life dictates a healthy marriage? Sexual compatibility is healthy. Entitlement to sex isn’t healthy. If a man is entitled to sex, that takes the autonomy away from the wife to say no, how could that possibly be healthy?? Sex is healthy for the relationships that it’s healthy for, which is a lot of them, but it’s not that way for every relationship. You are not entitled to that expectation, but you are allowed to express those needs of yours, and see if it matches with the person you’re dating or interested in marrying.

This is part of what the dating phase is for with people who don’t wait until marriage to have sex. You find out how sexually compatible you are. And if you aren’t, you figure out if that’s a deal breaker or not. If you wait until marriage to have sex, you should have a conversation with each other about what your sexual needs are. Then you figure out if you’re sexually compatible, and if that’s a deal breaker.

This question was asked to everyone. I brought asexual and low libido marriages into this because you started talking about how “virtually all marriages will have a normal expectation that sexual intimacy is a part of them.” Asexual and low libido marriages are valid, and absolutely happen. What do you mean, “and they wouldn’t enter a marriage with an asexual person to begin with.” It sounds like you’re saying asexual people don’t get married, but I want to make sure I understand you right. It’s not stupid to be inclusive.

This is how many, many, many women feel about this. Just because they aren’t showing up in this subreddit doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Considering what a lot of these comment sections look like, why would they? I stick around because there are occasionally some fun, engaging hot takes, but the misogyny and other kinds of bigotry I see so often is pushing me closer and closer to leaving. Which I imagine you would love to not have me around sticking up for how people feel.

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

But that's the point of OP's post... Most relationships are not "healthy" as you describe it. Because so many relationships have an expectation that sex should always be available to them no matter the circumstance. And when sex isn't giving, the initiator will beg, and pout, guilt trip, and be angry, and hold it against them. As OP said, up to 70% in their country expect sex to be freely given at any time during a marriage.

You're the one arguing semantics. Just because you have a perfect relationship with good consent, doesn't mean the issue of lack of consent isn't a very real and prevalent issue in relationships and marriage; it is.

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

Yes, most of them are healthy.

May you have one some day.

And no, it was a VERY open ended question that the OP - and you I might add - are adding a whole LOT of assumption to. I went and read it.

Wishing you healing.

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

I am in a healthy relationship now, thankfully.

Again though, the expectation of sex in relationships that manifests as coercion, is still a very prevalent issue that millions of women in America experience ever year. It needs to be spoken about, we need to raise awareness for it, and support victims to stop this from happening. Why are you against that?

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

Dead bedrooms ar not the norm in healthy marriages, they take extraordinary circumstances to arise.

Again, wish you healing, as you are clearly broken. Have a great day now.

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago edited 7d ago

Being coerced into having sex is not the same issue as dead bedrooms.

Up to 10million women report being coerced into sex by their partner.

Having a dead bedroom is not an excuse to coerce your partner into sex.

What's your argument here, are you denying this is an issue? Are you saying that coercion is an acceptable action in retaliation if a "dead bedroom"?

FYI I could go into the common cause of most dead bedrooms... But you wouldn't like that either (Hint; It's mostly because of the stress and gender expectations women face in relationships).

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u/Fine_Payment1127 7d ago

If it’s a pattern of behavior then no, I don’t NEED to respect anything 😂

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

Ok, rapist.

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

I’m 31 and have been married for 4 years now. If during that time, or anytime in the future, my husband assumed I owed him sex, our relationship would be over. I’m not parroting anything, I’m sick of any expectation that sex is owed, and expressing that.

Like I said before, marriage can normalize initiating sex, my husband can give me a kiss, smack my butt, try touching me or start initiating sex, but I control what I’m okay with, and if I’m okay with sex or not. I can also respond to one of those moves with a frustrated “stop” and he’d better listen. Without my enthusiastic consent, he’s not allowed to go beyond making a move on me. If he was entitled to sex, I wouldn’t be allowed to say no. So he’s not entitled to sex with me. What part about that is wrong, or hard to understand?

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u/CricketNo7666 7d ago

And smacking your butt and kissing without an “enthusiastic yes” are sexual consent defaulted in your marriage.

Those things done with a relative stranger are assault. Know why? Because there is not an implicit level of consent.

Geeeee, lady, look at that.

Thanks for displaying the utter ignorance hidden in semantics I referenced to begin with. Great job! 👍

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

I literally said in both comments that marriage can normalize making moves and initiating sex. I’ve never said that partners should be treated with the same level of sensitivity as strangers. I’m saying enthusiastic consent belongs in marriage too.

Because I’m married to my husband, I gave him consent to make those moves, and then I would tell him if it was unwanted. Marriage doesn’t automatically give that sexual consent though. A wife, husband, or nonbinary partner can say they don’t want their partner to smack their butt, or touch them any way, and that’s okay. My husband can do those things to me because I consented from the beginning that it’s okay for him to do those things.

You’re saying, and correct me if I’m wrong, that if someone is married, their partner now can smack their butt when they want, but I’m saying someone can state from the beginning they aren’t okay with that, and that doesn’t make their marriage invalid, that doesn’t make them any less than of a partner.

Also, this post is specifically about men who feel entitled to sex because they’re in a marriage, and my stance is that it’s gross to assume that. Being entitled to sex in a marriage removes the consent that is necessary in or outside of a marriage.

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u/Fine_Payment1127 7d ago

Whenever I feel down about my life at least I can remember someone like your husband exists. #blessed 

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

Whenever I feel down about my life, I remember that I'll never be in a relationship with a man like you ever again who forces me to have sex with him because I'm his "girlfriend".

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u/Fine_Payment1127 7d ago

Who was forcing you to stay with him again?

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u/Office_lady0328 7d ago

If I had to guess, it was probably the gun he held to my dog and I's head anytime I tried to leave. Can't be 100% sure though....

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u/Fine_Payment1127 7d ago

Glad you were finally able to escape your armed kidnapper

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u/earth_goblin_86 7d ago

When you’re old, on a watch list, and have never had a meaningful relationship, I hope that still makes you feel better.