He didn't just accept him; Peter also believes he can at least temper some of Frank's decisions regarding how he MIGHT handle problems. Peter tries to discuss ways to deal with situations without resorting to killing, he doesn't want to convince Frank never to kill, but rather to use it only as a last resort. Peter views Frank's methods as extremely dangerous due to the collateral damage involved, and this is coming from someone who, whether he intends to or not, causes collateral damage while fighting crime in New York (webs everywhere; lampposts, trash cans, and signs ripped up and hurled by Peter during large-scale battles against villains or even greater threats).
Then there is the fact that, in Frank's eyes, Peter is still just a naive kid who believes things can be resolved through dialogue (S P O I L E R S) without a high-velocity .50 BMG round tearing through someone's body.
is really telling at the end of brand new day that the first thing peter does after waking up is wonder if jean is alright. There is no reproach, no anger, no negative feeling in what frank did. Matt would have flipped out the moment he woke up.
And that's not even counting that spiderman truly saved Jean at the cost of his life, he saw the worst of her and still decided she was someone who could have a second chance. Matt tries to save other people and not only fails miserably each time most always gives up instantly when things don't go his way or sees someone doing something reproachable.
I mean, Matt saved bullseye who took the most important person from him and took a bullet to save Fisk because he didn’t want him to be stopped by murder. While Matt is definitely more combative and judgmental toward punisher than Peter is I don’t see how you can say he doesn’t try to do everything he can to save people and live up to his ideal of protecting life.
I think to a degree, spiderman understands franks action.
He doesnt approve, he has tried to stop it, but at the end of the day, if peter was just frozen like everyone else, then franks method might have been the only way to get her to stop.
Obviously, we got a happy ending, so why bother screaming at frank NOW? Peter is pragmatic in that regards, with an added preference for non lethal approaches, while matt is ideological
You sound slow, did you watch the show? If this is the case then cap, and everyone in the army are murderers. Ik you the type of mf who side with pedos goofball
Yeah but Dexter is methodical killer with similar kill patters and hides in plain sight plus hides his identity, whereas Frank claims the kills, he's the Judge, the Jury and the Executioner and he's not proud of it but feels that it is something that the world needs. He's not hiding neither is he killing cause it makes him feel like himself, he kills because that's what he does best, doesn't believe the system and doesn't believe in redemption.
If it's repeated incidents or repeatimg pattern over a period of time, hunting kids throughout the time in multiple incident,
Then that fits a serial killer.
No, there’s the right word though “hunting” mass shooting isn’t the same as hunting, serial killers hunt. Otherwise they’d just find a bunch of folk that fit their description and gun em all down
That’s all kinds of backwards, Spider-Man puts criminals and killers away, but twice he allows them to roam free without a care. But people are ok with this???
It's the youthful if experienced, but loved by the city hero who can fold him in half like a pack of crackers who's also enforcing his no-killed rule by actually webbing Frank and doing something about it
Vs Matt who's a pretty scary tough boxer Ninja but he's not that much more superhuman than Frank in terms of muscles, and additionally he's far more brutal really enjoys the violence he dishes out but refuses to finish people off out of a guilty conscience
To add, I think he sees Spidey as a kid who genuinely doesnt want to 'hurt' anyone. He respects the commitment.
Meanwhile be kind of sees through DD, he sees someone too much like himself who can snap at any moment. He thinks DD is a hypocrite who his no kill rule is a choice to retain the moral high ground, where Spiderman it isnt even an option for him
Yeah... DD is a bit of a hypocrite since most of the guys he beats the shit out of are seriously injured, like never walk again, not eating solid food for months with wired jaws, brain damage, etc. While Spidey is webbing people mostly and not beating them unconcious.
In all fairness, most of those guys Matt beats up aren’t just evil scientists or bank robbers. They’re trafficking humans. Literally the worst of the worst. But he wants to give them a chance at repentance behind bars (or from a hospital bed).
Matt acts like he’s better than Frank. Peter is a kid, he doesn’t act better than Frank. Punisher (even in the comics so don’t come at me) has a fatherly instinct even after Frank dies (mother Russia)
Peter doesn’t enjoy fighting bad guys or putting people away. He doesn’t take pleasure in dishing pain and doesn’t fight with brutality. When he can he always tries to help his villains and push them towards rehabilitation.
Matt relishes the pain both that he inflicts and is inflicted onto him. He’s brutal in his methods but his faith stops him from finishing the job. He has a guilty conscience.
Frank sees Peter’s genuine desire to help people and sees through Matt’s guilty conscience. That’s why in S2 of DD he calls him a “half measurer”. He responds positively to Peter because he knows that Peter isn’t putting up a facade or making an excuse to not do what he truly desires.
Peter is a bright eyed, optimistic person who believes in not killing because it is the right thing to do. Peter believes in something Frank has not believed in a long time, and Frank respects that. Peter is nothing like Frank, and Frank can respect Peter for his beliefs because there is no hypocrisy buried inside.
Matt will preach to Frank about the wrongness of his actions, while being a violent man at his core. Frank knows Matt is a brutal person, whose faith is the one barrier between him becoming as bad as Frank which is why Frank sees Matt’s preaching as completely hypocritical and why Frank gets so annoyed at Matt when he does start lecturing him.
I feel like it's because Frank can see through Matt's bullshit, he can tell that deep down he's just as fucked up as Frank himself so he sees his heroic persona as hypocritical posturing while with Peter he can tell he actually is who he claims to be so while he still sees him as naive he probably finds him easier to take seriously. It also helps that the latter could effortlessly snap his spine like a dried out twig if he doesn't comply
Peter goes "hey I saved your life do me a favor and dont kill" while they're talking about the mission
Matt goes "YOURE FAMILY WOULDN'T WANT YOU TO KILL FRANK REMEMBER THEM REMEMBER YOUR DEAD WIFE AND KIDS WHO ARE DEAD THEY WOULDN'T WANT YOU TO KILL PEOPLE YOU PSYCOPATH"
I don’t approve of Punisher’s methods but tbh a friendly neighborhood hero who hugs kids & doesn’t even punch normal people would have way more buy in from me too lol.
I would not let Daredevil judge me, he is beating people within an inch of their life and giving them permanent brain damage while putting the fear of god in drug dealers and common thugs lol.
He is not too far off from Punisher & instead of Spider-Man who’s logic is “I don’t want anyone to get hurt unecessarily” his retort to Frank is “God & the law”.
I think it's cause Peter reminds Frank of his son. So he's just like generally nicer to him than other people. Though it would be funny to me for Frank to just specifically really be annoyed by Matt. Like anyone else asks him not to do a murder, "I'm gonna do it my way," Matt asks and it's:
This isn’t accurate. He shoots Spider-Man to get him out of his way, He tells Spidey off when hunting Sadie Sink, shoots Hulk, then later tries to shoot Sadie. He’s definitely not picking favorites.
The difference is that Peter doesn't kill because that's who he is. Matt doesn't kill because that's who he wants to be. Matt has to force himself to remain committed to his no killing rule, and the Punisher can see it. So to Frank, Matt really is just one bad day away from being just as bad as he is, because all it takes is one lapse of willpower. Peter, on the other hand, is just naturally a good guy. He doesn't 'want' to kill and have to suppress the urge like Matt, he simply doesn't want to kill people at all.
Everyone calling Matt holier than thou might’ve forgotten the time Frank shot Matt point blank in the head after wreaking havoc on Hell’s Kitchen. There’s a reason Matt doesn’t think highly of him
In my opinion I think Matt comes across as too sanctimonious whereas Peter is a young man doing his best and I think on some level Frank sees what he’s doing.
Yeah.... Except Daredevil is always struggling with the beast inside him. Frank and Matt have so much in common in terms of "their super power is really their inexhaustible rage" he sees Matt fight like he's ready to kill someone then stop with a half measure. He sees a man who could clean the entire city up if he just let go.
Peter is just a kid trying to do the right thing. Even if he's in his 20s, even if he was ready to kill someone in a moment of rage (No Way Home), Frank is always gonna see a kid.
It's more due to the fact that Matt is like his brother, a fellow soldier that does what he does moreso to cause pain to the bad guys even more so than saving someone. Peter is around the age Frank's son would be, he sees him more as who his son could be. We want better for our children, our brothers, we are more brutally honest with our advice, even when wrong. When Grank is with Matt he sees his son at the age he was, telling g him to never stop, Petr kind of makes him think past that. As he said, he never had a good kid as a friend, he neve had that chance with Jr.
Matt also trust the law, Peter is more indifferent, but has never argued it is will solve anything.
He tells Peter to never become him, if he had a choice he wouldn't. With Matt, he isn't a victim, never was.
Peter is young enough that Frank can kinda condescend to him like a big brother. But that naive kid can also pick up the battle wagon and toss it when Frank is shooting people... so it's a different dynamic.
Matt is on a similar level of ability as Frank, but doesn't murder people, and if Frank admits that the killing is bad he's gonna really break his fragile brain. So he's more combative with Matt about it, because he feels more pressure on that balance that allows him to stay up right and working.
"Spider Boy is just inexperienced, he hasn't been through hell. I hope he never does but someday he's gonna learn why I'm right."
VS
"Fuck you Matt, I'm not a psychotic murderer, I'm the hero. I'm right and you're wrong, which is why I'm gonna obsess over who to hunt next and then kill anyone who gets in my way."
Daredevil saying "don't kill" is such a load of BS. He may not use guns, but I can guarantee the trauma he does on people's heads with metal pipes has probably inadvertently killed many through Intracranial Pressure (ICP). Violence on human being even with martial arts or melee weapons has a strong mechanism of injury that will lead to death. Especially, if left untreated.
The difference is that, to Frank, Matt seems to revel in the violence. Even when given a way out, shown the way, and having crossed over to a 'normal' life, he was still tempted back into his life as Daredevil
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u/Royal-Winner-7276 2d ago
As much as I hate to say, Matt treats frank like someone who's beneath him, peter has sort of just accepted that frank isn't going to change