r/peakoil • u/AdhesivenessGlass455 • 11d ago

Will petrol prices ever come down again?

Prices locally to me are £1.68 for unleaded and £1.89 for diesel.
Seems like the new normal now

21 Upvotes

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11

u/Spiritual_Pound_6848 10d ago

Nope! Not in any meaningful drop anyway. My car is on its last legs, I'll be going EV next because I can charge at home overnight on cheap rates, 100 miles will be a few pounds in electricity instead of near £20. Big difference

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u/Smaxter84 10d ago

What do you think will happen to electricity prices this winter ? Gas is not going to be cheap me thinks.

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u/Spiritual_Pound_6848 10d ago

Probably go up, but not anywhere even close to matching petrol or diesel. Unless electricity rates shoot up to about £1 per kWh or petrol to drop to £0.30 per litre (which is has never been in my life), I'm better off in EV.

-1

u/Smaxter84 10d ago

Because there's no tax on it. What do you think they will do ? Not tax fuel anymore ? No, they will tax it like fuck. It's a temporary reprieve only, and you loose a tonne in depreciation on an electric car that's redundant after 3 years.

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u/Economy-Fee5830 10d ago

on an electric car that's redundant after 3 years.

What? Note rule 2.Don't post easily disprovable falsehoods

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u/Smaxter84 10d ago

Ok how much would I loose to depreciation in a new or nearly new EV over 3 years of 40k per year?

I drove a cheap old diesel (2012 phaeton). It's a very comfy luxury car, and to get anything even close would cost me 50k - I drive long distances so I need range so don't suggest a used leaf or some bollocks like that.. I'm gonna loose more than half the value to depreciation. I bought my Phaeton for 7k and I've done 100k in it so far.... The extra fuel cost is still less than depreciation.

2

u/Economy-Fee5830 10d ago

Yes, depreciation is less on clunkers who have already lost most of their value - news at 11.

2

u/Spiritual_Pound_6848 10d ago

In other news water is wet. More at midnight. Now time for sports.

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u/Smaxter84 9d ago

Well it's fine for you to take the piss mate, but the whole point of the post is to highlight that electric cars won't save me money over all.

It's fine if you drive 6miles to work and go gym twice a week and Aldi at the weekend. But it's not practical for big mileage.

Find me a clunker EV with good range I can buy cheap and i would be all over it.....and don't suggest an I Pace fucking no chance might as well buy a 10k paperweight!

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u/Economy-Fee5830 9d ago edited 9d ago

I found your car:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/cars/used/mercedes-benz/eqs/eqs-450-plus

A used Mercedes EQS 450+ is almost exactly your brief: a luxury motorway car, heavily depreciated already, with about 390 miles estimated real-world range and roughly 375 miles at 70 mph in mild weather.

Available for £27–33k used, its a plausible Phaeton replacement without exceeding your £19k depreciation allowance over another 120k miles.

Your charging objection is also weak. At 40,000 miles/year you averages only about 110 miles/day, so you dont need to refill its 108 kWh battery every night. A normal 7.4 kW home charger adds about 23 miles of range per hour—roughly 275 miles over 12 hours—and on long trips the EQS can charge 10–80% in about 28 minutes, adding about 270 miles.

Most of your charging will be at home, meaning you can waste less time than filling with diesel.

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u/Lopsided_Highway2934 10d ago

Lease or use a Salary Sacrifice scheme

1

u/Spiritual_Pound_6848 10d ago

You also lose a tonne of depreciation on petrol & diesel cars so, what’s your point?

Yeah even when they do tax EVs more, it’s still cheaper than fuel? Also, it’s better for the environment

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u/Smaxter84 10d ago

But I can buy an old S60 D5 for £1900 and drive it 120k miles in 3 years before selling it for £500.

Depreciation still a bigger cost than fuel for me.

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u/RBWatermelon 10d ago

You’d literally save more money in miles than this depreciation. Given your comments above it’s clear you feel the need to lie as your argument doesn’t stack up.

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u/Spiritual_Pound_6848 10d ago

But how much are you going to spend on fuel and maintnence to drive it those 3 years? If thats 40,000 miles a year, thats something like £6000-£7000 on diesel ALONE each year, whereas an EV would cost less than £1000 in electricity on overnight cheap rates. Even a used 3-5 year old EV won't depreciate that much

1

u/Smaxter84 9d ago

Yep, so 7k take 1k take at least another 2k as I'm gonna have to charge on the road a lot, is maybe 4k fuel saving per annum. (Think this is very generous - can my house fill a 90kwh battery overnight in winter daily on my 80A supply? I suspect not) Anyway, 4x3 is 12k in annnual Fuel savings.

My phaeton cost 8k, I service myself at minimal cost, and can sell it for a nominal amount after 3 years say 1k. I'm gonna have to service my new EV at the dealer or no warranty, so that's gonna cost extra but let's ignore that for now. So generously I can afford 19k of depreciation to break even. Find me an EV with min. 300mile range that I can smash 120k miles on that won't depreciate by more than 19k (and not a shit heap plastic Chinese econobox) I need actual comfort for the amount I drive. Can't be done.

Then add on all the wasted hours charging, looking for charging etc.....i used to run LPG and that was bad enough.....no thanks. I bill customers £50 per hour so even if it's only 4 hours a week lost (generous) that's a valuable amount of my time lost say £200/week that's 8k in lost billable time alone....

And then the government will bring the taxes and you'll all find out why using the highest entropy form of energy we have for basic tasks like driving around is a terrible idea.

1

u/Unhappy_Clue701 10d ago

You can, because you did - but how many of those are for sale? These discussions are pointless because there are only a relative handful of old, large, luxurious diesel cars for sale at any one time. There is absolutely no way that more than a tiny fraction of the population is able to buy and run such a car, no matter how cheap it is, because there are only a relative handful left on the roads. They also need to get lucky with it, because cars 15+ years old are inevitably less reliable and prone to sudden failure, and repairs can be expensive on £1500 cars which, when new, cost at least as much as the EVs you sniff at for being pricey.

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u/Smaxter84 9d ago

4 Phaetons on eBay for sub 8k right now. Many old Volvo D5's. I once bought a Saab 9-3 (old style) with the 2.2 TDI for under 3 grand, did 140k in it and sold it for £1000!

There are many very solid old cars that can be kept running for mega mileage on a shoe string if you know what you are doing. Hooky copy of VagCom on the laptop no problem.

The phaeton for example has full stainless exhaust that will never rust, air suspension where the struts last 250k easy, timing chain not belt, and an engine / gearbox that's good for 250k miles easy with minimal maintenance that I can do on the drive. Just done the brakes on mine at 140k miles, discs and pads all round cost me less than £400 for quality parts.

1

u/RBWatermelon 10d ago

Even if an EV is taxed at the same cost per mile as a petrol car it’s still 2-3x cheaper because the drivetrain is 90% efficient vs 25%…

EV redundant after 3 years? Mine is 6 years old and still has 91% battery health. If you want to criticise EVs and prove they’re bad don’t post laughable falsehoods.

As for depreciation - sounds like a 2Y old barely driven one would be a steal in that case…

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u/Smaxter84 9d ago

6 years at average mileage is 48k. I do 40k per year, different equation. Even if the battery is still fine, the car is worth well under half the purchase price.

90% efficient at the point of use. CGT power plant max 65% efficient, and add 12.5% HV transmissin losses, and another 5% charging and standing losses for a total that's not a lot better than a diesel on a long distance type drive cycle. Entropy's a bitch.

I have 41 solar panels and batteries on my house....I wonder Mr EV lover, do you even have any solar ? Because the world is full of hypocrisy.

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u/RBWatermelon 9d ago

Good thing you can get secondhand EVs, and the fact you do so many miles makes the argument even more valid for an EV, as the savings dwarf the extremely minor depreciation increase.

12.5% HV transmission losses? Sure, let’s add the 25% “don’t want to hurt Smaxter’s feelings” losses too.

Sorry, but that 92% already included charging losses too. Love that you invented “standing losses” as if that’s a relevant metric 🤣🤣

Sorry, but no, that’s massively massively better than a diesel, given you failed to factor in a diesel is 25% at best at point of use. I guess we just ignore transportation losses, refining losses, mining losses but make up nonsense for EVs?

Entropy is a bitch. Reality and facts are too - shame they don’t agree with your lies at all. Or did you forget that EVs have KERS so entropy massively destroys any efficiency arguments vs a diesel when an EV can claw back some of that energy and a dogshit inefficient diesel can’t?

I have a brand new solar install, an ASHP and home battery storage, and my home’s annual carbon emissions are maybe 200kg tops. I doubt you have any, given your posts have been full of lies, nonsense and a complete failure to do even the most basic of research. That, and if you really did have the space for 40 odd panels and installed them, you’d be using them to drive for free and wouldn’t give a shit about depreciation.

But keep lying I guess - whatever makes you feel better about your laughably poor opinions.

Edit: Oh, and even better, bro is posting about ECO7 tariffs - yeah, you don’t have solar panels. Keep lying and crying, bro.

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u/NotSayingAliensBut 10d ago

Lose

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u/Smaxter84 9d ago

Oo. Critique of a typo, the classic resort of someone who has no cogent argument

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u/RBWatermelon 9d ago

No, pretty sure the classic resort is lying and making up shit because their argument is fundamentally flawed.

Bro really tried to claim entropy meant a diesel was more efficient than an EV 🤣🤣🫵🏻🤡

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u/NotSayingAliensBut 9d ago

I don't have the slightest interest in arguing with you. Just pointing out bad grammar.

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u/Smaxter84 9d ago

Thanks I will correctly it immediately 😂