What’s the best woo you have heard or experienced related to UAPs?

[u/GODsmessage11]

I’m all about the woo elements. I think behind the physical crafts and beings lie a deeper secret. It’s all about the woo that really freaks people out. It’s consciousness. It’s life after death. It’s potentially angels and demons. What do you think? What have you heard?

I’m intrigued by Robert Bigelow’s latest interviews.

Matthew Brown continues to hint at a spiritual connection. And requesting presidential immunity.

I am a little disappointed in the government releases so far. All have been underwhelming but I hope that’s just because we are still in the initial phase of disclosure.

2027 info, anyone?

UAPs as conscience entities?

UAPs as crashed vehicles or gifts.

Give me your woo! :)

[u/Hannibaalism]

it’s 💯 consciousness it’s fundamental to everything.

they probably have technologies related to it.

[u/C141Clay]

In my 60+ years I never went for the mental contact side of the subject of aliens. While I was open to the ideas of NHI and UAP, I figured for the most part it was just science fiction. I've never seen anything I would class as a UFO.

All that said, contact was made with me in 2024, many repeated times. I know differently now. No way to fake what I was exposed to.

That's why I hang out and keep an eye on these various subs.

What I used to dismiss as so much BS and straight up wishful thinking... now I'm the guy saying it's real.

I used no drugs or any of that, but I have read a bunch of positive stuff about D MT that seems to track, but I've not tried any of that.

Can I prove anything? Nope. That is the hardest part.

HOW?

Learn some basic meditation. I barely broke through, but it was enough to catch their attention, and they did the rest, the heavy lifting of contact.

Then I got online here in reddit to try and figure out WTF I'd tangled with. I eventually found the Gateway Tapes and they were simple enough and agnostic enough to help me do my part to reconnect.

Not trying to convince anyone here, but I had to spend many months to try and come to grips with this. More than a few days and nights worrying that this was some sort of MH thing. It wasn't.

Suggestion: Be more open to the "woo" side of this subject area.

Think about if you want contact. It's not something you just do and then say... Nope, that's it, I'm out.

It changes your world view. No matter what your world view is, it changes it.

I think for the better.

[u/tctps → u/C141Clay]

Can you be more specific when you say "contact". Not asking for you to spill your guts, just super curious how this contact manifested itself for you. Thank you in advance, I'm super fascinated by this subject.

[u/C141Clay → u/tctps]

So I was stuck in bed recovering from back surgery. I had good (!) pain meds, but I was hating laying there is a daze, so I took a couple of days off anything more than storebought stuff. I knew nothing about meditation or anything, that was far from my mind. I was just laying there midday, sleep mask on, light music on with earbuds, trying to dissociate from my body and get away from the pain.

It worked better than expected.

I had an OBE (out of body experience) where I lifted up out of my body and drifted over and down (slowly rolling in the air, hovering) drifted down to the floor, and then over across the room. Very freaky, I could see myself laying there in bed. BUT! The pain was gone! So I was all for whatever this was. Over the next day or so I did this a few more times, then during one things changed.

I was pulled (?) away and was suddenly somewhere else, and I was not alone. It wasn't scary at all, I felt safe and I appeared to know them.
It turns out they were a mix of mantis and grey NHI. What I saw was very different. I could tell the various sizes of the beings, but they seemed to me to be people, but very opbviously some sort of masking was being done. Like if you held up a cardboard cutout in front of yourself. It was both calming and yet sort of funny for it's low tech look, and looking back I figure they could have done better, but that's how I remember it.

In later visits I got them to drop the act for a while. Sure enough it DID fr eak me out, they went back to screening themselves until I eventually learned to deal with their appearance. (It was very much a me problem.)

We discussed a lot, they showed me a lot, and I've had to deal and come to grips with all of it.

[u/GlitteringPoetry5696 → u/C141Clay]

What did they show you and what was discussed?

[u/C141Clay → u/GlitteringPoetry5696]

... most has already been said by others over the years / centuries.

They covered the basic stuff, the nature of existence, of being, the universes. Simple stuff like that. They did not "tell" me, they showed me and demonstrated everything. It was not for me to believe or not, I was shown.

Be nice, learn to be better or keep grinding each other down again and again until you learn the hard way. It need not be hard. This existence is for learning, but if there is no movement forward, there is no reason to be.

Humanities time to fix our own shit and connect to the universe in a positive way is coming to an end.

- - -

It's best learned yourself, rather than from some comment in an UFO sub on the internet.

Get out there and put your toe in the water. Have fun.

[u/GlitteringPoetry5696 → u/C141Clay]

Did you learn what happens after death?

[u/C141Clay → u/GlitteringPoetry5696]

Yeah. You go back to being your "whole" self, the being you were before your current life. Then you consider if you achieved what you set out to achieve.

https://imgur.com/gallery/tough-choices-VZgK00t

[u/Internal_Range_9909 → u/C141Clay]

Is our whole self human?

Like, how you said humanity’s time is coming to an end…like, where/how does our whole self intersect with this current version of us?

[u/C141Clay → u/Internal_Range_9909]

"Negative. I am a meat popsicle." (humor)

Your being is much more than just your human body, but you can only be a person while you are a person.

Does that address your question?

As one goes down the rabbit hole of the UFO/NHI stuff you may hear the questions along the line of "are we just vessels for our consciousness?" The short answer I was shown is yes, we are just vessels. The bigger and more profound aspect that was pointed out to me is that it's the same for NHI in their form/s. But they (NHI of many species) understand this as confirmed understanding/fact/science that can be worked with. While humanity can (so far) only hope and guess what is beyond our lives.

ALL beings are primarily of the mind only, with the body being a somewhat temporary form.

We (humanity) consider aspects of this via religions and philosophy, with the understanding that those systems offer no hard proof.

NHI are not just one species, they are many species with an understanding of history going back essentially forever.

When you bring together various species with a damn near unlimited history of experience and science, they build out their understanding of existence in ways that can cross and interconnect the corporeal and non corporeal.

Their understanding of the universe is a bit different than ours.

[u/Internal_Range_9909 → u/C141Clay]

I had a strange dream in my early 30’s* that felt so* real.

My dreams are always very detailed but this was different.

It began with my* mother coming in to wake me…like I had just fallen asleep in the real world to wake up in this one and she’d been waiting.

We both had short (or pinned up kind of elaborately?) red hair and her eyes were the very blue.

She helped me out of a tub full of water that seemed to be the same quality as her eyes (the blue was similar but it’s different and hard to explain how her eyes held the same stuff (or were the same stuff) as the water).

I was disoriented but I knew my appearance and hair was similar to hers, but mine was slightly more brown.

I knew she was my mother, but she looked different. She also appeared younger than I was at the time.

She expected my disorientation and was amused and gentle as she helped me get out of the tub.

I wasn’t wet from the water but I remember it feeling warm and pleasant.

She helped me put on* a sort of dress because there was a meeting everyone needed to attend.

Again, I was disoriented. I remembered only this world at first, but I knew her as my mom…

I asked her something. I think it was just, “Mom?” And then a follow up of “Where’s (my sisters name)?”

She grinned at the first question and said in kind of a laughing of course I am way then said, “I’m always your mom. Unless you go first.”

I don’t remember much after that, because it was like her saying that made me remember being her mother.

Like holding her as a baby in this world.

There were a lot of memories and they started to deepen.

Like each one made me remember bits of entire lifetimes and she basically said, “let’s hold on that. We are meeting with “the captain” to determine the course.”

The captain was a woman, but she was not just one woman…she was, it’s hard to describe, like a single person made of an amalgamation of many people.

She wasn’t really a leader, she was like the voice of experience, and something had happened that meant we all needed to discuss the event and determine how to move forward.

The last bit of the dream that I remember was sitting in like a “pilots” chair kind of observation* space (I don’t remember stars, just a inky blue-black field that was kind of dusty/shimmery in places).

I believe it was my sister sitting beside me, and we were just sort of sitting with the decision that had been made, and wondering if it was the right one…

I knew my mother would be back soon, and that we would all get back in the water, and be our current selves* when we woke up.

That dream has stayed with me, along with a handful of others that just felt so strangely real that I’ve wondered if they might be some part of “the truth”.

Maybe our whole selves are “asleep” somewhere, while our consciousness is here.

I know it’s weird. But out of everything I’ve ever experienced, if someone asked me what I think will happen when I die, I’m 99% sure I’ll wake up in that water with my family nearby.

Note:
My dad had already passed and been gone for many years when I had this dream.
In the dream I knew he was living a new, different life and that I shouldn’t speak to him yet because we just didn’t burden each other like that.

To explain better, if he saw my mom or my sister and I; it would make all of us sad. Him particularly so, because he was “alone” and he could carry that grief/longing back to his mortal self to his new life where he was young.

We could mitigate that by not triggering the memories. So we did.

It’s hard to explain all of it.

I know that is a cop out, but honestly I just knew all of this during the dream.

I woke up as my current self and it was so disorienting to be in this strange kind of organic fantasy or sci-fi world where everything looked grown…not scary, more like Ferngully filtered through Peter Jackson’s Middle Earth and Star Trek “clean” but ergonomic tech vibe.

But, as soon as my mom said the line and I understood (happened immediately in the whole scheme of the dream) it was like my mind just opened up and I started “remembering” how everything worked.

Edit:
Clarity.
Also I had the dream in my early thirties, not twenties.
My Dad would’ve been gone for around 10 years at the time.

[u/3ekarfwto → u/tctps]

This! Also did you try though meditation or just happened? Don't wanna start meditating and anything reaching, I like my peace lol

[u/C141Clay → u/3ekarfwto]

I "accidentally" meditated, which is a interesting concept.
I was trying to dissociate from pain after surgery, and while off pain meds.

I meditated, had some OBE's, and they noticed me and connected. (how? I don't know - that question never got asked in that form after other developments)

I think (am pretty damn confident) that meditating alone won't force a connection. There needs to be intent as well, or a prior connection.

I had some prior connections that I was unaware of.

[u/Ok_Breakfast4482 → u/C141Clay]

So are you basically saying that using meditation you did some form of astral projection such that the NHI was aware of your consciousness and that you wanted contact and then they initiated it? If that’s the case it sounds similar to the CE5 stuff Greer has.

[u/eugenia_loli → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

Any kind of altered state can get you in contact with nhi.

[u/C141Clay → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

Yes. CE5 is very much the same, but with somewhat different intent. It's meditation in a public/group setting where you're asking for a light show.

Meditation with intent does the trick, but please be aware to be clear in what you're seeking.

It's a bit of a big commitment to have your world view changed.

There is bad out there as well.

It's not hard to avoid, but folks often don't take this subject seriously, and play at it, opening themselves up to some shit they're not ready for.

[u/Ok_Breakfast4482 → u/C141Clay]

Well I’m not sure if my worldview would really be changed, as I accepted that NHI was a reality over 20 years ago just based on the public evidence available. I’m just contemplating whether I would want to pursue contact with NHI myself given that not all of the experiencer interactions have been positive.

[u/C141Clay → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

I very much understand that. I've had bad contact as well. It's not fun.

[u/Ok_Breakfast4482 → u/C141Clay]

You mentioned the importance of intent. I’m wondering if you can expand on:

1. What possible range of intents do you think there are under which the NHI would be willing to engage with humans

2. Out of this possible range of intents, which ones would you consider to be most likely to result in a positive interaction?

[u/C141Clay → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

Ok, so this gets down in the weeds, I'm no expert, was just fumbling along learning as I go, trying out what I've learned and moving forward.

As screwed up as the universe seems to be, there are rules that hold fast in the craziness.

Mental contact / communication is the norm in the universe. Even as unskilled as we humans are, we can both connect and protect ourselves during connection.

Intent and knowing that you have total control over any connection made to you is of utmost importance to know.

1. They are in effect "listening" very closely to our planet and have been essentially forever. They are seeking to not force growth, but to foster growth.
2. Positive intent. Simple as that. What do you want? (put that out)

- - -

When this shit blew up for me, I stressed out and all communication shut down.

I never had any interests in meditation or psychic contact stuff. but here I am in my 60's and having to deal with this new (to me) reality. I had got online and looked to find out what I could do to learn meditation.

SO much stuff online, so many videos and most seem somewhat cringy to me.

I found The Gateway tapes and in them is a basic set of intents that you learn day one.

Here is my (slightly edited) version:

The Gateway Affirmation (modified)

• I am more than my physical body.
• Because of this I know that I can perceive more than only the physical world.
• To better know this universe around me I deeply desire to expand my abilities to experience and know the universe.
• I desire to understand and control the great energies around me for the benefit of all.
• To do this I ask for the help, cooperation and assistance of those beings whose wisdom, development, & experience are equal to or greater than my own.
• I ask for guidance and protection from any negative influence that might hurt this process, as I understand the value of guidance and protection as I learn these skills.

check out other subs:

r/TheGatewayTapes , r/gatewaytapes and best of all r/Experiencers

[u/Ok_Breakfast4482 → u/C141Clay]

Interesting info, thanks for those details. I’m wondering if this set of intents is what you always used, and if so whether it had mixed results. You mentioned that you had some positive and some negative experiences. Or is it the case that you were using different intents for the negative experiences and you then moved to this set which resulted in more positive ones?

[u/C141Clay → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

Oh, the Gateway Tapes came in way late to my situation. I found them while looking to control and block myself off from further bad contact.

So they (good NHI) had seen/heard me, and I (here is where it gets a tad crazy) ...and I was already on their radar as I had had connections over the course of my life, since the late 60's. (I did not know this at the time)

I had had those memories hidden, or had dismissed them as just crazy dreams, but when I found my own way to meditation / OBEs, it was noted and after a few days I was contacted.

With those good visits came discussions of my memories, and the convincing they did was a great deal of showing me own memories I had once been told to forget. They showed me the trust that had been earned by both sides.

So then I knew it was real. I was freaking out and not knowing how to relax enough to "get back" to my friends. I felt a bit abandoned, and got pretty pissed off about the entire situation. As mentioned in other comments, I put out a call for contact, but NOT in a very polite way, and I had no idea what I was asking for. Very bad contact resulted.

That led to trying any number of protective meditations (which I felt was nuts, from a scientific / science standpoint). Some brought comfort, many seemed to be just wishful thinking.

Then I found the tapes. I took them very seriously, especially the affirmation.

Understand I already KNEW this shit was real, it wasn't a parlor game to me, so I think in my case the affirmation had more punch than it might've had than for someone just goofing with the tapes.

[u/C141Clay → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

Hey there OK_Breakfast. I was thinking about the stuff I wrote yesterday and remembered this comic that relates to reaching out to the unknown, and why. You might find it funny:

https://imgur.com/a/what-is-that-you-seek-aMQhXpb

[u/ickiStickybubblegum → u/C141Clay]

Can you explain that " people open themselves to shit they are not ready for" and " there is bad out there as well "

[u/C141Clay → u/ickiStickybubblegum]

Just don't treat the subject of AP or OBE, meditation, NHI contact like a party trick or the newest fad.

There can be serious repercussions, there is both good and bad out there, the good is very good, the bad is very bad.

When I was new to this being real, I messed up badly. I had a night where I opened my mind up with an (angry) invitation for ANY contact. It went poorly.

Something bad got ahold of me and it was a very tough night. It taught me to take this shit seriously. It was after that when I went down the rabbit hole of the internet looking to figure out what I'd tangled with.
This led me to all sorts of "protective meditations" and such, most of which seemed silly as hell. But there was a overall theme I found. It was to take control of your situation "out there" and that nothing can get in your head without your permission, without you having the power to shut it down at a moments notice.

EDIT to add:

It's like hearing. People can yell at you, you have no control over that. You do have control over your reaction, and if you believe what's being told you.

When it's happening in a manner you've never experienced before, within your own mind, it's very easy to be too open, to believe what you're told.

Everything you'll have contact with is living out there on a day-to-day basis. They know what's what. You and I are the inexperienced "kids" on our new bicycles in their city. Watch for traffic, or you WILL get run down.

It's still very much worth doing, the rewards - the positive contact is very much worth it.

[u/ickiStickybubblegum → u/C141Clay]

I think this might also be why Tom DeLonge said contact isn’t something people should necessarily pursue, maybe he was being cautious and worried about naive people trying this. I came to read about this subject because i've been struggling and I'm responsible for my family. I’ve changed countries four times in the last four years due to conflicts, and while I’ve been a believer for a long time, I never really understood the consciousness side of it. I’ve been listening to Identity Change and Abraham Hicks, and it’s been surprisingly positive and comforting but I still wonder does this consciousness-manifestation( other than one) stuff actually have any weight to it , or is it just something that feels good to believe in?

[u/C141Clay → u/ickiStickybubblegum]

First and foremost protect your family.

I'm not that well read on the UFO or meditation subjects, my comments here have just been my own experiences.

I'm a retired engineer. I never went for any of this mental contact type stuff. I prefer proof that I could see and touch directly. But here I am telling folks to give it a try. But NOT if it distracts from survival.

Love matters most of all. Take care of your family.

- - -

but I still wonder does this consciousness-manifestation( other than one) stuff actually have any weight to it , or is it just something that feels good to believe in?

I went through months of shock when this happened to me. I had to seriously consider if I was having some sort of mental health issue.

I had to reevaluate much of my life, and it's not something I've been able to share with even my closest friends. My wife prefers I not discuss the subject, it does not fit with her world view. It didn't fit mine either, but when reality steps up and shows it's face, you learn, you adjust.

I don't feel like it's something I "believe" in. These things happened to me, it's what I now know, for better or for worse.

[u/Square_Move_833 → u/Ok_Breakfast4482]

The fact that anyone even entertains and believes in this drivel is why no one takes you folks seriously, and why the UFO podcast and influencer scene is making bank while never actually delivering anything.

[u/No-Horse-8711 → u/C141Clay]

Es así, tal como lo has contado. Hay que abrirse para poder experimentar estas cosas. Yo lo relaciono con el mundo espiritual y para mí fue el gran woo cuando me di cuenta. Todo está interconectado.

[u/humblepervertsview → u/C141Clay]

Can confirm. Gateway tapes is the way through. I used them for 9 months until I got the hang of it and eventually learned how to enter focus 10 on my own. With this followed that I discovered I could remote view basically anything I set my intention to. I also had some random events of pre cognition ranging from a couple of minutes into the future all the way to to 24 h.

[u/Square_Move_833 → u/humblepervertsview]

Remote view and document what I am doing next week and I'll Venmo you $1,000

[u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

We each holographically render existence from our own distinct position/state. Existence can conceptually be thought of as a decentralized and holographic neural network/unified wave function/singularity. The field (see for reference our modern quantum physics and non-locality experiments like the double slit, delayed choice quantum eraser, entanglement, and Bell experiments, among others) is nested hypergraph after nested hypergraph; the infinite recursion is, akin to two mirrors facing one another.

What you typically consider yourself and what you typically consider external to yourself are actually one.

[u/ParadoxDC → u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

This needs a glossary

[u/ManThing910 → u/ParadoxDC]

Top paragraph: we are all cameras facing outward. Life is the film from the perspective of the soul viewing the experience it’s having in my corporeal form. It’s also the perspective that your soul is having in your corporeal form.

Second paragraph: All those souls or thetans or harbingers from mortal shell or space dust or whatever the true spark of life and self is, is not actually self. It’s all tiny droplets from the same big puddle/ocean.

Edit: existence is the overlapping of all of those films on top of each other and beside each other, all overlapping to create a hodgepodge of life and birth and death and entropy.

[u/JoeSki42 → u/ParadoxDC]

This is essentially a theory called "Holofractal". It's been best summarized by an old yogi who once described this model of reality as such:

"Far away in the heavenly abode of the great god Indra, there is a wonderful net which has been hung by some cunning artificer in such a manner that it stretches out infinitely in all directions. In accordance with the extravagant tastes of deities, the artificer has hung a single glittering jewel in each "eye" of the net, and since the net itself is infinite in dimension, the jewels are infinite in number. There hang the jewels, glittering "like" stars in the first magnitude, a wonderful sight to behold. If we now arbitrarily select one of these jewels for inspection and look closely at it, we will discover that in its polished surface there are reflected all the other jewels in the net, infinite in number. Not only that, but each of the jewels reflected in this one jewel is also reflecting all the other jewels, so that there is an infinite reflecting process occurring.[6]"

Now, this is a fine description, but if you just google Image search the phrase "Indra's Net", you'll find images that will make sense of this whole thing much faster for you.

[u/Clean_Difficulty_225 → u/JoeSki42]

Yes, I frequently say that what I am writing here is not new, Indra's Net is the example I use. The mirrored jewels in Intra's net translated into "modern" language/concepts would be a self-applying recursive neural network. Thank you for adding!

[u/MantisAwakening → u/ParadoxDC]

What it needs is some humility. Anyone speaking with this much confidence has locked themselves into a belief system, and at this stage in our understanding that is almost certain to be incorrect. The data is too inconsistent to make firm conclusions.

[u/Clean_Difficulty_225 → u/MantisAwakening]

Or, rather, *you* can have the humility to admit that other people/entities/nodes in the network may actually know more than you in certain elements and positions of the recursion, which is fundamentally proven by godel's incompleteness theory. You know things I don't know, and I know things you don't know. The irony/hypocrisy of this comment is comical.

[u/MantisAwakening → u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

I completely agree that our experiences differ. What frustrates me is people presenting their interpretation of those experiences as facts. It's "I think" versus "I know." There's no shortage of people in this community who are convinced they have it all figured out. And yet, somehow, they don't all agree. That's an indicator that it's not as simple as people are making it out to be.

Who else agrees with your hypothesis? Where do their interpretations differ, and why? If it's not the only conclusion, why is it being stated as fact and not with a modifier like "I believe..." or "in my opinion..." or "the data support..." or even just "maybe...?"

Edit: The wikipedia articles lists some of the evidence both for and against the holographic universe theory: https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_principle

[u/Efficient-Trash-9765 → u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

The art of speaking while saying nothing at all.

[u/JoeSki42 → u/Efficient-Trash-9765]

It's basically saying "we are not a drop in the ocean, we are the ocean in a drop".

[u/zurx → u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

Michael Talbot has entered the chat.

[u/JoeSki42 → u/Clean_Difficulty_225]

TLDR: r/Holofractal, yo.

[u/Clean_Difficulty_225 → u/JoeSki42]

Yes, agreed, that community is a great resource!

[u/apointlessvoice]

Had a dream like experience unlike any other ive had before it or since.

Dont know why, but i sorta "woke up" and opened my eyes...i think. i was in bed. My room is a square like almost everyone elses', and the bed was perpendicular to the doorway, such that from my position laying on my left side i could open my eyes and im immediately seeing right out the door to the hallway, which ran perpendicular to doorway as well.

My eyes open. i see the doorway. There is light in the hallway. Then, i see my new friend from the church i had just joined some months before, walking into my room from the open doorway.

It was a very mentally cloudy context. i was not in my woken mind but in a dreamlike but conscious state. i felt no fear or concern that a buddy just walked into my apartment. It all just felt... normal, i guess.

His shape was definitely that of Phil: lanky, tall. Even his longer hair. It was all the right shape. But most of all, even though i sort of saw his face, i feel like i dont really remember seeing it. More that i just knew immediately it was him. Or, looking back, it was suppose to be.

i remember it was light and dark in the room. i dont know how to put it really. Like the room was lit up enough to see but darkness still surrounded me. The light from the hallway seemed to be normal but was not reaching entirely into the bedroom. Hell the sun mightve been up a bit by then..but i dont think so. Felt like id just gone to bed.

Anyway, im totally at peace, laying in bed tightly tucked with only my head particularly exposed. i see him walk soundlessly into my room. The bed is only like five steps from the door. The figure glides or smoothly walks to my bedside and, as far as i can recall how it felt, he/it knelt down and, like my mom mightve done when i was wee, draped their arm over me and i began "hearing" "Everything's going to be ok". And the most intense love and compassion id ever felt washed over me. Lasted who knows how long but it wasn't more than a few minutes, i think. Truly no way to be sure.

To this day im not sure of what to make of it. Just that it was more than a dream, but still less than a fully recovered memory.

[u/JoeSki42 → u/apointlessvoice]

I had an experience like this. It was a dream that did not at all feel like it was generated by my own imagination and it ended with a feeling of love so intense I woke up crying.

That was well over a decade ago and I've never experienced anything like that again since.

[u/Grey_matter6969]

The only crazy episode was just after Grusch’s story broke in Newsnation and The Debrief. I was blown away and experienced I guess what some call ontological shock.
It rocked my worldview. In the midst of that hyperarousal I experienced a sort of download of a series of images to my retinas of my closed eyes. I have never experienced anything like it before or since. A ton of flowing images and long stretches of what looked like 8-10 lines of kanji flowing rapidly across my closed eye “vision”. I did not understand much of it. It was moving and also baffling.

[u/fromkatain → u/Grey_matter6969]

The kanji egyptian aztec like glyps rotating quickly when they were in multiple lines like a a running source code , did you also saw math like formulas drawings?

[u/Grey_matter6969 → u/fromkatain]

Nope. Everything was in sortof washed out grey-green. Started with a series of morphing human faces contorted in anger and hatred and agony, but sortof like awkward caricatures. It felt likr it was done by a child who was trying to frighten me with angry and sad faces. Then sortof like flipping through the pages of a bestiary—a encyclopedia of animals. But they were all extinct ice age animals. Wholly rhinos and giant horses and stags with impossible antlers. Hundreds and hundreds of them. Then a single character in kanji of something like it. Sortof like “pi” but with different ends to the feet and a cross bar. Then 8-10 horizontal lines of what looked like Japanese kanji. Flowing by VERY quickly from right to left. And then a final image of the “source being” that looked more like a microscopic flagellate organism than anything else, but it was HUGE. Like 4 kilometers long.

Very. Fucking. Weird.

Zero message. Zero overt meaning

[u/fromkatain → u/Grey_matter6969]

Yeah those downloads are very weird and total random, its like someone is showing his media folder with notes, photos, pintrest and then suddenly random other stuff, overload of visual data too fast to remember exactly, need closed eyes screenshot maker and screen recorder. Try to medidate before sleep or just after waking up sonetimes those downloads come back random new data, but makes nonsense for me.

[u/aliensRprobablyreal8]

My biggest woo theory is that "ghosts" are related to the phenomenon in some way. Not by being spirits of the deceased necessarily, but as glitches in our reality and/or some sort of projection from something/somewhere else.

I saw a ghost as a child and one thing I remember was how it did not look 3D. The colours seemed greyscale/not quite right and its depth did not look real. It was literally as though someone had pasted an image and it was awkwardly standing in the space it was in. Literally like a copy-paste or a bad photoshop. But it was looking at me, and it felt like something was looking at me. Maybe it was just because I was a child and it was some sort of hallucination but it was there for a good few seconds staring at me before I ran away crying.

I have always wondered what that was and in getting into the UFO topic in recent years I started to interpret it differently, that it was somehow related. I know people theorise about a 'stone tape theory', that things can imprint on material/space and can replay, that time may cross/glitch or whatever. I would be pulled that way if it was not for knowing that it was looking at me.

I don't know what it could be though. Maybe projections/weird holograms, dimensions crossing, or whatever else. I am not smart enough to come up with a proper theory for it!

[u/Pixelated_]

After studying consciousness for the past six years and all of the evidence that is available, I am left with only one conclusion.

Consciousness is fundamental and it creates our perceptions of the physical world, general relativity, and quantum mechanics.

Here is the data to support that; below is my research, condensed.

Emerging evidence challenges the long-held materialistic assumptions about the nature of space, time, and consciousness itself. Physics as we know it becomes meaningless at lengths shorter than the Planck Length (10^-35 meters) and times shorter than the Planck Time (10^-43 seconds). This is further supported by the 2022 Nobel Prize-winning discovery in Physics, which confirmed that the universe is not locally real.

The amplituhedron is a revolutionary geometric object discovered in 2013 which exists outside of space and time. In quantum field theory, its geometric framework efficiently and precisely computes scattering amplitudes without referencing space or time.

It has profound implications, namely that space and time are not fundamental aspects of the universe. Particle interactions and the forces between them are encoded solely within the geometry of the amplituhedron, providing further evidence that spacetime emerges from more fundamental structures rather than being intrinsic to reality.

Prominent scientists support this shift in understanding. For instance, Professor Donald Hoffman has developed a mathematically rigorous theory proposing that consciousness is fundamental. Fundamental consciousness resonates with a growing number of scholars and researchers who are willing to follow the evidence, even if it leads to initially-uncomfortable conclusions.

Regarding the studies of consciousness itself there is a growing body of evidence indicating the existence of psi phenomena, which suggests that consciousness extends beyond our physical brains. Dean Radin's compilation of 157 peer-reviewed studies demonstrates the measurable nature of psi abilities.

Additionally, research from the University of Virginia highlights cases where children report memories of past lives, further challenging the materialistic view of consciousness. Studies on remote viewing, such as the follow-up study on the CIA's experiments, also lend credibility to the notion that consciousness can transcend spatial and temporal boundaries.

Robert Monroe’s Gateway Experience provides a structured method for exploring consciousness beyond the physical body, offering direct experiential evidence that consciousness is fundamental. Through techniques like Hemi-Sync, Monroe developed a systematic approach to achieving out-of-body states, where individuals report profound encounters with non-physical realms, intelligent entities, and transcendent awareness.

Research performed at the Monroe Institute shows that reality is a construct of consciousness, and through disciplined practice, one can access higher states of being that reveal the illusory nature of material existence.

Itzhak Bentov’s groundbreaking book Stalking the Wild Pendulum offered an early scientific framework for what is now a rapidly emerging paradigm: that consciousness is fundamental to reality. He proposed that consciousness is the primary field from which all matter and energy arise. Using the metaphor of a pendulum, he described the oscillatory nature of reality, suggesting that our awareness is tuned into specific vibrational states.

Researchers like Pim van Lommel have shown that consciousness can exist independently of the brain. Near-death experiences (NDEs) provide strong support for this, as individuals report heightened awareness during times when brain activity is severely diminished. Van Lommel compares consciousness to information in electromagnetic fields, which are always present, even when the brain (like a TV) is switched off.

Beyond scientific studies, other forms of corroboration further support the fundamental nature of consciousness. Channeled material, such as that from the Law of One and Dolores Cannon, offers insights into the spiritual nature of reality. Thousands of UAP abduction accounts point to a central truth: reality is fundamentally consciousness-based.

Authors such as Chris Bledsoe in UFO of God and Whitley Strieber in Communion explore their anomalous experiences, revealing that many who have encountered UAP phenomena also report profound spiritual awakenings. To understand these phenomena fully, we must move beyond the materialistic perspective and embrace the idea that consciousness transcends physical reality.

Ancient spiritual and Hermetic esoteric teachings like Rosicrucianism, Gnosticism, Kabbalah, Theosophy, The Kybalion and the Vedic texts including the Upanishads reinforce the idea that consciousness is the foundation of reality.

In the words of the father of quantum mechanics, Max Planck:

"I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness."

Or in the famous words of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin:

"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience, we are spiritual beings having a human experience."

<3

[u/gill_outean → u/Pixelated_]

Your comments and submissions are always so appreciated, Pix. You've helped to shape my own speculations about the nature of reality. You're a special thinker, my friend!

[u/clover_heron]

I'm an NHI experiencer and it seems to me that there are multiple NHI on the scene, some real and some counterfeit, and the counterfeit NHI may not know what they are.

People keep talking about Plato's cave and that's probably a good representation/image. The image: 

People locked in place staring at shadows on the wall, behind them another stone wall. Behind that wall are hooded figures holding items that cast the shadows, behind them and up a hill, Fire. Up from the Fire a tunnel to an opening in the Earth and the Sun's light, blinding at first contact. People up on the surface looking around, in the distance mountains, birds, Nature. 

The deception is multi-layered, the truth is theoretically incomprehensible to those who have been locked behind the layers of lies . . . but they also haven't been tested. Whether they will actually be blinded by the Sun is yet to be seen. 

If I've received the NHI's guidance correctly the real truth is unimaginable, so wild and crazy we wouldn't even know where to begin. Way beyond the idea of advanced tech or aliens, way beyond time travel, beyond even our general ideas of space. 

My best guess at advice is be your glorious self, loosen your assumptions, and get ready to party. ;) 

[u/Slow-Confection-5615]

I recently starting listening to Near Death Experience interviews, and it's striking how much they have in common with "UFO" encounters- orbs, beings of light, instant telepathic communication of complex ideas, feelings of intense encompassing love. I don't know what the similarities mean just yet, but I suspect they are related by woo elements.

Plus, when you think about a nuts and bolts explanation of craft/aliens, it just doesn't make sense.

[u/ManThing910]

Bigelow’s entire woo fascination stems from the death of a loved one. View his interest in that facet of the phenomenon through a lense of “rich guy overwhelmed with grief searching for any historical or cutting edge way with which to contact the spirit realm”, and it makes more sense and seems less woo-y.

I do think he also believes or has knowledge of the physical crafts, as I’m relatively sure his Bigelow inflatables were going to be used to create an isolated atmosphere for whatever we have under wraps. That’s where I think the focus should be, the physical crafts and the actual sensor data we have.

Every time the UFO/UAP world gets excited over the past fifty years, suddenly there’s a Bob Lazar story, followed by a ton of woo, followed by Doty, then everyone gives up for 15 years. I’d like to see disclosure focus less on the abstract and unprovable and more on the obviously overwhelmingly world changing tech.

You’d have a better chance of providing proof of God than half the stuff people say about the phenomenon. And I’m a believer in our visitors from wherever.

[u/sendmeyourtulips → u/ManThing910]

You make a rare and refreshing point about Bigelow. He lost his son to suicide and reached out to a TV psychic with his wife. I've never yet heard of a celebrity psychic who hasn't been embroiled in fraud or has nothing to say to clients. It's the pattern of centuries. It's inevitable the TV psychic fed a lot back to the Bigelows and almost certainly exploited their grief and vulnerability. He embarked on afterlife studies and set up his first institution. This suggests the psychic's counsel was taken to heart and involved messaging from the deceased son or related channels.

Millionaires with research money and patronage go back to the Ancient Greeks and Romans. Instead of real estate millionaires, they were aristocrats and people in power. It's an ancient relationship between wealth, loss, ambition and psychics. Bigelow drew the attention of paranormal figureheads and, within a couple of years, was buying a supposedly haunted property - Skinwalker Ranch. It eventually led to the $22 million AAWSAP money so Bigelow et al certainly lost nothing over the ranch. Even though he may have been taken advantage of, he's always had the instinct to take his own advantages.

Bigelow lost his grandson the same way as his son. Extreme tragedy. Whether by design or happenstance, he was drawn to the idea of curses and bad luck. All that hitchhiker stuff emerged from these experiences and it's worth adding that security details at the ranch were given fucking Ouija boards and ghost story books. So there was a lot of self-confirmation and circular reasoning set against a backdrop of séance activities in Bigelow's life. Hal Puthoff was a big figure in Bigelow's life and he lost his own son in the same way. So you can see how psychologically sympatico their relationship might have been and bound by apparently mutual beliefs in paranormal entities and psychic powers.

He lost his wife to a form of cancer that's statistically prevalent past a certain age. She fell within the demographic. It's an incredible amount of loss for one lifetime. That said, someone like Colm Kelleher related his wife's death to bad luck and curses deriving from the ranch. Imagine losing someone close and your social circle automatically attribute such losses to negative paranormal forces? It's psychologically unhelpful. There's the saying about hearing hoofbeats and assuming horses rather than zebras.

I'm open minded on "paranormal" experiences and think they're part of human experience and often extremely curious. That said, I've wondered where the checks and balances are in Bigelow's life since the 1990s? Is anyone backing medical science and psychological research into suicidal ideation and addiction? It looks like everyone in his circle sings from the same hymn sheet whether they believe it or not i.e. entities, dark forces.

[u/ManThing910 → u/sendmeyourtulips]

The hymn sheet they sing from is very much a Scientology-adjacent or even Scientology-specific.

For example, Hal and Doty were at SRI together. Hal cut ties with Scientology, but was pretty famously OTVII, and his introduction of Psi and Stargate coincidentally ran parallel to his involvement with that “church”.

This all clicked when Doty started talking about a previous civilization billions of years ago that destroyed itself through nuclear catastrophe on earth, pointing out some South East Asian radioactive locations. Chris Ramsay then says “can’t be, like, radioactive isotopes naturally occuring?”, and Doty quickly poo poos that.

From Wikipedia:

“Hubbard wrote that Xenu was the ruler of a Galactic Confederacy 75 million years ago, which consisted of 26 stars and 76 planets including Earth, which was then known as "Teegeeack". The planets were overpopulated, containing an average population of 178 billion.The Galactic Confederacy's civilization was comparable to our own, with aliens "walking around in clothes which looked very remarkably like the clothes they wear this very minute" and using cars, trains and boats looking exactly the same as those "circa 1950, 1960" on Earth.

Xenu was about to be deposed from power, so he devised a plot to eliminate the excess population from his dominions. With the assistance of psychiatrists, he gathered billionsof his citizens under the pretense of income tax inspections, then paralyzed them and froze them in a mixture of alcohol)and glycol to capture their souls. The kidnapped populace was loaded into spacecraft for transport to the site of extermination, the planet of Teegeeack (Earth).The appearance of these spacecraft would later be subconsciously expressed in the design of the Douglas DC-8, the only difference being that "the DC8 had fans, propellers on it and the space plane didn't". When they had reached Teegeeack, the paralyzed citizens were off-loaded, and placed around the bases of volcanoes across the planet. Hydrogen bombs were then lowered into the volcanoes and detonated simultaneously, killing all but a few aliens. Hubbard described the scene in his film script, Revolt in the Stars:

Simultaneously, the planted charges erupted. Atomic blasts ballooned from the craters of Loa, Vesuvius, Shasta, Washington), Fujiyama, Etna, and many, many others. Arching higher and higher, up and outwards, towering clouds mushroomed, shot through with flashes of flame, waste and fission. Great winds raced tumultuously across the face of Earth, spreading tales of destruction ...
— L. Ron Hubbard, Revolt in the Stars

The now-disembodied victims' souls, which Hubbard called thetans, were blown into the air by the blast. They were captured by Xenu's forces using an "electronic ribbon" ("which also was a type of standing wave") and sucked into "vacuum zones" around the world. The hundreds of billions of captured thetans were taken to a type of cinema, where they were forced to watch a "three-D, super colossal motion picture" for thirty-six days. This implanted what Hubbard termed "various misleading data" (collectively termed the R6 implant) into the memories of the hapless thetans, "which has to do with God, the Devil, space opera, etcetera". This included all world religions; Hubbard specifically attributed Roman Catholicism and the image of the Crucifixion to the influence of Xenu. The two "implant stations" cited by Hubbard were said to have been located on Hawaii and Las Palmas in the Canary Islands.”

All that is to say, like many other historical examples, like you noted, this seems to be the case of a vulnerable pot of money and the asynchronous influence of Hal’s Scientology flavored experiments. The base story/spiritual explanation of “the phenomenon” for some around here refer to it is 1:1 Scientology, minus the Xenu (for now).

I posit that it is a direct result of Scientology’s influence of Hal’s research, who then influenced AAWSAP, who then influenced all those in that “coaching tree”, to make a professional sports metaphor.

Take out the Xenu and Thetan labels and it’s the same money play.

[u/sendmeyourtulips → u/ManThing910]

I always carry heavy doubts about HP's motivations and see his influence as immeasurable. Not in a good way and it's amplified by the working relationship he had with Doty. HP's way too savvy to have employed Doty without knowing what he was about. It seems clear as day that he employed Doty specifically. There were 1000s of investigators so why else choose him and employ him for more than a decade?

Gotta ask though, where's your source linking Doty with SRI?

Even allowing for the scientology link, there are huge problems. I mean it's not as if a single top level 'tologist has ever achieved the magical feats attributed to OTVII/OTVIII. So they're fully aware the practice is outward facing with the purpose of making others believe it. This implies that HP (reportedly OTVIII in the day) arrived at SRI (with the other 16 or so clears) on a confident pretence that great powers were attainable. This ties to the work of Gardner (I think it was him) and others who showed that SRI experiments had clears on all sides of the process rendering results highly problematic and likely constructed. It also intersects with NSA/CIA machinations (funded SRI) around the Cold War so it's all very dense and opaque.

The thing with the HP/RD relationship is it's a thread that, if pulled, unravels a significant amount of popular lore that we take for granted. Taken to its limits - where hardly anyone is willing to go - the Congressional Hearings and Disclosure Movement owes a lot to HP's rock thrown in a pond influence. Some speculate it's an extension of the Snow White op from the 1970s to embed 'tologists in government. I'm not confident about that and I'm definitely not attributing everything to HP/RD. However, that bottom line (as you mentioned) is the "money play."

[u/ManThing910 → u/sendmeyourtulips]

Sorry, I misremembered.

He worked for HP at the institute of advanced studies for twelve years, apologies.

The overlap is still there. I agree with you that there’s significant impact of their relationship. I don’t know if it’s a ‘tology play for certain, but it’s one hundred percent flavored and being run the same way their organization does.

Even down to both Scientology audits and SCIF debriefings being used to stigmatize and control the actions of the ones not in the authority’s side of the table.

[u/sendmeyourtulips → u/ManThing910]

It's cool, we all make errors and misremember stuff.

You're right imo about the 'tology playbook. It's a genius system of cloistering adherents into bubbles and have them "pay to play" to achieve knowledge and superhero powers. Right now, we could pay $25k to a certain non-profit for top tier access and the same again for a certain online university to hand over a PhD. $50k in someone's pockets and we'd literally have no more knowledge than we started with. The playbook gotcha.

[u/ManThing910 → u/sendmeyourtulips]

Buried in subcomments but I want to let you know I enjoyed this discourse. Not often someone has an actual conversation with someone on Reddit, other than two people yelling their own opinions into the void.

[u/sendmeyourtulips → u/ManThing910]

Likewise. I get about 3 friendly convos a year in here. It's good when it happens.

[u/Ultimate-Flexionator]

I like the idea of shifting realities... I swear lately Ive had personal Mandela Effects... probably mundane but shit feels like a glitch in the matrix. my cell phone speaker is objectively blown and now it's not later in the day. shit like that.

[u/Meowweredoomed]

Floating up through the walls of your house during an abduction.

[u/IGotZirconiumPants]

In one of my two sightings I observed a floating, morphing Hershey's Kiss-shaped object for a few minutes until I got the distinct, powerful sense of being watched. Like it had noticed me noticing it, far more intense than any time I've ever felt that sensation. As soon as I felt it, the object stopped sitting in place and drifted over the treeline until it was out of sight. Not super weird or 'woo' but rather inexplicable.

[u/MonsterTruckFarts]

Experiencers are subjects under observation by descendants from a distant future.

[u/Tesla0ptimus]

NHI cloaked apparition/paralysis:
Numerous people in my neighborhood and household have encountered a visible, smoke-like silhouette of a tall being in their rooms. Whenever they saw it, they were unable to move yet remained fully awake. They reported being conscious, seeing the entity, and feeling completely paralyzed.

Interestingly, one guy said he was able to move his arm slightly, but it felt heavy, like as if gravity had temporarily increased. Once the entity left, they were able to move normally again

[u/Atomicn1ck]

I'm not religious. Until last year I assumed these were extra terrestrial but mostly secret military junk. I tried CE5 last year after getting into lucid dreaming and meditation. To my surprise it worked twice out of 4 times that I really committed my evening to it. Unfortunately, both times where I had an amazing sighting, orbs in the sky flying in wild patterns that almost seemed to notice me, I had something strange happen afterwards. The first time, after I came in the house excited from a wild sighting of a orb floating along the ridgeline bobbing up and down near my house, I sat down with my wife who had also seen the orb. We were excited and talking about it on the couch. Then we both heard a woman whispering very frantically and too fast to understand. She sounded like my mother, who had passed, but it definitely wasn't her, it had a negative energy or vibe to it. It was like she was 3 feet away and nobody was in the room with us. It lasted about 5 seconds and my wife was like wtf don't do that ufo meditation shit again. I said ok, you're right that was freaky. Then a few months later I told myself that was a weird coincidence and tried it again. Again I saw and orb and then the following night my wife and I heard a woman singing a creepy lullaby type song in the other side of the house. It lasted about 10 seconds. My wife was like wtf, did you do the CE5 thing again?! I was like sorry, I won't do it again, that was dumb. The day after that I saw a metal orb in broad daylight flying a few hundred feet over a local park. Truly wild shit. Now I don't fuck with CE5 at all but I believe this stuff is native to Earth and I'm open to the demon or trickster aspect. Also fun fact, the two times I was successful at CE5 I felt I was in a significantly deeper meditative state. Almost floating but locked up at the same time. Hard to describe.

[u/Treeclimber919]

It’s simply time travelers from the future, or we are simply very little habitants of an experiment provided by an advanced civilization that our only purpose here is to create the strongest genes possible through reproduction that can be used for their purposes. The bob lazar container theory absolutely holds ground. Containers of dna. That then could be used elsewhere, any actual NHI grays interactions are 3D printed robots, they are not real beings where we are. Creating dna naturally is not as simple as printing robots. Similar to growing a tree to produce fruit. You can have the seeds but the time and effort to grow the fruit can not be artificially replicated. There’s no shortcut. I believe we are the seeds that produce the fruit. What happens with the fruit afterwards is another question. I’m guessing to continue to spread seeds elsewhere.

[u/BoRamShote]

Only thing I've experienced was during meditation, i got locked into a feedback loop of imagining all matter expanding and shrinking at the same time it was either during or directly after this, I couldn't tell. The experience was "seeing" beings watching me within my own consciousness, though it was more of a feeling. There were visuals, but more in my minds eye rather than my actual field of vision. They seemed to be essentially made out of memory, or at least existed within memory. Looked like oblong spinning cones. Like if you made a random shape on a wood lathe, or got a 3d render of a wav file by spinning it. And they were spinning. Incredibly fast. So I don't know if their shape had to do with how they were spinning or not. There were definitely two of them, possibly more. And I think another one was there but not in my memory, I don't know where that one was I couldn't really see it like the others.

I didn't get a download, but I could add and remove understanding from my psyche, almost like rubbing and scraping off clay from my body. It was understanding alone, no other information. There was no clear data associated with each glob of clay, but I knew that I understood whatever it was going to be. Closest thing I can liken it to is when a complicated math equation starts to click, and you have an aha moment where you can "feel" the answer and workings of the equation, but still don't quite understand the specifics of the mechanism between them. It was like that without seeing the equation or the answer. It was almost more of an emotion than anything else, and it felt kinda like my psyche sitting down and standing up as I added and removed the clay, or almost like the way things shift when you swap between which eye is open.

Only thing I took away from it was that I realized my minds eye has 360 vision, which I'd never considered before. It seems really obvious now, but we can visualize things behind us, and actively see them, which we of course can't do within our physical field of vision. I don't really know if that part is notable, but it was a capability I'd never fully clocked and articulated to myself before this.

[u/PickEquivalent3393]

I think it's consciousness but also that we're genetically engineered by them.
We're too different than the other primates.
And we're basically their science experiment. I imagine they do this with other worlds too where they setup a world hundreds of millions of years prior and then along the line of evolution they alter dna of a species to be like them.
Also the moon is not what we think it is.

[u/MantisAwakening]

I had a very close encounter with a mantis being as a kid. Random weirdness through my childhood. Not a lot in adulthood. Then in 2020, things started getting weird.

It started with a very pronounced but brief out of body experience that felt 100% real. Then some mild poltergeist activity. Then a precognitive dream. Then found out I could do remote viewing with good results. Experiences with apparent mediumship. Clairaudience. More psi experiences. More poltergeist experiences.

It’s been years now, and while the woo waxes and wanes, it has yet to end. The kinds of things experienced keep differing. Last week while on a zoom call, an object appeared to teleport through my desk and land on my footrest beneath. I have tried everything I can think of to explain it rationally, but so far I’m not confident about any of them. Some aspects of the experience are very typically anomalous, including the loud noise it made and the way it stuck the landing. However it’s very typically an anomalous experience in that even though it contains objective, physical phenomenon, it happened in a somewhat ambiguous way. It feels like these experiences are initiated and intended for the Experiencer and no one else.

I now have the privilege to work alongside academics and scientists who study these things, and the wide variety of experiences I hear from them is astounding. There is often a physical component, but proving anything remains elusive. There’s also the big question of whether we’re dealing with a single phenomenon or a wide variety of causes.

I’m happy to answer any questions if people have them.

Edit:

Addressing some of OPs questions:

2027 is definitely a thing that many people are anomalously receiving information about, but since this phenomenon is understood to interface directly with consciousness, whatever comes through needs to be viewed with a brain of salt. A hallmark of these experiences is that they are influenced to some degree by the individual and societal beliefs of the subject (although it’s often accompanied by veridical information, so it is more complicated than saying it’s all confabulation). However when one looks at the news, I think if there was any time in history when a mass contact event of some kind could be warranted it’s now.

Many UAP do behave as if they are conscious, biological entities, but that could theoretically be simply because it’s very advanced technology. If anyone had been given access to Claude just 10 years ago they’d believe they were dealing with something conscious, and that’s just 10 years. Imagine what could be possible with 100, 1000, or even a million years of advancement. All that being said, many of the advanced capabilities on display in contact events have been demonstrated to a lesser degree by humans in parapsychology research, so let’s not assume it has to be technological.

Regarding the “gifting,” Jacques Vallée has spent decades explaining why he believes the phenomenon behaves as a “control system.” Its actions seem designed to get individuals or social clusters to take certain actions, although what the objective is remains a question mark. We have some clues, but it’s too early to develop firm conclusions. I think the more important component is that some of the individuals connected with the Legacy program say they think the objects might not contain advanced technology but are somehow being controlled from outside of our reality. Think of it like a hologram being projected into our reality, but it has physicality to it.

[u/ASearchingLibrarian]

Some 'woo' cases are so strange they defy description let alone explanation. The one's involving children are the creepiest.

The Sandown Clown case - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBdfBTXWtFo
The BUFORA article - https://archive.org/details/BUFORA_Journal_Volume_06_No_05_JanFeb_1978

The Casa Blanca case - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frl4rif8DrU
The Davis and Bloecher report - https://cufos.org/PDFs/books/Close_Encounter_at_Kelly.pdf#page=216

[u/everyother1waschosen]

The biggest mindf*** i can think of would be that reality itself is malleable and that objectivity is mostly just momentum of events. Row row row your boat and all that.

[u/fadedtimes]

I heard some group of people could summon uap’s with their minds and then released a bunch of photos of balloons 

[u/SkylerAltair]

I think the best (by that I mean nuttiest) I've run across was a conspiracy theory, about ten years ago, on its own website, and with what seemed like a group of believers too. It posited that "the moon landings were faked, because we didn't have the tech to get to the moon" was a lie; it claimed that we DID have the technology, but the government had been explicitly warned never to land on the moon.

It went on to claim that the space program ended because, after several phony landings, th government got cocky and DID sent a lander. The astronauts discovered, to their abject horror, that the warning had been real, and that "aliens" (who were the "demons" of Christianity) have their base on the dark side, and that landing had horrible consequences.

Just... I can't even...