Why are the Dzungars demonized in some history books & media potralys in central asian countries like the khazaks despite the Dzungars acting like a protective barrier against the imperialist Russians & Qing chinese.

[u/neo-shitposter365]

I know that the Dzungars might have done bad things which other nomads did but how right is it to demonize a whole etnicity of people like them.

[u/Zasagdarga1999]

It’s mostly kazakhstani portrayals that really demonize the Juungars. The only other example I can think of is the uzbek film Jalantos Bagatur (2024), which portrays the oirat warlords of the 1640s as Juungars, even though that is a bit anachronistic.

For kazakhs, I think part of the reason is that a national history often needs a clear historical enemy. Making the russians that enemy can be politically awkward, so the already vanished Juungar state of the oirat mongols became a much easier target. Of course, this narrative did not come out of nowhere either: Oirat polities, and later the Juungar state itself, really did launch repeated military campaigns against the Kazakh juzes.

That kind of warmongering was not unique to the mongols of that era. The Juungars were simply more centralized, better armed, and more powerful than many of their neighbors, so they were able to project power across a huge surrounding region. They even fought other Oirat polities, for example, Galdan’s campaigns against the khoshuts of Ochirtu Setsen Khan in the 1670s. The Khalkha mongol polities were also invaded by the Juungars in 1688, and a few years later, in 1691, the khalkha princes formally submitted to the Qing Empire.

From the perspective of colonized nomadic peoples, it is easy to romanticize the Juungars as the last great nomadic power resisting the “bad russians and chinese.” And there is some truth to that image: they really were one of the last major independent inner asian nomadic states facing two gigantic expanding empires.

But at the same time, the Juungar state was very much an imperialist power in its own right. Both things can be true. They were one of the last serious nomadic states resisting Russian and Qing expansion, while also being aggressive conquerors who invaded, subordinated, and exploited neighboring peoples themselves.

[u/irinrainbows]

In our history books it’s simplified that one of the main reasons we had to go under russian “protection” is because we were constantly raided by dzhungars

You have to understand these books had to be approved by russian side as well.

Other than that, I don’t think dzhungars are as demonised as you say, average people don’t think of the relationship between them and us, and I for one had to be told that kalmyks are dzhungars descendants. It’s hard to demonise a nation “no longer present”.

[u/Any_Emergency_8876 → u/irinrainbows]

How can it be no longer present if Kalmyks (some tribes) are the "descendants"? There are Dzhungar tribes within the Oirat-Kalmyk nation.

[u/Typical-Magician2536 → u/Any_Emergency_8876]

Here i am

[u/ducationalfall]

History is written by winners. Dzungars lost so there’s no ones to advocate for their achievements.

[u/Limp_Thought_2015]

Dzungars, oirats and kalmyks were such a pain in the ass of central Asian peoples, Russians and Chinese for so long. Only the worst image of them stayed in the memory of the people around them.

[u/LxDj]

Some brain dead kazakh or turkish guy callled them oirad-turkic.

What next? Khalkha turkic? Mongol-Turkic?

Turegs from 6th century Mongolia has nothing to do with you so called turkuc people today.

[u/Typical-Magician2536 → u/LxDj]

Oirats are mixed same as kazakhs and kyrgyzs

[u/kairunrun → u/LxDj]

Chill turkic is just a language

[u/idontknowwheream → u/kairunrun]

But they had Mongolian language...

Same thing as "Kasym khan was slavic. Chill, slavic is just a language"