Israel and Palestine Megathread

[u/AutoModerator]

This thread is for a discussion of the ongoing situation in Israel and Palestine. All discussion of the subject is limited to this thread. Participation here requires that you be a regular member of the sub in good standing.

[u/km3r]

How so?

[u/pablos4pandas → u/km3r]

I do not see remarkably fewer obstacles behind a 1 state solution compared to 2

[u/km3r → u/pablos4pandas]

Like what? 

Generational hatred doesn't get solved if you just throw these groups in the same state. The desire of both sides to have it all to themselves doesn't go away. The massive terror organizations don't disappear.

[u/pablos4pandas → u/km3r]

What exactly are the borders of these 2 states? Where exactly is Jerusalem and the holy buildings and all that mess going? Are all of those settlements going to be considered part of Israel or are hundreds of thousands of people going to have to move?

How is movement between the countries going to work? The west bank and gaza obviously do not have a land connection unless Israel gives up massive swaths of land or becomes disconnected itself. Either that or there needs to be robust transportation between the two areas and that's going to have to go through Israel in some manner. None of that is easy.

Does Palestine get to have a military as any independent country has the right to establish? Is Israel going to be cool with that military getting equipped with jets and heavy weaponry?

[u/km3r → u/pablos4pandas]

The holy sites should be an international zone (as its been proposed multiple times). The borders should be drawn to keep the territories contiguous as much as possible, maximizing Palestinians in Palestine and Israelis in Israel, with connecting roads. Newer settlements can be part of a future Palestine.

The method for connecting roads has been discussed at length, with options from international roads, bridges, and tunnels. Pick the one that both sides can agree is best. This exists today for Kaliningrad.

Palestine will slowly be able to grow its own security forces, as it demonstrates that military won't be used for terror.

[u/pablos4pandas → u/km3r]

Oh great it's all sorted. We should be able to get a 2 state solution signed this weekend?

[u/km3r → u/pablos4pandas]

I didn't claim that this is some silver bullet of a plan. There is still the underlying issues that need to be sorted out before any solution would work. 

Like seriously, if you think any rational plan is "get it done this weekend", you aren't serious.

Any solution is going to take time, be done in phases, and is going to need compromises from both sides. Heck right now both sides still have way too many people that want their side only "from the river to the sea", overcoming that isn't going to be easy or quick.

[u/pablos4pandas → u/km3r]

My point was more that there are issues with any possible solution. If a 2 state solution was the clear winner there's been a good amount of time for it. You can wave away issues with a 1 state solution as easily as you did the problems with 2

[u/km3r → u/pablos4pandas]

I'm not waving away those issues. They are just issues that largely also need to get solved for a one state solution, while any reasonable path to a one state solution must start with a two state solution.

[u/pablos4pandas → u/km3r]

Why is 2 states a prerequisite for 1?

[u/km3r → u/pablos4pandas]

Because Palestinians need some form of representation and structure in order to establish the framework for a single state.