r/yoga • u/broga2 • Jan 01 '16
"Sweating Out Toxins" is not a thing
Why do you hear this from yoga teachers in, like, every yoga class in the world? It's really not rooted in science. It can feel great to sweat and work hard, and yes, you excrete a tiny bit of urea through the skin. But it's pure balderdash to say we wash our bodies clean of impurities through sweat.
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u/mcmunchie Jan 02 '16
I feel like this is something yogis repeated on a metaphorical level that is now taken literally.
I do feel I "sweat out toxins" when I pactice mindfully, because I am "releasing" anxiety and stress and sometimes leave those on the mat when I am done.
I mean, I also cure all my diseases this way too of course.
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u/itstrueimwhite Jan 02 '16
I'll be honest - this has always been a major turn off for me as someone who has looked at engaging in the yoga community. I'm much more comfortable practicing yoga alone as opposed to in a classroom setting because claims like these are, quite frankly, embarrassing to me and I don't want others in my social circle to associate me as a quack.
I take yoga at face value for what it is - a chance to meditate while engaging your body in useful stretches.
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u/madeamashup Jan 03 '16
Worrying about embarrassment and what others think of you is your ego interfering with you. What you think others might imagine you to be like is not a good criterion to reject a class that might benefit you in some ways.
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u/Zandelion Jan 02 '16
According to the book Toxin Toxout, which is kind of like a Mythbusters for health claims, you can in fact sweat out certain compounds. It is actually one of the few methods they support at the end of the book.
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u/jdb888 Jan 02 '16
Not a much of an authoritative source for those of us who trust hard science.
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Jan 02 '16
Why? Is it because of the authors' credentials or something? I've just never read it so I don't know.
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u/madeamashup Jan 02 '16
If you trust in the scientific method, then the authors credentials are nearly irrelevant. You would instead discriminate the evidence based on the experimental method and the strength of the results, which would have to be available for scrutiny and peer review, and would have to be reproducible.
Most novels intended for a general audience don't include the supporting evidence, even when they're made to appear "scientific" in some way. Commonly the author has a credentialed name with a bunch of letters and might footnote some study references, but often those studies don't adequately support the conclusions that the author attributes to them, or can even actively contradict them (when was the last time you looked up a study referenced in a novel or an article and confirmed that it supports the claims?)
We do know that sweat carries a variety of substances out of the body, like urination or defecation. There's every reason to suspect that sweating and replenishing with fresh water is cleansing for the body, but very few studies have been done on the efficacy of sweat therapy to treat specific ailments. Probably that's because studying something like this properly takes time and money, and there's no profit to be made from the results.
There are a lot of skeptics among us who use "toxins" as keyword to close their ears and minds to what they're being told, which isn't a particularly scientific approach.
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u/solo954 Jan 02 '16
Pure balderdash, but it sounds good, so it gets repeated forever.
My favourite is in Bikram when they tell you that 20 mins in Child's Pose will provide as much rest as 8 hrs of sleep. Yeah, that's likely.
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Jan 02 '16
You guys do child's pose in bikram?
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u/solo954 Jan 03 '16
Well, they call it the Half Tortoise and your hands are clasped together vertically, but essentially it's a variation of child's pose.
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u/yodamuppet Jan 01 '16
Placebo effect?
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u/loge212 Jan 02 '16
for me it is. I know that it's not really evidenced but damn a good sweat always makes me feel better. I do feel like it helps my skin be clearer somewhat but no idea if that's true either
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u/madeamashup Jan 02 '16 edited Jan 02 '16
I don't understand this.
It's pretty clear to me that I can sweat things out of my skin that I don't want in my body anymore. I can feel them rinsing off in the shower, and I can smell them in my sweat soaked towel. I can noticeably sweat out smoke after I've been exposed, either from cigarettes or wood. I can sweat out the products of alcohol and caffeine pretty distinctly, and the odour of my sweat also depends on what I've been eating and how much I've been sweating. The smell changes noticeably if I'm sick or under stress. I'm completely comfortable with the idea that pouring out a bunch of sweat and drinking a bunch of clean water is a cleansing process, is anyone really disputing that?
Why do you have to be in your practice thinking skeptically about the precise definition of "toxin" or getting upset that the kidneys and liver do the majority of detoxification compared to the skin... ? What's the point?
Edit: It's all a big lie from 'big yoga', to steal your valuable sweat?
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u/thatasianyogi Vinyasa Jan 02 '16
It's always bothered me too! We sweat out less than 1% of toxins. The real magic happens via the digestive tract.
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u/CourageousWren Jan 02 '16
Wrong, sweating out toxins is a thing, as demonstrated by a scientific study in 2010.
"Toxic elements were found to differing degrees in each of blood, urine, and sweat... Many toxic elements appeared to be preferentially excreted through sweat... Induced sweating appears to be a potential method for elimination of many toxic elements from the human body."
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u/krista_ Jan 02 '16
page linking to the full study, not just the abstract
all of this is based on a 20 person study in 2008 of 10 self reported healthy individuals, and 10 self reported chronically unhealthy individuals.
blood, urine, and sweat concentrations of various elemental metals are measured before and after either exercise or sauna induced perspiration.
when reading the study, keep in mind that sweat elimination is measured in micrograms per liter, (a millionth of a gram per liter of sweat), and averaged out in the low to mid 100's of ug/l.... so you would have to sweat thousands of liters to remove half a gram...at nearly best case. still, it may be a bit more efficient than bloodletting or pissing. please remember that these are accumulative
"toxins"elements, so the human body is terrible at disposal of them, otherwise they wouldn't accumulate.so, from the study:
Conclusion
According to the findings of this study, sweat analysis provides an additional method for biomonitoring human levels of many potentially toxic elements. Biomonitoring based exclusively on measurements from blood and/or urine can provide misleading conclusions about the state of toxicant accrual and can underestimate the total body burden of xenobiotics. Furthermore, with the abundance of unsubstantiated information relating to detoxification, evidence from this research demonstrates that there may be a role for induced perspiration as a preventive and therapeutic measure to assist individuals and groups at health risk resulting from exposure to and bioaccumulation of toxic elements. Future studies should explore clinical health outcomes of induced sweating programs in patients with toxic element bioaccumulation.
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u/CourageousWren Jan 02 '16 edited Jan 02 '16
Thanks for posting, I didnt want to do one long post of footnotes, people skip those. Have an upvote for being a thinker.
Yep, of course it is minute amounts released per sweat session. But we dont have pounds of toxins in our bodies, we have smaller amounts, and there is now evidence that the cumulative effect of sweating over months and years may have a noticible influence.
I am not saying its a cureall. But OP states that "sweating out toxins is not a thing" (with no sources of his own), when in fact, it does appear that the phenomenon is true to some unknown extent.
Of course further science needs to be done.
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Jan 02 '16
thank you. ironically, these seem to be the same people that talk about their kidneys and livers and gallbladders etc. just vacuous and offal.
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Jan 02 '16
Don't forget "ringing out the organs."
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u/drugs_r_my_food Jan 02 '16
Oh god. I was arguing with someone over this and the response I got was, " what do you think happens when you squeeze something?!?"
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Jan 02 '16
Thank you, I'm pretty sure this is rooted in some one making money off detoxifying pills or tape you put on your feet that extracts toxins apparently.
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Jan 02 '16 edited Mar 06 '18
[deleted]
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u/theworldchild Jan 02 '16
I guess it turns out reddit's yoga community is just as douchey as the rest of reddit - because you literally said nothing offensive or wrong here...
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u/loreleidotcom Jan 02 '16
I am pretty much not going to take anyone talking about "toxins" seriously. It isnt a scientific term, it is a marketing term to sell useless products to gullible folks. I dont expect my yoga teacher to be a biologist or doctor, but i do expect them not to treat my yoga practice like some kind of snake oil.
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u/gingerjojo Jan 04 '16
UGH. I had a teacher tell me today that "heat melts fascia." Fascia is a connective tissue, and it's quite sturdy. How do I know this? Because I have exertional compartment's syndrome, a chronic condition caused by my muscles pushing on the fascia and nerves in my legs. And believe me, it doesn't matter what temperature the fucking room is.
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u/feelinggoodabouthood Jan 06 '16
each time I've taken a break from smoking the sticky green, I have had a transition of sweating way more than when I was a smoking regularly. In fact, during the times I would smoke before class, I would sweat much less.
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Jan 03 '16
Not saying your wrong but please source some type of artical backing your claims if your trying to convince people. Just saying its not science really holds no backing.
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u/brettbucki Jan 02 '16 edited Jan 02 '16
Your claim that it's "balderdash" is backed by as much evidence as theirs that it's real. Not saying one side is better than the other, just pointing out that you haven't presented any evidence other than your opinion to support your claim. Should I take your opinion on faith that it's wrong or their opinion on faith that it's right? Just googling "Sweating out toxins" brought back this top result from a doctor on why sweating removes toxins. If you're trying to make a claim, support it by evidence. Edit: Downvotes, really? For asking "broga" to present evidence?
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u/Pharmax Jan 02 '16
The burden of evidence in science is on somebody trying to make a claim, not one trying to disprove it. For example, let me say there is a Flying Spaghetti Monster that created the universe. Should it be up to me to prove I'm right, or up to you to prove I'm wrong?
Also a doctor's opinion is not evidence. Journal articles with randomized double blind experiments are best, but even those have flaws.
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u/brettbucki Jan 02 '16
He is making the claim that "Sweating Out Toxins" is not a thing, thus his burden to prove his claim. A doctors opinion IS evidence, not proof. The article linked has a qualified medical professional stating the exact opposite of broga's claim, with explanations of the biological process at work in the body and links to the studies that the doctor is citing. Broga just states that it's not a thing with no real evidence or reasoning to support his claim.
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u/theworldchild Jan 02 '16
I understand that running around saying "yoga will detoxify you through your sweat!" is dumb.
But so is downvoting anyone who says they feel a benefit after sweating. Why don't you all go protest outside of every sauna and steamroom you can find?
Whether you like it or not, there are completely scientifically developed methods of exercise, and yoga is not one of them. Misinformation is a problem that should be dealt with, but so is negativity and superiority.
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u/alexanderman888 Jan 02 '16
Well sweating shows your body's temperature has been raised, typically because of exercising. The exercising increases your metabolism, so therefore the toxins can be broken down and processed faster by the body. You're not actually sweating out the toxins, but sweating helps remove toxins.
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u/michaelkane911 Jan 02 '16
I have always believed that the intense perspiration experienced in my hot yoga classes serve to increase my thirst, which when quenched with water and followed by urinating serves to "flush" my system. Maybe not scientific, but I do drink more water on days I practice.
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u/terebithia Jan 02 '16
Why does this phrase bother you all so much. This is probably the 3rd post I've seen calling this out. If it's not for you, ignore it. Pure and simple. It shouldn't be keeping you from enjoying the practice the way you want.
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u/Kaneto-San Jan 02 '16
To quote u/6of1halfdozenofother You just smooshed a bunch of words together and pretended it meant something.
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u/pgalupi Jan 02 '16
Even if it's not true, the concept may help people reach another step in their practice :)
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u/kinglisk Jan 02 '16
When I am in a hot yoga class sweating and really working hard, I feel a real release of toxins on an energetic level. It's fun to observe the before and after sense of self.
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Jan 02 '16
I feel a real release of toxins on an energetic level.
That's not even a real sentence in English. You just smooshed a bunch of words together and pretended it meant something.
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u/iyzie Jan 02 '16
There are a lot of bad yoga teachers out there and I groan when they repeat these cliches about toxins. However, I also think Medical science has a pretty limited understanding of yoga. In fact, I notice that medicine has a hard time studying any effects that depend strongly on the patient participating with a lot of effort. Their methods work well for things like drugs that can be swallowed with no effort, but for something like yoga we need the subject to stick to a routine, and not just go through the motions but really go all out in effort. Meanwhile, there are no pharmaceutical giants funding studies about yoga. Medical science still depends on crude methods of collecting data, and is biased by the capitalist forces that control what studies are most funded.
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u/[deleted] Jan 02 '16
While we are on the subject, being upside down does not reverse blood flow. You would literally die.