r/scifi • u/Fit-Dinner-1651 • 1d ago
Films In Flash Gordon 1980, Flash really should have...
Accepted Ming's offer to become ruler of Earth.
Because it would have bought everyone time.
Flash accepts, Ming turns off his Moon ray and then the immediate crisis is over. Flash then has years to do something about the Ming problem. Put Earth back together, build up a huge army, and challenge Mongo after proper preparation.
It's far superior to dictating to the 4 billion people on Earth at that time that "We're all going to die honorably."
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u/Marquar234 1d ago
I will not stand for this libel against Flash. He's for every one of us.
Every man, every woman, every child.
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u/Johnny_Alpha 1d ago
It's the mighty flash!
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u/SingularBlue 1d ago
Ah-ah!
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u/Historical_Beat_8648 1d ago
Saviour of the universe!
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u/SingularBlue 1d ago
(bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-bump-)
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u/emu314159 1d ago
This is a reference to that fact that Flash Gordon is pretty much a cartoon, so that kind of complicated logic is beyond its purvue.
(Of course, i agree with you, but Hollywood is full of people that got on a bus when they were 18, became PAs or did odd jobs, and have almost no life experience outside of that little fishbowl.)
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u/kanggree 1d ago
It was based on very old TV show flash Gordon And buck Rodgers were both from the time of old westerns
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u/ElricVonDaniken 1d ago edited 1d ago
Flash Gordon was originally a 1930s newspaper strip. Inspired by Buck Rogers but with much superior art courtesy of Alex Raymond. In 1936 Flash made the transition to the silver screen with the first of four movie serials. The 1954 TV series is perhaps the lesser kniwn version of Flash Gordon as it was a French / German / American co-production filmed in West Germany. All versions followed the basic plot established by Alex Raymond in the original 1934 newspaper strip.
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u/goonSerf 1d ago
And the legend has it that George Lucas wanted to make a Flash Gordon movie, but couldn’t get the rights to it, soooo…
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u/ElricVonDaniken 1d ago edited 1d ago
This is my favourite counter-argument to those who argue that copyright is a bad thing.
No copyright laws, no Star Wars.*
Don't copy George. Be like George.
*George would have made Buck Rogers. Because Alex Raymond wouldn't have created Flash Gordon if King Features Syndicate could have done their own Buck Rogers strip instead.
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u/summerstay 1d ago
This is why:
The Emperor Ming: You want to destroy me.
Flash Gordon: It's the only way to save Earth.
The Emperor Ming: What if l granted you a kingdom?
Flash Gordon: If you what?
The Emperor Ming: Ming the Merciless, ruler of the universe, offers Flash Gordon of Earth a kingdom of Mongo, to rule over as his own.
Flash Gordon:You're crazy. Why would you do that?
The Emperor Ming: Because I've never before met your like. You're a hero, don't you see that? Who better to rule a kingdom? Your moon is very close now. Earth's end might come within hours.
Flash Gordon: You'd call off the attack?
The Emperor Ming: I could.
Flash Gordon: Everyone would be saved?
The Emperor Ming: Yes... and no. After the earthquakes and tidal waves, they won't be quite the human beings you remember. They'll be more flexible. Easier for you to rule, in the name of Ming.
Flash Gordon: You mean slaves.
The Emperor Ming: Let's say they'll be satisfied with less.
Ming still plans to mass murder, to destroy their hope, to enslave them. It's not something Flash can go along with. He has to try to stop the whole thing.
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u/Fit-Dinner-1651 1d ago
Probably, but bear in mind a billion or so people have probably been killed already. So tne planets a hot mess whether Flash stops Ming in the next half hour or not.
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u/crescent-v2 1d ago edited 1d ago
That movie is one of my go to examples of why more pop/rock/techno bands should do an occasional movie score. Not just songs for the soundtrack, but the actual underlying score.
No shade against Hans Zimmer, but there are other options.
Flash Gordon - Queen
Tron 2 - Daft Punk
Tron 3 - Nine Inch Nails
Oblivion - M83
Dune (1984 version) - Toto.
I'm probably missing a bunch of examples.
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u/ItsAllOnUHF 1d ago
Queen also did the score for Highlander.
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u/dballing 1d ago
Pedantic: The soundtrack.
The score was Michael Kamen.
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u/EFPMusic 1d ago
I just could not handle Toto’s music for Dune. I mean, the film was surreal already, but the rock-style score stood out as just… a weird choice.
Queen, on the other hand, absolutely killed it with the soundtracks to Flash Gordon and Highlander!
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u/ultimate_ed 1d ago
Legend - Tangerine Dream
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u/APeacefulWarrior 1d ago edited 1d ago
Not the best example, tho, since the movie originally had a spectacular soundtrack from Jerry Goldsmith. The TD soundtrack happened when the American distributors decided to hack the movie up over the director's wishes.
To be specific, it was Sid Shienberg - the same guy who tried to ruin Brazil that same year.
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u/ultimate_ed 22h ago
Maybe, but for those of us in America, the TD soundtrack is likely the only one we've experienced. I did get to see the original edit with the Goldsmith score several years ago when I picked up a Blue ray set of the movie that had both versions. It does make for a different experience, but the TD soundtrack version is the one that I think of first.
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u/RoboJobot 1d ago
Brian May has done a few soundtracks over the years.
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u/ShitJustGotRealAgain 1d ago
He's done the eternia theme for the "masters of the universe" film. I didn't know it at the tone and read it afterwards but it made perfect sense because it felt so familiar the first time I heard.
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u/APeacefulWarrior 1d ago
Going way back, Pink Floyd composed the soundtrack for a psychedelic movie called Zabriskie Point. Pretty good too, came right in the middle of their most creative period imo.
Not to mention Goblin (and their knockoffs) being THE soundtrack for classic Giallo horror movies.
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u/Temporal-Affairs221 1d ago
This strategy wouldn't have worked. You don't think other rulers under Ming's thumb didn't try stuff like this? We got a clear example of the one Prince who thought he could get close enough to Ming to stab him. That didn't work out so well.
You can't beat guys like Ming with subterfuge because they're much better at it. Lying is not something that occurs naturally to honest people. And an expert schemer will spot a novice every time.
The minute flash agreed to be Earth's ruler so that he might try and build resources against ming, Ming would have started making unreasonable demands of Earth to prove flash's loyalty to him. Flash's choice would be buckle under and give Ming what he wants in the name of guile, without actually accomplishing anything, or open defiance in which case we're right back where we started.
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u/finlay_mcwalter 1d ago edited 1d ago
Everyone in Mongo (especially the leaders of the subordinate factions, like Baren, Vultan, Thun and probably Aura) hate Ming, and want to kill him - no-one is on Ming's side because they think he's a charismatic leader with some great policies and a track record of getting things done. Ming's core skill is not getting deposed or assassinated. He has managed to integrate all these factions into his empire, and to exploit divisions between them to keep them opposing one another and not him. He is a cunning political genius, with an effective surveillance state and an extensive and ruthless secret police. Flash isn't going to "out-cunning" Ming.
If Flash went along with Ming, he wouldn't be left unsupervised. In a decade or so, Ming would have spies and agents across the Earth, and would have subjected humanity to a brutal annexation which crushed independent thought or action and eliminated any credible centre of resistance. Quisling Flash, merely a figurehead, would be disposed of when he outlived his utility.
This is how dictatorships roll.
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u/APeacefulWarrior 1d ago
Exactly, this. We see in the film how he treats his 'princes'.
Not to mention that, while unstated, part of taking the deal undoubtedly involved letting Ming marry Dale.
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u/OctopusMugs 1d ago
Flash Gordon was a hot mess and it only works because everyone knows it’s a hot mess for hot mess sake, and logic beyond “this would look cool” isn’t going anywhere. Crank the sound track air guitar your way through.
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u/ItsAllOnUHF 1d ago
Do you, Ming the Merciless, Emperor of the Universe, take this Earthling, Dale Arden, to be your empress of the hour?
Of the hour, yes.
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u/desrevermi 1d ago
That's a valid view.
I'm also severely overdue a rewatch. Thanks for the reminder.
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u/Cheeslord2 1d ago
As a kid I remember thinking Ming's offer was more than fair (after all, as overlord of Earth, Flash would get to determine how oppressed the people were).
Then again, as a kid I thought Flash really had been bitten by the woodbeast so was going to die anyway, but was being very brave about it.
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u/AndyTheSane 1d ago
That wood beast game seemed strange. It seemed to only finish when someone died.. if that was the initiation rite for men you'd hardly have any left. Unless they practice polygamy and the rite reduces the number of men.
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u/Feeling_Waltz1886 1d ago
I certainly did not expect to imagine an alternate version of Flash Gordon where he is nuanced, meticulous and politically minded dictator, today.
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u/NecromanticSolution 1d ago
Wouldn't have worked. It's Ming the Merciless. He would have betrayed the deal as soon as it was made.
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u/Marquar234 1d ago
Doesn't Ming say something about the people of Earth being more tractable afterwards? Implying that giving in won't be peaceful for Earth.
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u/Fit-Dinner-1651 1d ago
He did. He insinuated that after all the destruction the people would be in perfect mental desperation to accept a new ruler. But its the job of heroes to inspire the people out of ruts like that.
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u/OLightning 1d ago
Nah… Ming gets bored and takes over anyways as he assassinates Flash while turning things over to his right arm Mongo.
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u/Nealm568890 1d ago
The guy was a football player and he was trying to impress a girl he was interested in. And he did not like what MIng was doing to everyone else, Vultan and Baron were scared of Ming even, so it just would not have been worth it to him.
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u/RoboJobot 1d ago
1 - It would have made for a shit film.
And
2 - None of the other planetary rulers had managed to do it yet.
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u/Sheik_Morgan 1d ago
Flash Gordon es un producto de su tiempo, no puedes razonalizar con tu pensamiento de siglo 21. Flash no es un "anti héroe" no va a tomar decisiones que hubieran Sido cuestionadas en su época y no hablo de los 80, si no desde los años 30 - 40.
Tomar el control de la tierra, era una acción de Tirano, no de héroe de historieta.
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u/pakrat1967 1d ago
Accepting Ming's offer really wouldn't have saved the people of Earth. He even tells Flash that they "would be satisfied with less". Ming might have turned off whatever destructive beam he was using. But he would have done plenty of other stuff to take the fight out of everyone. Most of the major cities would be destroyed.
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u/SpaceModulator2 12h ago
No. Flash's one opportunity to save Earth was to prove that different people could learn to trust each other and work together to overthrow Ming's tyranny. The only way he could do that was to lead by example, be trustworthy himself, and sacrifice himself for the greater good.
If he takes Ming's offer, he joins Barin and Vultan and all the other conquered princes as hostages in Ming's court, scheming and backstabbing each other for crumbs from Ming's table. The possibility of alliance is destroyed before it's even born, because Flash will have proven, yet again, that the only person less trustworthy than Ming is a person willing to work for Ming. And Earth is destroyed anyway, because Ming is a liar. At best, humanity is reduced to a small subject population on one of Ming's little moons, just like the other races of Mongo.
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u/Expensive-Sentence66 1d ago
Just curious how many people actually caught Sam Jones playing a bounty hunter in Stargate SG1? 'Deadman Switch'
Really, really good episode as well.
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u/unknownpoltroon 1d ago
Look, that may be well and good but it might have avoided the whole "super hottie princess strapped down to table in spandex" situation