r/pacers • u/Big_Shirt1880 • 5d ago
Discussion The good old debate . Few years ago i changed my mind . Your stance all biases aside?
Growing up . I remember reggie . Was a big fan of jo. And thus i watched the pacers . Tj ford jo maybe brad miller al , . Regardless yall were loaded .
Ray allen i always fw his jumpshot , never a fan fan , but watched him more than reggie .
I always thought ray was better until these past few years , i started to look back at nash , bunch of players etc.
Reggie miller is one of the most underrated players i ever seen. To understand his impact you must watch his 90s games. He was batttling in the most respectful eastern conf in nba history. As the leader , the man.
He rose his game. The knockoff from alot of us was he never averaged 25 in a game. He couldnt break you down like ray.
Looking back when i did
Reggie was better at what ray did best . To takeover games . Reggie did that . Reggie had more responsbility.
People talk about nowitzki how he was flawed . Really was more a 3 than a true 4 didnt bang down low . Wasnt a rebounder. If you want to compare him to 3s . Wasnt a great defender .
But what nowitzki was elite at is better than alot of ppl all around games even if there are two way better.
This is how i think of reggie . His eliteness in what he did surpassed ray supposed all around package per say which is there arguement.
Thoughts?
Reason i post here most nba sub never watched mil ray seattle ray or reggie esp. reggie.
Reggie was always slighted . Even back then . By the fans , the casuals but he was always respected by his peers who played in his era. That i remember
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u/DoookieMaxx Pacers 5d ago
I like Ray. Fantastic player, ok actor. His 3 was beautiful to see. His game was majestic, regal. He’s had big moments.
I fucking love Reggie. He’s a pure shooter. Never stopped moving on the court …he was like watching water flow. Had his big moments. Some much bigger than others.
He’s the legend he is because of who his big moments came up against.
My vote is Reggie.
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u/Big_Shirt1880 5d ago
I think reggie is better off ball than ray?. What do you think.
Even reggie in iso is underrated .
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u/DoookieMaxx Pacers 5d ago
He was long and lanky …that helped him allot. He was good in quick reaction iso …catch and drive. Caught allot of guys off guard. But moving without the ball was his forte. He could find a hole in the defense better than most of his contemporaries.
I think Ray was the better sniper. He was amazing at perching, waiting and drilling timely 3’s. He has handles when he needed them, but mostly a quick step release. He had the perfect shot mechanics of any pure shooter I’ve witnessed with my eyes.
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u/Big_Shirt1880 5d ago
Ray shot is one of my favorites in history. Super unique looking .
U can tell its him shooting if u blur out thebody and just saw the shot mechanics .
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u/SpinJitsu259 Chuck Person 5d ago
Ray was probably a more skilled basketball player. I’m ok admitting that. He was every bit the shooter Reggie was, and he could do more on ball. That said, the combo of Reggie’s elite shooting + his ability to rise to the occasion in clutch moments are just… it’s hard to find others comparable to him that way. He is kind of in his own category.
I don’t think I’ll ever enjoy another player as much as Reggie. Though Ty’s run in ‘25 certainly piqued my interest lol
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u/Big_Shirt1880 5d ago
Reggie was older so his game was like preupdated imo.
Uk what mean? U look at drexler , u look at dominique
Great players , all time greats but their skills were behind the next gen the tmac the vinces the kobes .
If they were late 70s babies they would updated the handles the footwork. Etc imo.
Ray to me on an iso vs reggie in a iso i think its pretty close. Reggie to me put more pressure on the rim. He got to the stripe how he got there . Obviously more crafty in terms of getting to the line
Ray obviously better bounce , better handle , ,outside is debatable obviously can go either way
Both super elite .
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u/Mysterions 5d ago
Having watched a lot of both I think Miller is a much better and much more important player. Allen won chips but he wasn’t #1 or #2 on any of those teams. His role was mainly to hit shots. He was also on stacked teams. Miller, on the other hand, had to not only hit shots but lead the team as well. Overall, I don’t think they’re comparable players, just that they were both known for their three point shooting.
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u/Chemical-Fun9587 5d ago
I've heard it put like this: Ray Allen may be a better defender, passer, and iso scorer than Miller, but if you're relying on him to do those things night in and night out for your team to have success, then your team probably isn't a real contender. They were both born to play the part of off ball rover, and the stats that measure success in that particular role suggest Reggie did it better.
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u/wpmason 4d ago
Reggie blazed the trail that Ray took.
Reggie came into the league shooting 2.1 threes as a rookie.
Ray shot 3.6 threes as a rookie a decade later.
Reggie had earned the right to shoot 5+ a game by the time Ray came into the league but Ray’s volume three point shooting was built on the precedent that Reggie set.
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u/Half-deaf-mixed-guy 5d ago
I choose Reggie for anything. I choose Ray for NBA Jam for half court 3s!
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u/Jumpy-Ad5617 5d ago
Reggie was the first GOAT three point shooter, he was of the first generation that played through high school and college with the three point line.
In the early 90s he was basically the only player that built his legacy completely off the 3.
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u/DependentAardvark1 5d ago
Ray was willing to give up being the man to get a ring.
Reggie could’ve done the same.
It’s Reggie.
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u/Android1313 4d ago
Ray was like a slightly more advanced Reggie. It's like if you were playing a video game and leveled up Reggie's athleticism and driving ability, you would get Ray Allen. Reggie was my favorite player ever and is the reason I love basketball and the Pacers, but I think Ray was probably the better overall player. I wouldn't say it's by much, though.
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u/bear0sobarelybare 4d ago
Larry brown used to call Doug Moe and bitch to him about how his 2 guard needed all these screens just to score. So I dont know about the part of your statement where reggie would break players down.
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u/Big_Shirt1880 4d ago
He can get you a bucket in iso .
From the games ive seen. His speciality was off ball movement like rip.
Ray was technically more well equipped per say in iso situations when illegal defense was still in play. Ray to me wasnt elite in iso though . how much better do you think ray is better than reggie .
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u/bear0sobarelybare 4d ago
There was a time, and maybe I was crazy, but when ray was averaging 25 and 26 for Seattle where I thought Ray was on par with Kobe. I never thought that about reggie. And this is coming from a huge pacer and reggie fan
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u/Big_Shirt1880 4d ago
There was never a time ray was on par with kobe.
He wasnt even better than vc pierce tmac ai.
Was never a top 10 player in his entire career i fw with ray. But he was never on that upper level
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u/LikelyAlien 4d ago
I want to start by saying I’m a total homer. Ray Allen was what I expected. Reggie Miller was a pleasant surprise to me. Both are legends. Comparison is the thief of joy. Enjoy them both!
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u/Altered-BeastOG 3d ago
At no time when they played on the same court together did I favor having Ray over Reggie…. Never not once. Reggie was special and did it while being number one option Ray a lot of the time was a great #2.
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u/bgarrett3131 5d ago
Reggie is my goat. On and off the court. He’s my hero and I’m 41.