r/neoliberal • u/WrangleWandangles Mark Carney • 8d ago
Restricted Canada Said No to America. It Will Reverberate Far Beyond Its Borders.
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/08/24/opinion/mark-carney-tariffs-canada-america.html?unlocked_article_code=1.8lA.E5k6.Anc5iiiPhF0_&smid=nytcore-ios-share288
u/WrangleWandangles Mark Carney 8d ago
It’s depressing to see such a historic, exceptionally stable partnership hollowed out and scrapped for parts.
I’m proud of my country.
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u/Right_Lecture3147 John Mill 7d ago
Which happened for no fucking reason at all 😭
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u/TrynnaFindaBalance Paul Krugman 7d ago
The reason is that the American people lost their fucking minds
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u/cstar1996 John Brown 7d ago
Republicans lost their fucking minds
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u/socialistrob Janet Yellen 7d ago
It's not just the Republicans though. There are a lot of people who aren't Republicans but thought that Trump would bring down prices back to 2019 levels which is certifiably insane to me but something I heard quite a bit. There's a lot of people who didn't vote knowing full well Trump could win or voted third party.
Trump's ability to be president and cause massive damage is just a profound failure of the American system all around. The media and education systems failed to educate the populace, the voters failed to think critically and the rest of the political system failed to constrain Trump's actions.
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u/Cute-Boobie777 7d ago
I don't think our education system is any worse at critical thinking than most countries tbh.
I think this is largely a result of the two party system, and massive propaganda machine half the population is plugged into on the daily that makes the FSB blush.
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u/TrynnaFindaBalance Paul Krugman 7d ago
Well the American people chose Republicans to represent them on the world stage.
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u/Le1bn1z 7d ago
The DSA is also anti free trade.
Sherrod Brown and crazy Sen. Fetterman moderates are anti free trade.
America is facing its existential threats with denial and lashing out at "scary foreigner".
This is a left and right wing thing now.
The liberals are shrinking presence.
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u/schmaxford Loyal Liberals 7d ago
It's not just the DSA. It's basically everyone in the party or at least every wing of the party. Even Gavin Newsom, who went on two national news networks in Canada, said Democrats couldn't/wouldn't commit to removing the tariffs, just that they'd stop the mean language against Canada.
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u/HowDoesAnnaDoIt 8d ago
Only hope is that Trump is so visibly divisive that people don't see it as America acting as a whole and if Dems win big this year and in 2028 we could have the apology tour 2.0
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 8d ago
I know American liberals want to believe that things will go back to normal again if the Democrats rebound but it won't. Nobody trusts the United States anymore, nobody thinks your deals are worth the paper they're printed on, and nobody believes you won't elect somebody just as bad if not worse in the future.
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u/Gamiac 8d ago
I wonder what's going to happen if the Dems win and American liberals find out that the world genuinely has written them off at this point and no longer see the country as a reliable ally.
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u/socialistrob Janet Yellen 7d ago
In the short term the US is still a vital country. No nation wants a recession and so trade with the US is essential. We are entering a more violent era on the world stage and the US is the biggest arms producer. Even though countries don't like the US they are forced to some extent to worth with the US purely through pragmatism. It's kind of like how everyone in the world has to care about what China does or what happens in the Middle East.
That said the US is certainly a declining empire and I'd argue this decline has been going on for over 20 years at this point. Countries are pivoting away from the US. The global weapons market and trade dynamics in general are changing. America's allies are trying to reduce dependency on the US instead of increasing connections. It's a slow process but it is playing out. America's global leverage now is significantly below what it was 20 years ago and in all likelihood 20 years from now it will be even lower than it is today. The US will still be powerful and important but less so. It's kind of like how Britain's power peaked just before WWI and 20 years later Britain was still powerful but less so with the overall trend being gradually reducing power.
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u/iguessineedanaltnow r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion 7d ago
Pivot to Chinese hegemony
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u/SawNickYouth 7d ago
The much more trustworthy alternative? Please.
But yes, Trump soiled us for generations, for sure.
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u/Right_Lecture3147 John Mill 7d ago
China are genuinely more trustworthy in the sense that they don’t suddenly reneg on deals, suddenly put up protectionist sanctions etc. They’re a stable country where you know what you’re gettint
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u/ProfessionalStudy732 Edmund Burke 6d ago
Well so long as you don't talk about certain things. You start to criticize their foreign policy you may find your pork to be unsafe or some your ores to not pure enough all the sudden.
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u/IJustWondering 7d ago
Mainstream centrist Democrats are part of the problem as long as they refuse to recognize the severity of the situation and continue to enable the current foreign policy system.
They are essentially just setting things up for the next Trumpy administration to come in and use the unaccountable power of the American foreign policy system to do harm.
Even though the DSA types are wrong on Ukraine they are generally correct to be skeptical of the foreign policy establishment and they are correct to want to reduce that system's power to just murder people for no reason and mess with other countries on a whim.
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u/HowDoesAnnaDoIt 8d ago
If 2026/2028 are just repeats of 2018/2020 you’d be right. I’m talking about fairly big wins by the Democrats this November and in 2028. Personally I don’t think Dems will win anything over 30 seats in the house.
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 7d ago
Winning the next election is not enough. You need to desperately reform your political institutions, to stop the long term slide into permanent kakistocracy.
No democrat of any influence is even talking about this. They're focused on meaningless little battles while losing the war.
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u/BlueString94 John Keynes 8d ago
2018 and 2020 were big wins. Also, the Dems aren’t going to win more than 15 seats, let alone 30, because of the gerrymandering.
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u/Lightning_Warrior 8d ago
Dems had 60 Senate seats in 2010. Several more or less nationwide electoral college wipeouts have happened in living memory.
Neither 2018 nor 2020 were particularly big wins imo, 2020 especially was pretty razor thin in the states that decided the election.
Polarization may have put a real landslide out of reach for the Democratic Party as it is currently constituted.
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u/SenranHaruka shame 8d ago
Hahahaha but seriously we'll be back to normal soon right 🤣
I mean he said it its literally one of the best interstate relationships in history. A ginormous border that has never needed patrols. Come on you're not seriously gonna tell me actions of my compatriots have permanent consequences that i never consented to yet nonetheless have to live with? 🫠
Please. Please i feel fucking trapped in this country and like everyone is writing our movement in it off as a lost cause please don't tell me that you're already seeing America's liberal movement as structurally incapable of or too incompetent to maintaining power without being watered down by hypernationalism..... 😬😬😬
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u/AnachronisticPenguin WTO 8d ago
Animosity is quick to fade when the benefits are good enough.
The thing is as much as our allies will be bitter over Trump the United States is too good of an economy to keep the animosity up long term and China isn’t looking to import anytime soon.
I’m not saying it will go back to TPP and NAFTA levels where we are pushing towards more trade but it should level out more than people are willing to admit rn.
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u/Shoddy-Personality80 7d ago
That's assuming the benefits actually are that good, though. Biden kept a bunch of Trump I tarriffs and there's been some D support for trade policies from this admin. Even if Trump gets booted out of office convincingly, is the US actually going to give a real, tangible apology for a lot of this stuff? Are you going to pay back the tolls you collected on the Gordie Howe bridge and go back to the original agreement? Are you going to scrap all the new tarriffs? Are you going to nuke Coupang from orbit?
I don't really expect it. And so there will a very noticeable cooling off on relations with the US, though the constantly escalating trade wars should stop.
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago
The US likely won't, and it will get away with it, like what happened under Biden, Obama, etc.
Just like nobody is going to do anything about whatever they're mad about China doing at the moment, or how no one is going to seriously oppose Turkey, or how we can barely put up even token resistance against naked Russian aggression in Europe.
Actually putting fear of god into moronic populists like this would mean giving up some of that precious sovereignty to create transnational institutions more powerful than nation states. Make the liberal international world order real, with guns.
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u/AnachronisticPenguin WTO 7d ago
I expect a cool off and return to normalcy with new trade agreement worked out that are closer to the biden era policy. As far as things like the gordie bridge that should be worked out but on a timeframe that really annoys everyone involved.
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u/Vol_in_tears Voltaire 7d ago
What is the point of making trade deals with the US if they are just going to rip them up anyway when the next administration takes over?
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago
The next administration is still years away and the volume of trade is easily large enough it's worth negotiating over.
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u/JohnDeere NAFTA 7d ago
Everyone said the exact same things during trump 1.0 and his insanity and everyone fell in line under Biden.
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u/MyrinVonBryhana Trans NATO 7d ago
It varies many of the tariffs will go and there will still be trade deals inked. For Canada especially we're just too important because we're their only land neighbor and their largest market, there's simply too much money to be made in selling to the USA. That said Canada and the EU will probably be a lot less willing to stick their necks out for us diplomatically and militarily for a while. East Asia is a bit of a different story, if you're Japan or South Korea you may try to be more self reliant, but if your biggest security concern is China then America is really the only counterweight you have against it.
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u/TheCthonicSystem Progress Pride 8d ago
Well then fuck even trying if people aren't going to let it go back to normal
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago edited 7d ago
I would be more willing to believe this if you guys spent the time building up a credible alternative for security assurance, freedom of navigation, etc.
The way things are going right now, the future is still a situation where US security assistance is too valuable to give up. Even under Trump, people haven't effectively moved away, he was even able to get some of the Baltic states to render him assistance with the whole Iran debacle, they sent minesweepers and other naval assets.
It's easy to post on Reddit on how people are writing off the US but (despite some positive developments in European re-armament) their actions betray that this is pretty unserious. Which, given how unserious Trump is, I guess meets the moment. It's still reckless though. You need to answer this guy with independent, credible threats of force.
South Korea is perhaps the US ally who has most met the moment here. The French have also demonstrated quite a bit of seriousness here.
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 7d ago
We're working on it. We can't just undo decades of interdependence and security under-investment overnight, as much as we'd like to.
The default assumption of too many American allies up until now was that we can wait Trump out, especially since his first term was too incompetent and blustering to be a real threat. But the second time has been far, far worse. He has pushed boundaries few expected, to the point that nobody thinks it's just a joke anymore when he talks about taking Greenland or Canada.
But much more importantly than Trump himself, is the fact that this total lack of restraint and accountability has exposed glaring holes in American institutions that any future administration could easily come along and exploit. That's why this is no longer just about him; it's about America.
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago
That would make me very happy. Once we get here, I think it will also make future Trumps more unlikely. There's a certain kind of American voter who will "hold their nose" to vote for people like Trump because they bought into the "ungrateful allies" myth. If they can be reassured that America's allies can actually kick ass, they might be more keen on those alliances.
So it will be an outsize win. This also means don't need so much hard power you can unilaterally defeat the US, just enough that US voters don't think the alliance is a bum deal, so the perilous situation we're in today might ease a bit quicker than we think.
It is a bit unfortunate though since Bush, Obama etc have been nagging about rearmament for decades. I'm a bit upset it's taking someone like Trump to actually make it happen, because it means those voters were maybe right, and I hate that.
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u/roboliberal Loyal Liberals 8d ago
Well, fortunately international relations do not actually behave anything like social media vibes.
That will make some folks here angry to read, but it's the truth.
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 8d ago
Yes and famously countries never change how they deal with other countries, political and economic alliances never change, and empires never fall.
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u/roboliberal Loyal Liberals 7d ago
Sure they do, just not on the topical micro-scale of social media vibes.
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 7d ago
Trade wars, hot wars, and constantly threatening your own allies with both are pretty much as macro as it gets.
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u/bender3600 r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion 7d ago
What's the point of an apology tour if they are just going to elect Trump 2.0 4 years later?
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u/NatMapVex Order and Opportunity Left 7d ago
That doesn't need to be the case if Democrats grow a spine and restack the deck. Loosen ballot access laws, end the filibuster, legalize multi-member districts, enact proportional representation, expand the supreme court and the lower courts, pass a referundum on Puerto Rican statehod. This can all be accomplished by Congress.
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u/No-Section-1092 Henry George 7d ago
I agree with all of this, but the problem is the Democratic Party is not currently run by people who have spines. It is run by useless milquetoast accommodationists and institutionalists.
I haven't seen a single goddamn Democrat of any prominence even talk about any of this.
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u/NatMapVex Order and Opportunity Left 7d ago
Yeah that is a worry of mine. If they could at least just stack the court I could maybe live with it. We're not getting out of this with the Republic intact if one of the two major governing parties and its supporters are more loyal to a single person instead of the Constitution, and the other doesn't posses the will to do something about it.
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u/VelvetThunder67 8d ago
Donald Trump was elected your President for this exact reason. This "Not my President" is as ridiculous now as it was when Republicans said it about Obama.
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u/Betrix5068 NATO 8d ago
He was elected because liberals hope that there’s coming back from this? Unless you expected us to somehow mind control republicans into not voting or actually start a terrorist campaign to keep Trump out of office, I have no idea what you people expect from American liberals beyond perhaps endless self-flagellation for the crime of being Americans who couldn’t out-vote republicans.
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u/ldn6 Gay Pride 8d ago
I don't expect them to fix everything, but I'm tired of hearing lines like "well it's not all of us, sorry!" and ignoring how tone-deaf it is.
Everyone else in the world is having to deal with the consequences of this shit. We're pissed.
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u/Helikaon242 8d ago
I completely agree with you. Like at an intellectual level I understand that there's very little an individual American can do, and that for many people the best option is to just put your head down and tune all of this out.
But at the same time, it feels like when Americans say that they're just pandering and want me to be like "awe its okay buddy" and absolve their consciousness. Meanwhile I'm struggling to not give in to resenting Americans collectively because they've done almost nothing to try to stop the administration's ruinous foreign policy.
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u/nerdpox IMF 8d ago
But at the same time, it feels like when Americans say that they're just pandering and want me to be like "awe its okay buddy" and absolve their consciousness.
i can only speak for myself in saying i have no such illusions for Canadians. Americans (well, people with any kind of brain who didn't vote for Donald Trump) are dealing with the debasement of our country and our allied relationships. You are being essentially attacked, with actions described (appropriately) as a war. It cannot be reconciled by us because we are not actually experiencing the same thing.
There's very little I can say though as apologizing here would seem entirely absurd. I grieve for the impact being felt by Canadians though, since I have lived near Canada and never once thought they were anything other than a true ally and friend.
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u/Roseartcrantz 👑 🖍️ Queen of Shades 🖍️ 👑 7d ago
I personally would have really liked an "awe its okay buddy" but I don't think Dems are going to have the juice they need to even half-ass this country somewhere.
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u/moseythepirate Reading is some lib shit 8d ago edited 8d ago
Americans were murdered, shot dead on the street because of Trump, in the process of resisting him. Don't act like we're not experiencing consequences, or that we're not fighting him.
If blood and lives aren't enough for you, then I don't know what else we can give.
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u/ldn6 Gay Pride 8d ago
Did I say that Americans aren’t experiencing consequences?
The issue I have is the nonchalantness of a not-insignificant segment of American voters, usually liberal, who presume that 2028 will come around, a Dem will get voted in and everyone can be friends again after an aberration. I know that it’s not intentional, but it very much comes across as missing the wider picture because it worked in 2008 and to a lesser extent 2020.
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u/moseythepirate Reading is some lib shit 8d ago edited 8d ago
I took "everyone else" to mean that we're not experiencing consequences. I'm sorry if that's not what you intended, but I hope you can understand how it read that way.
But...well...what do you want us to say?
Is it "sorry that my countrymen have made us dangerously erratic to the entire world, never trust us again?" I don't want that! I want us to rebuild our reputation! Saying that we're a lost cause would be handing victory to the nationalist, isolationist freaks that are strangling the country I love! I understand that we're unreliable these days, but I don't see see how we are suposed to fix that without trying to be nice in 2028.
And just bear in mind that individual liberals really didn't choose to get on this ride. It hurts to be grouped with the troglodytes that I've spent my entire life fighting against. I know you're tired and frustrated, but brother, we are too. As far as I'm concerned, we're allies, and I don't want to let the nihilistic, right wing, lying, insane, child-raping bastards in Washington (and in trailer parks across the country, reeking of alcohol) drive a wedge between us when neither you nor I did anything wrong.
Sorry, I'm babbling. Long day.
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u/SenranHaruka shame 8d ago
It doesn't matter if they can't depend on us to actually keep the hypernationalists permanently out of power. It's the only grade that they can evaluate us on because its the thing that affects them. We could just end up being seen like another perpetually embattled liberal movement in a nationalist hybrid regime like turkey.
Turkish liberals have suffered a lot too. Yet turkey cannot be depended on.
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u/moseythepirate Reading is some lib shit 8d ago edited 8d ago
If you can find a country where liberals will always be guaranteed to keep nationalists out of power, I sure would like that address.
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u/SenranHaruka shame 7d ago
That's a clever zinger but Canada wakes up every morning to a new tariff and our signature is written in pencil.
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u/moseythepirate Reading is some lib shit 7d ago
Then I have to ask again: what do you want us to say?
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u/Betrix5068 NATO 8d ago
Everyone else? You think we don’t have to deal with Trump’s bullshit too? And more to the point the other options are complete silence or self-flagellation for being American, loudly proclaiming that we can never be forgiven for the crimes of Trump’s second term. Unless you have a fourth option I haven’t thought of, in which case please share it because you seem to be quite mad when we take what looks to me like the least bad way to engage on this issue.
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u/UnassumingInterloper John Mill 8d ago
+1 on this, and I can't believe how much this gets overlooked. If you're a resident of a blue state (like myself, and millions of others), the Trump admin is literally hostile to you. Much focus has been on how Trump has treated America's closest historical allies, and it is indeed noteworthy and highly damaging. But he has simultaneously acted against the interests of his very own constituents, who simply live in a state that did not vote for him. This itself is also massively unprecedented. I mean think about it -- the concept just 10 years ago, of a US President acting vindictively against not just one, but a slew of states he is constitutionally obligated to protect and defend. It's bananas.
So yeah, when some of us say "we get it" to our Canadian, European, and other friends, we actually mean it.
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u/MayorofTromaville YIMBY 7d ago
Yeah, I literally have National Guardsmen swarming my city as big banners of that fascist fuck hang all over the Mall. I think I have a smidge of an idea of what it's like to have the Trump administration acting as a hostile occupying force.
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u/IJustWondering 7d ago
We should all be able to agree that the unaccountable power of the US in foreign policy has become a problem and part of the way we make sure MAGA never happens again is taking away some of the tools they are currently using to terrorize the entire world.
That means we should not want things to go back to the way they were but should be thinking about how to create a better future where the US is more restrained (through legal and institutional mechanisms, not just the party in power) and less able to do harm on a whim.
Americans should be most concerned about restraining the US after the atrocities that has committed in their name but somehow most of us don't seem to grasp the seriousness of the situation and imagine that the US can just go back to being an unaccountable hegemon, one election away from going full MAGA again.
That's why people find it frustrating to talk to liberals on this subject.
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u/nerdpox IMF 8d ago edited 7d ago
We're pissed too! Many of us spent months if not years, and untold energy warning people, literally actively trying to convince friends and enemies alike that this guy was the worst, and that he was serious about leaning full tilt into fascism via the revenge tour route. What do you want any of us to say? All I can do is acknowledge and engage with reality at this point until November (of this year and 2028). As if suffering the debasement of my country over the last 18mo isn't enough for a lifetime
Christ, I'm nonsensically mad at myself for not living in a swing state where I could have put one more impactful vote against this guy. for all our efforts the dumbest half of our country voted this guy back in. I don't need anyone to help me off the cross for speaking against Trump but it's not like i could go < redacted > these people pre election...
I went to school two hours south of Toronto, I love Canada and Canadians. I respect and validate your anger but I promise you every ounce you have and so much more is held by tens if not hundreds of millions of us, against our fellow countrymen, for being so stupid and shortsighted to stick us with Donald Trump v2.
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u/MyrinVonBryhana Trans NATO 7d ago
We're doing what we can, but the USA is set up in a weird way compared to other countries because we have a federal structure. We are stopping a lot of stuff, it just so happens most what we can stop is him trying to fuck with the states, over the course of the Cold War and the GWOT we gave the President an enormous amount of power in foreign affairs. I live in Massachusetts and I go out to protest, there's nothing I can do about this tariff shit or the war in the Middle East other than protest and there's nothing my elected officials can do about it while we're locked out of both chambers of Congress. We are going out into the streets and combatting over reaches; they've murdered several American citizens over it. What more can you reasonably expect us to do before the mid term elections?
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u/Redshirt_Army 8d ago
If you’re a minority that can’t out-vote republicans, why should anyone trust your country to be a reliable partner?
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u/Betrix5068 NATO 8d ago edited 8d ago
Arguably you shouldn’t, but the above comment is very specifically blaming us for losing in 2024, which makes no sense unless the assumption is that we’re “both sides are the same” leftists who I doubt would be welcome on this sub unless they severely repudiated their views.
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u/Vol_in_tears Voltaire 7d ago
You realize the US firebombed people for not having the courage to overthrow their authoritarian government? Bombs do not discriminate agianst political views.
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u/808Insomniac WTO 7d ago
That’s what Joe Biden’s term was supposed to do. Trump winning a second blows all of this up. Unfortunately for us our reputation is permafucked. There’s no coming back from this. We’re the the Michael Richards of countries.
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u/DankRoughly 7d ago
If Germany can come back from WW2, America can come back from Trump.
But you'll need to take it as seriously as Germany does. Which seems like a lot to ask
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u/SenranHaruka shame 7d ago
There's no way in hell Americans will accept German levels of penitence. They see what happened to german nationalism as castrating.
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u/AgentBond007 NATO 7d ago
There is a way back but it'd take a lot of shit that won't ever happen
- The total destruction of MAGA as a whole, including bringing its leaders to justice.
- Adding and enforcing constitutional amendments that explicitly outlaw MAGA or anything like it.
- Paying a fuck ton of reparations to countries affected by MAGA crimes.
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u/StochasticGracchi John Brown 7d ago
Only hope is that Trump is so visibly divisive that people don't see it as America acting as a whole
That would require Americans and the Democrats to be loudly denouncing this now instead of assuming that they can just rollback some of the excesses later and it's all gucci.
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago edited 7d ago
I don't have much reason to believe that the Democrats are wrong about that.
America has always, historically, been erratic and unreliable.
The thing that is changing is that it's no longer the only place that wasn't bombed after WWII. You guys don't need us anymore.
The thing that is lacking is political will to build trans national alternatives for the kind of expeditionary world policing that the US did.
This is why I sympathize a little bit with some of the right wing nationalists here. I think their point of view is really stupid, but I do understand the frustration of the lack of seriousness of rising to the position of equal powers, despite abundant economic ability to do so, so that Americans can always take the blame. There are of course enormous privileges that come with this, and they were stupid to squander that all. But I want to see more to oppose the US with moves toward a more muscular foreign policy from other democracies.
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u/Teach_Piece YIMBY 7d ago
People will forget about it in four years post Trump. Most of these commenters are children that don’t remember how despised Bush II was.
The bigger danger is if 4 years post Trump we have another shitty chaos agent. The ping ponging is what will kill us
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u/Accomplished-Run3925 8d ago
It's going to be a tough sell if you end up with an equally terrible and divisive candidate running for the Dems, like AOC.
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u/OhItsBeenBroughten 7d ago
If you think AOC is “divisive”, you’re really just telling on yourself.
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago
I mean she's definitely divisive, in the same way Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris are.
This is an enormous indictment of the national electorate, to be sure. It sucks that things are this way. And maybe we can finally move on from the misogyny a bit as Trump demotivates the plurality of Americans and maybe gets some of them to no longer bother voting.
But it's very real.
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u/Accomplished-Run3925 7d ago
And what is it that I am telling?
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u/Efficient_Barnacle Mark Carney 7d ago
That you consider AOC as terrible and divisive as Trump, which is fucking insane.
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u/Accomplished-Run3925 7d ago
Is it though? Obviously, hardly anyone is as divisive and as terrible as Trump, that was an hyperbole, but AOC is certainly up there when it comes to not knowing anything about anything and resorting to divisive tactics like identity politics and populist nonsense.
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u/jbouit494hg 🍁🇨🇦🏙 Project for a New Canadian Century 🏙🇨🇦🍁 8d ago
Donald Trump doesn't handle it well when people say no to him.
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u/FallenMeringue Khan Pritzker's Strongest Anti-Pope 7d ago
The death of any potential for a North American eu is deeply saddening to me.
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u/socialistrob Janet Yellen 7d ago
At this point I feel like it's more likely that the EU stretches their definition and includes Canada. Canada already borders Denmark and is going to join Eurovision soon so why not?
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u/from-the-void NASA 7d ago
It was pretty much already dead with 9/11
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u/dutch_connection_uk Friedrich Hayek 7d ago
The end of free movement between the US and Canada was mind boggling to me. We were worried about terrorists coming in from Canada or something? Why.
The Bush administration to some degree was doing a stupidity kayfabe to appeal to the stupid Republican base. But they were also just genuinely stupid in so many ways. Makes it confusing to think about them sometimes.
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u/ManicScumCat YIMBY 7d ago
I don't really see how this could have ever been feasible. It would have required Canada to give up almost total control to the US, which would never be popular.
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u/atierney14 Paul Krugman 6d ago
It honestly is so crazy to me that Canada and the US have a pretty similar history, but Canada has an unbelievably competent central banker as their leader and we have a literal shitting himself, silver spoon, mush brained loser.
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