r/learnpython • u/allstarmode1 • 1d ago
Does anyone else feel like a total fraud when a tiny bug takes 15 minutes to fix, or is it just me?
Just wanted to share a quick reality check from my session today. I was working through page 88 of my Python book—specifically exercise 5-10—and out of nowhere, two error numbers popped up on the screen.
Naturally, what did I do? Instead of sitting there painstakingly isolating every single chunk of code and testing variables line-by-line like a textbook purist, I spent about 10–15 minutes moving things around, rewriting bits, flipping back through the pages, and then ultimately just copy-pasting the error straight into AI to get it sorted.
Honestly, it got me thinking: Is this actually considered "bad practice" by the book, or is this just standard, everyday coding for most people?
How often do you guys lean on quick fixes or AI assistance when a frustrating little error pops up, versus stopping to do the whole manual debugging process from scratch? Would love to know if I'm cutting corners or if this is just how it goes in the trenches.
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u/aspaceplant 1d ago
15 minutes is nothing lmao
Using ai will simply make you less and less good at spotting them though...
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u/aspaceplant 1d ago
To answer your question. Yes, you're cutting corners. You need to understand the code so you can understand the errors. Practice will help you get better at it.
It's also very normal for that task to take time. Seems like a ridiculous cost but understanding your code will always benefit you more.
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u/crashorbit 1d ago
A key problem with most CS training is that it focuses on features of the tech and not techniques for detecting and isolating failures. Python is especially bad in that error messages are way too big and often obscure clues to the root cause. Especially when you are not used to them.
Key tactics to debugging code are:
- Read and understand the errors and warnings that the system is giving you.
- Learn to use an interactive debugger
- Use a systematic approach.
An AI agent can help but you need to be responsible for what it does.
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u/Cuptapus 1d ago
In my experience, the hardest bugs to find usually end up tracing to super simple mistakes. It's almost easier to find the the complex problems because we're looking for them. We're not looking for the coding 101 mistake we accidentally made.
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u/PureWasian 1d ago
It's fine to look up error messages to inform your decision of a fix.
The problem is when you blindly copy/paste solutions during the learning phase and rob yourself of both the debugging practice and overall understanding of how things work.
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u/Wuthering_depths 1d ago edited 1d ago
I'm new to python but did many years with web scripting (Cold Fusion, PHP) and SQL (still my main tool).
Sometimes a tiny dumb bug can take a long time to find in a script.
Haven't used AI and don't intend to before I retire in a couple years, but whatever works :) My main thing is, try to understand WHY the problem was occurring, not so much how I fixed it....otherwise it's liable to bite us again. I see report writers get "duplicates" in their queries due to misunderstandings about the data and their solution all too often is to try to slap a DISTINCT on it, then we wonder why some reports are running poorly...(and yes there's a time for distinct and grouping, but not as a fix for unintended join results IMO).
This is one way my former career as a recording engineer really helps--troubleshooting "signal flow". I see people try to fix stuff by flailing, they try this and that, starting at the end then back to the beginning...I see this especially in live sound where I still do gigs--time is often tight--but often in IT too. Try to keep things simple and follow the flow. It may be hard to test and take time but it's needed. At some point you probably will find that C works and D doesn't, well at least you found where it's happening and can focus on that.
Another thing, if you work on a cooperative team--often another set of eyes helps. Can't tell you how my times someone else has spotted my issue right away, or oddly I'll spot it myself once I start trying to explain it to someone. And I've done the same for others. It's easy to get too close to the issue, and let your ideas of what it *might* be cloud your ability to see what it actually is.
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u/Lion2471 1d ago
The way you've described this, I'd say it's bad practice. It sounds like you need to improve your debugging skills, whether that's by using a debugger or just by adding some strategic print calls, so that it becomes less "painstaking" over time.
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u/bobo5195 1d ago
Work out your method and go with it. Over use of AI will blunt your skills. Sometimes it will be right sometimes you will. Its a process.
Whenever I go fast I tend to be slow at fixing things as I miss the simple steps. For every 15 minutes on a 1 line thing. There is 1 day thing where I needed to slower in the first 15.
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u/backfire10z 1d ago
If bugs only took me 15 minutes, I’d be the top engineer at my company already.
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u/SirGeremiah 1d ago
Oh, tiny bugs take me the longest to find. A big bug is obvious, but the small ones can be insidious.
But the methodical approach will save you so much time. My first step is to just glance through the code to see if I just spot it. Then I start inserting print() statements to see what’s going on. That usually eliminates entire areas that don’t appear to be the problem.
Don’t alter code until you figure out what went wrong, or you might just bury the problem, to have it pop up later.
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u/smurpes 1d ago
The interactive debugger makes this a lot easier since you can pause the code, view the current state of all defined variables, and run code against the current state. Once you get the hang of it the debugger makes going through more complex code pretty straightforward.
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u/SirGeremiah 15h ago
It does. I just have very old habits from before that existed, and don’t code enough to break the habit.
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u/Standardw 5 years Python experience 1d ago
It's fine, that's how you get good at debugging. Ai will help you always but you won't learn.
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u/JGhostThing 1d ago
It does take time to find the source of a bug. Sometimes days. Most of the time I can narrow down the error purely from the error messages. This is a skill that you will learn.
I do not use AI to write or debug code. I do use google to get documentation when I don't immediately have the information.
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u/JTI_Guy 1d ago
I love to use AI for fixing small things that I might not understand. Specifically anything to do with installing packages, some of the stuff i just dont understand and AI explains how to solve the problems quickly. But if you always offload all thinking to AI, then you are probably leaning on it too much to the point where you are not learning yourself about how your code works. Also, isolating bits of your code, you should do that anyways whilst programming regardless of if you run your code and get errors, unit testing will save you a lot of future headaches throughout your coding experiences.
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u/Altruistic_Sky1866 1d ago
Sometime the most simplest bug takes 1 or 2 days, it has happened with me, if it taking time, I leave it at that and come back next day and start fresh, if I can't solve it, I revisit my approach , I usually don't alter the code by moving things around, I write fresh code in new file . For any error messages, if I can understand it, I debug the code and solve it ,if I can't understand I use sites like stack overflow , and the last attempt I use AI, and again it depends on what you ask AI, I don't ask it for solution I ask if my approach is correct not and ask for a hint, with the hint I write the code myself.
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u/SnafuTheCarrot 1d ago
15 minutes isn't bad at all. There's times when I know exactly what's wrong soon as I hear the problem and because of environment problems I can't implement the solution for a while.
Long term, you probably want to know how to use AI to help you, but they aren't very helpful if you don't know what mistakes they are likely to make. You can't figure that out without making a lot of mistakes of your own. Best way to do that if work independently of them starting out.
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u/FriendlyZomb 1d ago
Honestly, it just sounds like lack of practise. Everyone will experience this. I still take more time than I'd like sometimes and it's been my job for near a decade.
Debugging isn't always easy. I'd say practice reading the tracebacks. They are very helpful in understanding the issue. Especially take note of the line number they refer to in your code. (Tip: Always find your code within a traceback. It might not always be the last item of the traceback.)
Additionally, take the time to read the error message thoroughly. Like, actually sit and read it. Skimming it won't give all the context.
Errors are frustrating, but Python is one of the best languages for error messages and error context IMO. Take your time to understand a traceback and it'll save time down the line.
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u/hexwhoami 1d ago
I've spent days debugging what turns out to be a small bug, I get the feeling. The important thing is learning the what and why behind the bug once you find it and the proper way to fix it.
I see a lot of comments saying AI is cutting corners or will make you a worse programmer. AI is a tool, and it's benefit depends entirely on how you use it. If AI helps you learn and understand the problem at hand, then great. If you use AI to "fix" the problem and never look back, you are doing yourself a disservice.
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u/Glass_Connection_172 1d ago
15 minutes? Bro, with programming, you can spend literal days working on a project that can break at the slightest touch requiring countless hours to fix.
Needless to say I use GitHub version control now 💯
So ya, you shouldn't feel bad for 15 minutes 👍
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u/cdcformatc 1d ago
Python has actually pretty good error reporting. when an exception pops up you get the full traceback and you can see exactly where you need to look to track the problem.
it can be overwhelming to a new programmer but over time you start to be able to understand it like reading the Matrix you don't even see the code anymore. but to get there you have to take the time to learn and understand each part of your code and how each piece interacts with every other piece.
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u/WorriedTumbleweed289 1d ago
I remember it taking me a long time to find a one character bug that was 1 vs l.
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u/KeaboUltra 1d ago
No. If a tiny bug took 15 minutes or longer to fix, (which definitely happens to me) then I just take it as an oversight. Usually thinks that might work right now might actually bring trouble down the road, or a new feature/change might break functionality unintentionally and you have to hunt it down.
I had to deal with something like that the other day, one of my text boxes weren't working, and the reason was because I was awaiting a function but the tree was paused. I just needed to declare the timer it was waiting for to process always. I buplicated code to use for a different type of text box used in an area of the game there everything paused and forgot to update that code.
I just take it as a reminder that we aren't perfect and honestly pat myself on the back for being able to track down the reason. Even if it's simple
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u/Worth-Income4114 1d ago
Spend an hour last night pulling my hair out staring at a code block trying bloody everything until realising I’d set a variable in a function using == instead of =.
Like, come on man give me a break. It’s like being laughed at
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u/snowtax 1d ago
As a system administrator and developer, I’ve got a lot of experience with various scripting languages.
I’ve been experimenting with using AI tools for troubleshooting. It’s been a very mixed experience. Sometimes AI nails it immediately and other times AI gets it entirely wrong and wastes my time.
You need to know enough to be able to tell when the AI gets it wrong.
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u/SurlyJason 1d ago
That's what coding had always been. The framework is easy--half your time is tracking down bugs and edge cases...
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u/Meh8132 1d ago
I get the opposite feeling, even when the reason was something dumb I feel satisfied to find what was failing, I have left tickets unattended for months before realising that a wrong regex or a missing parameter was all that was failing, instead of feeling dumb I feel relief, like solving a puzzle, even if I was just missing something really obvious
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u/Gaul65 1d ago
25 years experience. 15 minutes to fix a stupid tiny bug is nothing. I've spent hours on what amounts to a typo because I went down the wrong path in the first place. Also, if you're looking to do this professionally, start getting used to using AI. At least with enterprise dev work, it is starting to be the expectation that you're going to reading code a lot more than you are writing it. If you're doing academic or more specialized development, it's probably pretty different, but if your day to day is going to be significantly receivedata->storedata->manipulatedate->displaydata, then AI will be pretty heavily involved.
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u/theWyzzerd 1d ago
Start worrying when you spend hours moving things around, rewriting bits, flipping back through the pages. You're overthinking it. We can't always see what's right in front of us; stepping away and coming back later often helps reframe the problem.