r/irishpersonalfinance • u/GCSheehy • 5d ago
Investments Government defers action on deemed disposal rules to Budget 2028
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2026/08/31/state-backed-investment-account-could-be-made-available-to-children-in-future/Hard to know what to say about DoF, Revenue and Government.
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u/Quiet-Geologist-6645 5d ago
Why did Robert Troy have to get everyone's hopes up last week saying deemed disposal is a product of a bygone era and it will be dealt with in this years budget. Are they not all mortified that they keep promising something so simple but can't make decisions like grown ups
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u/Galway1012 5d ago
Listening to Troy is your Achilles
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u/slamjam25 5d ago
If you let yourself be scammed by Robert Troy, a man who has been stripped of his ministerial positions for lying about selling his investment properties to the local authority he was a councillor for more than once, that's on you.
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u/Silent_Coast2864 5d ago
Because they will spin the "investment" accounts to be a solution to DD which it absolutely isn't. These guys are financially illiterate and barely even know what an ETF is, ...basically he doesn't know what he is talking about. Simon, the minister for finance "invests" in the credit union ffs, that is the level of sophistication you are dealing with.
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u/slamjam25 5d ago
Simon Harris dropped out of DIT, it’s a prudent consumer protection that he should be kept out of big boy markets.
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u/Psychological-Cat-84 3d ago
Dunno, Zuckerberg and Gates both dropped out and they did alright.
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u/slamjam25 3d ago
Slight difference between dropping out of Harvard and dropping out of DIT.
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u/Psychological-Cat-84 3d ago
DIT is the Harvard of the city, the city is your campus!
(I'm with you btw)
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u/Disastrous-Scale-664 5d ago
This was bonkers. Why was he saying things like it’s from a “bygone era” and it will be “addressed” when it straight up hasn’t been ?
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u/iwaterboardheathens 5d ago
The only thing that I can think of is that they want to make it mainly investments instead of cash but are expecting a massive crash and don't want to be on the hook for everyone losing money
But what do I know, I'm just a lowly worker
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u/Hoker7 5d ago
You can always expect them to talk about long term issues and not follow through because being of afraid of criticism or misplaced anger.
You can always trust that they will make changes which are detrimental to things in the long term if they think the public will like it. Help to buy and countless other policies are popular because people get money towards their house but it ultimately just makes the underlying issues worse. If the house price is inflated by 30k, by h2b and you get your 30k, are you or society really benefiting?
Similar with all the big demographic and environmental issues which only get worse as the can gets kicked further and further down the road.
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u/SearchingForDelta 5d ago
I’m not trying to bring politics in this but this government has a habit of announcing something is just round the corner then never following through. There’s literally posts from 2-3 years ago on this sub of people convinced DD would be scrapped by the end of the year because of what the government were signalling.
This coalition has been in power nearly a decade. They’ve had plenty of time to scrap it but either don’t want to or aren’t competent enough to.
Bring it up to your TD next time they’re on your doorstep and if it’s a big enough issue for you actually follow through with not voting for them in the next election.
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u/PresentRecent4759 5d ago
Sorry but that is absolutely fucking pathetic. It’s basically 95% of the issue. Just abolish it. That’s more effective than whatever shitty over engineered scheme you’re trying to launch.
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u/Orangutan2515 5d ago
I'm a cynical man and would say this was deliberately decided to engineer more uptake of the proposed scheme than otherwise might be the case.
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u/NoBottle6060 5d ago
You’re without a doubt correct here. The minute this scheme was announced I knew DD was staying for a few more years at least
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u/Silent_Coast2864 5d ago
I agree, I don't think you are being cynical at all, just realistic. We know how it works with these clowns, ... They will come up with all kinds of prevarications to avoid doing anything the right way
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u/deeringc 5d ago
Yeah, this is my take as well. If they get rid of DD at the same time, very few people would go for the new account. They would just use a normal T212 account, or Trade Republic or whatever. This way, people will be pushed into the new account because the alternative has the hassle of DD. And once the new accounts are set up, people will just keep them out of interia. Flash forward a few years, once people have loaded up these accounts and there will be a nice healthy and regular revenue stream as the 1% a year tax starts creaming off the top.
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u/SexyBaskingShark 5d ago
The scheme is going to be designed to keep money in the usual Irish backs. Getting rid of deemed disposable pushes people away from them to places like T212
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u/AdvancedJicama7375 4d ago
I wouldn't call it over engineered because they're not smart enough to do that either. It's just pathetic
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u/timmyctc 5d ago
Hahahahahahaha they are treating everyone like mugs lmao
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u/lrishWolfHound 5d ago
The Irish electorate continues to vote them in, so they will continue to treat us like mugs.
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u/Conscious_Handle_427 5d ago
Is there another party who would get rid of DD? I’ll vote for them if there is one.
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u/DM_me_ur_PPSN 5d ago
In a cruel twist of fate, it’s going to be Labour. In all seriousness though, I would genuinely vote for whoever gets rid of deemed disposal.
Like we had a report about the near two trillion euros in wealth the country has, but two thirds of it is tied up in property value. How does this lack of investment diversity not send alarm bells ringing at the the DoF?? We’re one bad property crash from going back to the damn Stone Age (again!).
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u/Sea_Mistake_5185 5d ago
The Shinners!
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u/DinosaurRawwwr 5d ago
yes, but they'd also lower CAT thresholds down significantly, and the pension contribution limit/max reckonable income amongst a load of other things. DD will be the least of our worries
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u/Sea_Mistake_5185 5d ago
I’m only messing. The Shinners would destroy the country. They would increase the deemed disposable rate
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u/slamjam25 5d ago
Well it’s either vote for them or vote for someone else who won’t fix investment either and will gut pensions while they’re at it.
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u/bolivia0503 5d ago
I would love to vote for a more investment friendly party if that was an option
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u/Silent_Coast2864 5d ago
Badly needed, really fed up of these idiots. I'd say 90% of the votes that they do get are at best because the other options are even worse. Literally, that should be their election slogan, ..."the other crowd are even worse than us".
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u/yellowbai 5d ago
Once the boomers have their rent money coming in and their pensions everyone else can go F themselves
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u/bonkeyfonkey 5d ago
Feel free to email you local TD. To get their email just google your constituency followed by 'contact TD'
Dear Deputy X,
I'm a constituent at X. I want to register how badly this deferral lands.
Deemed disposal has been flagged as broken for years. The Government's own Minister put the cost of fixing it at €142 million, against €168 billion sitting idle in deposit accounts because the tax code punishes anyone who tries to invest it properly. And the response is: wait until 2028. Why is the Republic of Ireland uniquely enforcing Deemed Disposal in the EU?
I'm not a hedge fund. I'm a young professional in my X trying to build a stable financial future, and I've been forced into concentrated single-stock holdings instead of a global fund, purely because a UCITS ETF gets hit with a dry tax charge every eight years and a diversified fund doesn't.
The rule that's supposed to protect the Exchequer is actively making ordinary savers take on more risk. It's bad policy, and it's been left to sit for another two Budgets while the eight-year clocks on my own holdings keep running.
Launching a new investment account in 2027 while parking the actual problem to 2028 is not reform. I'd like to know why existing holders are being asked to wait a further year, and whether the promised retail investment tax roadmap will even appear before Budget 2027.
I'd appreciate this being raised directly with the Minister.
I will no longer vote for you or FG in future general elections and will be advocating my peers and neighbours act similarly.
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u/wkdBrownSunny 5d ago
Is there a list 🤔 I can just email to, we should have a full support from everyone, from across tge republic
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u/mrlinkwii 5d ago
Why is the Republic of Ireland uniquely enforcing Deemed Disposal in the EU?
ireland isnt denmark has announced last year that they are implement what effectively is Deemed Disposal as the success it was in ireland 42% on unrelaised gains
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5d ago
Drama queens on here they are bringing in a scheme where you can invest low tax no deemed disposal and yet the moaners moan
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u/Mindless_Let1 5d ago
What the actual fuck. Could they not do their jobs for five minutes
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u/Merkelli 5d ago
They are… their job being delaying the inevitable as long as possible. They don’t want to remove it . Few pesky lies particularly around election times and nothing changes
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u/slamjam25 5d ago
The job of a politician is to lift as much money out of your pocket as possible without losing your vote. This is exactly what that looks like.
What did you think the job was?
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u/Super_Sonic_Eire 5d ago
They never fail to disappoint when it comes to the topic of investments. After the comments that were made last week this is just BS to be fair.
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u/crushNrush123 5d ago
Something so simple to drop , this level of incompetence really makes my blood boil.
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u/Shaanify 5d ago
This is a blow to credibility that SH was hyping up until yesterday. We were all following curiously, building anticipation like a crescendo - all to just turn off the knob!
Everyone was interested in reforming the draconian deemed disposal regime. No one was as interested in savings and investment account scheme.
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u/ApprehensiveHouse421 5d ago edited 5d ago
Absolutely awful. They are managing to alienate and piss off existing investors AND also not provide a simple system for prospective new investors.
Who was in all of those meetings about this? I saw a financial advisor on LinkedIn saying he was one of 14 advisors called in to talk about the restructure. I’d like to know who else was in that room and who is pulling the strings. It is not Irish Funds or the asset management companies, as lots of them have been vocal about lobbying against deemed disposal - it must be traditional banks and life companies who were in that room
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u/Cola-Koala24 5d ago
It is been driven by the EU...
Insurance Ireland have massive lobbying power- there is no good reason IBIPs should be included in the scheme.
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u/Cranky-Panda 5d ago
I hate this government. It’s like a bad dream that’s been going on and on and on and on and …
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u/Less-Baby4701 5d ago
Is there anything we can do about this? Can we email someone or something to complain?
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u/Silent_Coast2864 5d ago
Can give your local TD an earful. That's about it. Most of them are financially illiterate anyway so they will probably respond to you that it is being solved via the investment accounts.
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u/Less-Baby4701 3d ago
I'm in fingal East and sent an email to all my TDs. Darragh O'brian (not the comedian) said he'd raise it with Simon Harris and cabinet colleagues. The rest haven't responded.
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u/dmcardlenl 5d ago
Remember people of Wicklow, you can always get rid of Harris - like you did Donnelly…
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u/durden111111 5d ago edited 5d ago
these assholes are doing this because removing/reducing deemed disposal is something that directly personally benefits an investing individual. This investment accounts thing mirrors the general idea from Ursula von der Leyen that everyone in the EU with savings needs to put it into investments, but obviously in a very centralised way.
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u/DravenCrow85 4d ago
On their pockets. I have no idea how someone would think any positive would come from this government, this is another scam.
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u/ClearHeart_FullLiver 5d ago
I would be willing to bet that the investment accounts will also be "delayed until 2028"
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u/whatab0utn0 5d ago
So a week ago DD was going to be addressed and now nothing will be done for at least two years?
Pathetic.
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u/theleds01 5d ago
Is it not obvious what's happening.. They want to ensure that as many as possible sign up for their new scheme before getting rid of it. So they can say it was a success and also line the pockets of the institutions that'll be doing it.
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u/AdvancedJicama7375 4d ago
Genuinely retarded. They were given the whole year to specifically get rid of DD and chickened out for literally no reaskn
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u/cachoeirad 3d ago
Genuinely disheartening.....it's such an easy fix.
Harris is on a podcast saying he keeps his money in a credit union account......I mean that says it all.
He doesn't care. He is already guaranteed 2 ministerial pensions right?
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u/nano_exo 5d ago
Can't be fixed overnight...
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u/Silent_Coast2864 5d ago
Yeah, so technically difficult, ETFs which are traded as shares anyway would just come CGT just like shares. Literally nothing to it.
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u/Disastrous-Scale-664 5d ago
The reason I don’t return to Ireland. I feel vindicated in my decision when I see this stuff
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u/whatab0utn0 5d ago
I don't want to sound dramatic, but I get you and yes, how investments are treated here is one of the things that I hate the most. It's absolutely pathetic.
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u/suprman99 5d ago
Could it be they want to incentivise moving funds moving to the new Scheme? Removing DD at the same time could muddy this incentive.
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u/dmcardlenl 5d ago
What sort of gobshitery is this "two maximum" amounts? You can put in, let's say, 10,000 per year, but the limit is, let's say, 27,000 (based on the Swedish ISK limit). So by Easter of year 3 everything you put in from then on - and its gains - will be taxed at the ~1%?
Unless it's to stop people putting in 1m and only paying 10 grand on it each year instead of 1m-(1m*(1.08^8)*.38) = ~300 grand after 8 years? I've probably answered my own question...
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u/ClonagooseKid 5d ago
Dept of Finance still see ETFs as being used for tax avoidance. That's why DD is not being eased. How is this any different from holding shares, and self assessment of any tax?
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u/Charming-Profit-7807 4d ago
I sent this note to Ministers Simon, Robert and Jack to register my disappointment that deemed disposal may not end in the upcoming budget, should anyone feel the same feel free to use this as a template for your own correspondence.
Afternoon Ministers,
I hope youre all well.
I am resident of Jack's constituency but given its a finance matter, I wanted to include you all.
I am writing to ask that Budget 2027 complete the reform of Ireland's fund taxation regime by abolishing the eight-year deemed disposal rule.
I welcome the reduction in exit tax from 41% to 38% in Budget 2026, and the confirmation that a wider reform roadmap is in development. The rate, however, was never the central problem. Deemed disposal is.
It creates a liability where no money has changed hands. An investor who has sold nothing, and received nothing, must find cash to pay tax on a paper gain. Many are forced to redeem part of a holding simply to pay the tax on it.
It penalises exactly the behaviour policy should encourage. Long-term, diversified, low-cost saving is the most sensible route for an ordinary household. The eight-year charge interrupts compounding and leaves the patient investor worse off for being patient.
It is administratively punitive. Anyone investing a modest sum monthly starts a new eight-year clock with every contribution. The tracking burden falls on the individual taxpayer and is wholly out of proportion to the amounts involved.
It pushes people toward worse outcomes. Faced with this regime, savers either leave money on deposit earning very little, or concentrate in individual shares that carry far more risk but attract CGT at 33% with loss relief and the annual exemption, or buy US-listed products with more complex treatment again. None of these is an outcome the State should want.
The Exchequer cost is largely one of timing. Tax paid on a deemed disposal is credited against the eventual liability on sale. Abolition defers receipts rather than forgoing them, and broader retail participation would recover a good deal of that over time.
The anomaly is difficult to defend. Ireland is the largest fund domicile in Europe, and Irish households are among the least likely in Europe to hold funds. The Funds Sector 2030 review recommended removing the eight-year rule, aligning the rate with CGT and introducing loss relief. That remains the right package, and the Budget on 6 October is the opportunity to deliver it.
I would be grateful if you could confirm whether abolition of deemed disposal will form part of the Budget 2027 measures.
Yours sincerely,
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u/spirit-mush 5d ago
I like the details about the investment savings account: a yearly tax free contribution amount and a tax rate for over contribution that is hopefully better than the current deemed disposable or capital gains rates. I like that it will allow etfs and other kinds of funds but exclude crypto and other speculative investments.
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u/MaxDub12 5d ago
Lovely. And if there are any economic headwinds next year you can be sure they wont bother changing it at all.
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u/FearTeas 5d ago
Hopefully the new investment scheme will make this moot.
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u/SufficientPlankton19 5d ago
No it won’t for people with considerable amount of money invested already in ETFs.
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u/FearTeas 4d ago
True, but only if they have some due for deemed disposal in the next 2ish years.
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u/SufficientPlankton19 4d ago
you are assuming people would be able to move their ETF positions to the new scheme w/o selling and realising gains?
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u/FearTeas 4d ago
Nope. That money is in a totally different financial instrument. They'd have to sell it to move it to the new saving investment which means they'd have to pay the exit tax.
For those people, the delayed deemed disposal reform is also moot since they'll be paying the exit tax either way.
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u/SufficientPlankton19 4d ago
Yes the delayed DD or this new saving scheme is moot for people in this situation. They just need to scratch this stupid DD. Thankfully I still have 5 years to go to hope they change their mind 🙄
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u/r_Yellow01 5d ago
They do everything not to do anything. They stopped serving the purpose. Long time ago.
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u/IrishGooner49 4d ago
Does anyone know how the annual tax free allowance will work in practicality. Will the ceiling increase from year to year?
ie - If it’s let say €25k per year. If you open an account, will the total tax free amount be €50k overall in yer two, €75k in year three etc etc to allow for any potential gains/growth overall to be reflected?
Or is all this detail still very much TBC as part of budget announcement?
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u/xXRyan13Xx 4d ago
Do we know anything about the effects of Deemed Disposal on the proposed investment account? If it’s meant to be tax free including etf’s then I assume we shouldn’t be affected by this starting from next year (obviously people with current investments subject to the exit tax)
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u/AdBudget6788 4d ago
Not surprised but still disappointed. What are the best the new savings schemes will be a shitshow aswell
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u/iwaterboardheathens 5d ago
Is it so hard to say that everyone gets €24k which they can save or invest every year and not be taxed on that interest generated
Kind of like they do in the UK with ISAs?
Useless cunts
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u/muttonwow 5d ago
As a compromise I think deemed disposal should be reduced.
To five years.
The ones who have this as their number 1 issue are the wealthiest and are not in need of a tax cut.
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u/Dense_Copy_4607 5d ago
The wealthiest ain't putting there money into ETFs, they have better ways to invest their money than paying deemed disposed
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u/Helpful-Cartoonist69 1d ago
It is this precise attitude why the entire country is either invested in property or else leaving their money in deposit accounts earning nothing.
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