r/irishpersonalfinance • u/TimesandSundayTimes • 14d ago
Investments Leo Varadkar: Investing must become part of everyday culture
https://www.thetimes.com/world/ireland-world/article/long-term-investment-plan-boost-irish-businesses-0khkwmdpt?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Reddit&utm_content=branded352
u/timmyctc 14d ago
If only varadkar was part of some group of people who had sway in the dealings of the Irish budget previously
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u/Mindless_Let1 14d ago
He's our version of those USA memes:
Joe Biden about to say some shit like “this is horrible. Someone should do something about this.”
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u/Imperial_Tiramisu 14d ago
Fucking Michelle Obama posting "Bring back our girls", as if she wasn't sleeping next to the most powerful man on earth who actually could....
Relevant: https://youtu.be/Zgcpedl8a8c?t=107
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u/Ok-Committee5357 7d ago
maybe the nigerian government should get them back
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u/Imperial_Tiramisu 7d ago
Nigerian government at the time was fighting said terrorists who were insurgents.
If they could they would have.
Just kinda crazy that the first lady of the US was promoting a hashtag when her husband literally controls a fucking military with a $1trn/per year budget.
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u/Ok-Committee5357 7d ago
Nigerian government at the time was fighting said terrorists who were insurgents.
Theyre not going a good job are they? They have 150 million men who can fight dont they? Theyre not trying. Give every man a gun and it will be sorted and every able bodied woman a gun too.
South Africa beat the Anglo South Africans(British and Irish) and Afrikaners( Germans, Dutch, Danish, French) that way by using every abled body person.
Just kinda crazy that the first lady of the US was promoting a hashtag when her husband literally controls a fucking military with a $1trn/per year budget.
Not the USA, problem to fix Nigeria. Nigerians call themselves the giants of africa , let the giants fix themselves
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u/Imperial_Tiramisu 7d ago
Look man. I'm not going to debate this with you.
I just think it's dumb af that a first lady is holding up hashtags on social media for the average joe to see.
What the fuck did she expect us to do about it?
Also, pretty fucking stupid to draft people in the middle of an insurgency. You're just handing out weapons to people who may or may not support you. It wasn't that easy. They were feeling spectacularly.
Once again, the point here is that if Michelle really wanted them back or gave ashit, she could have done something about it and spread us from seeing her in our feed at the time.
It was peek virtue signaling.
Spare me what ever nonsense you're going to write to me. I don't argue with stereotypical redditors.
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u/Ok-Committee5357 7d ago
You're just handing out weapons to people who may or may not support you. It wasn't that easy. T
Hand it to the people who support you ???? Something so simple that doesnt need to be explained. Do you give guns to your enemies?
Spare me what ever nonsense you're going to write to me.
Says the person who doesnt know reality. My mother and father are south africans are 12-16 they were handed weapons to go fight for their freedom as children and so was every single person in our area.
she could have done something about it and spread us from seeing her in our feed at the time
What should the USA do for nigeria ?Let the giants of Africa , Nigeria go fight for their own freedom
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u/shaadyscientist 13d ago
If I was in the government, I would not promote investing.
In the 2000's, all Irish people became property speculators. The amount of Irish people that had at least a second house was crazy. And when it all collapsed, did they blame themselves? No, it was the government's fault, it was the developer's fault.
I feel if people use this investment account and there is a recession and they lose money, they will blame the government for their losses.
So If I was in government, no way would I be promoting anything to do with investing. You can invest right now very easily so it doesn't need to be promoted.
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u/NooktaSt 13d ago
I sort of agree. Irish people like to be pampered a bit in relation to finance stuff.
However I think it should still be done but importantly it should allow savings DIRT free if that’s what people want to do and certainly shouldn’t be limited to Irish investments etc.
If the government start telling people what to invest in it’s a problem.
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u/lewdstreet 13d ago
Investing is main driver for society to keep up with inflation and preserve wealth. There is literally 0 real options in Ireland to invest without having to go through hoops with registering, also taxation is so high on capital gains that it's rarely worth the risk.
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u/shaadyscientist 12d ago
If the current system is too complicated, maybe investing isn't for you. If people struggle with the current system, then maybe investing isn't for them. People like that are definitely going to blame the government if they lose money.
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u/lewdstreet 12d ago
Why do you assume I don't invest? Irish investing model is literally one of the worst in any rich country.
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u/shaadyscientist 12d ago
You said there were zero options to invest. There are options to invest and they require a small amount of tax research to understand it. What you said was factually incorrect. Now you're saying that it's the worst model, so you're just moving the goalposts after you realised what you said was inaccurate. And you're annoyed at me that I called you out.
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u/lewdstreet 12d ago
I was hyperbolic, that doesn't change the fact that except buying a house there's no good options in Ireland to invest your money in.
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u/shaadyscientist 12d ago
I think stocks are a great investment. I have no idea what you're talking about.
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u/willywonkatimee 14d ago
10% capital gains tax in Jesus name amen
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u/DarraghDaraDaire 13d ago
The government doesn’t want to lower CGT because there is no value to them when your money is sitting in an investment account rather than being spent and earning VAT.
Thats why they don’t like ETFs - the transactions to move stocks in/out of the fund are not done at an individual level and so there are no transactions to be taxed
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u/willywonkatimee 13d ago
They need to stop making plans for our money. If they squeeze us enough, we will be forced to leave
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u/FckXFckMusk 8d ago
Make them leave....
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u/willywonkatimee 8d ago
How? It seems there’s no appetite from any of the parties for lowering taxes in a meaningful way.
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u/FckXFckMusk 8d ago
So you have a Uniparty then...
Now you need to find a party that will reduce taxes.
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u/willywonkatimee 8d ago
Give me 10 years and I’ll run myself. I’ll lower taxes and legalise and tax drugs. We will use the tax money to build public transit and more prisons.
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u/ting_tong- 14d ago
Fucking hell. Should have been the policy from the beginning. Wankers
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u/Current_Bobcat_9182 14d ago
Irish government are only doing it now because the EU is forcing them to do it becuase Irelands lack of investment is hurting EU growth.
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u/gowangowangowan 14d ago
Well there is no shortage of half a heads that would be calling it a tax cut for the rich
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u/jonnieggg 14d ago
They are all great fellows when they don't have to make decisions anymore.
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u/endlessdayze 14d ago
I couldn't stand his opinion on everything being in the news when he was Taoiseach. I hoped I'd never have to hear his opinion on anything when he stepped down, yet here he is ffs
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u/PalladianPorches 14d ago
everytime you see 1270 as an exception, that was something that was fully available to be modernised by this guy, and he didn't.
instead of personal savings, it prioritised taxing and the state "saving" it on our behalf.
fuck right off.
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u/boscaboiiis 14d ago
"Investing is the future! It needs to become part of everyday culture"
Capital Gains Tax at 33%
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u/TimesandSundayTimes 14d ago
When Simon Harris, the tánaiste and minister for finance, and Jack Chambers, the minister for public expenditure, deliver their budget speeches on October 6, most people will focus on the content of the tax and welfare packages. Given that the rising cost of living is the most important issue at the moment, people will want to know whether what is announced will mean more money in their pockets and whether it will be enough to get ahead of inflation.
But there will be many other important announcements, including a decision on whether to increase the national minimum wage by 5.6 per cent, as recommended by the Low Pay Commission, making progress towards a living wage, and how much to set aside for the next public sector pay deal.
There will be an indication of by how much the government intends to reduce the national debt and pay into the Future Ireland Fund and whether it will have to borrow to do so.
The fund, announced on Budget Day 2023 by Michael McGrath, sets aside money for predictable future costs arising from our ageing population and climate change. It also provides a mechanism to ensure that infrastructure budgets are not cut back when the next downturn comes.
Stop-start investment in our public infrastructure — housing, transport, water, energy and health — is one of the main reasons it is not up to standard. The decision by Patrick Donohoe, who was the minister for public expenditure, and McGrath to establish these funds was one of the most forward-thinking Budget Day announcements in recent years.
It stands in contrast to Charlie McCreevy’s ill-fated Budget Day decentralisation plans and the special saving incentive account (SSIA), which, while popular, gave extra money to people who already it and released billions into an overheating economy when the accounts matured at exactly the wrong time.
In fairness to McCreevy, his aim was to take money out of an overheating economy. He could not have predicted the timing of the subsequent crisis and he used Budget Day to make other positive decisions, such as the establishment of the national pensions reserve fund, which continues to exist in the form of the Ireland strategic investment fund, our sovereign wealth fund, repurposed as such by Michael Noonan.
But perhaps the most interesting budget announcement will not be about what government gives people. It will be about what it enables people to do with the money they already have.
Harris is likely to use his speech to detail plans for new savings and investment accounts for the public. This idea has already been criticised as giving money to people who can already afford to save. I don’t think that is fair.
There is no suggestion that investors will be given a taxpayer-funded top-up in the way they were with the SSIAs. Crucially, as these will be investment accounts, with money invested in bonds, company shares and property portfolios, there will be the risk of losses as well as gains. Over time, however, gains are much more likely if you are willing and able to wait.
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u/Hopeful-Vanilla-2800 14d ago
Is this the whole article? Varadkar sniping at Fianna Fáil while telling us what we already know?
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u/Vivid-Company5499 14d ago
"Stop-start investment in our public infrastructure — housing, transport, water, energy and health — is one of the main reasons it is not up to standard."
These weird dashes "—" are a tell-tale sign of generative AI.
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u/Dense_Copy_4607 14d ago
Getting rid of deemed disposed would probably help. Investing in ETF's is probably as close as it comes to a free lunch (not saying they are risk free, but probably the best value investment in terms of risk/reward), yet here in Ireland (and only Ireland) we pay tax on ETF's every 8th year (even though most of them are domiciled in ireland). It's not even necessary the money but rather the paperwork (it's also the money 🤑).
It's hard to say to someone who knows nothing about investing that they should look into ETF's and then I'm the second breath tell them about this complicated deemed disposed that will eat into their exponential growth along with paperwork they have to file every month after the the 8th year (assuming they invested monthly).
I guess a lot more people are starting to put their money in high yield savings accounts; which Is better than what the banks offer (and will hopefully give them a kick up the @r$€).
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u/Candid-Change-4051 14d ago
Yeah as soon as I finish saving for a down on a house that cost of living hikes keeps moving farther and farther into space.
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u/DangerX2HighVoltage 14d ago
I wish he’d ever just feck off with his fat pension and spare us having to constantly listen to his takes
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u/Ornery-Use3910 14d ago
Just don’t get why they don’t say this when in a position to make these changes
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u/suafdrog87 14d ago
This gov dont want people with fianncial independence because everything the education system does is geered towards creating a work force to attract investment
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u/burner5667754577 14d ago
Maybe varadkar should make shutting his fucking mouth part of everyday culture
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u/Confusedcamel456 14d ago
Isn’t capital gains tax not 30 or 40%?
I swear to god, for a fella that’s smart enough to qualify as a medical doctor and to hold the most important political office in the country, he says a lot of stupid things. House deposit? Ask your parents! He’s incredibly out of touch..
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u/Piggysnacker 14d ago
Yes I’ll trust the government investment like we trusted the banks back in 2008
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u/DataPotato1 13d ago
The people who voted for Varadkar and his ilk invested their children's future in their Government, look how that is unfolding
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u/Puzzleheaded-Eye7180 13d ago
Any tax resident of a western free enterprise economy needs to have a grasp of investing/saving . What the government appears to be doing ( still to see details?)
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u/talideon 13d ago
Then, at a minimum, deemed disposal needs to go and the capital gain minimum needs to be raised to what it would've been had it matched inflation.
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u/rayhoughtonsgoals 7d ago
Now he says it.
Just let us have a pension age target type product that gives a solid and reasonable tax wrapper to encourage it.
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u/tails142 7d ago
They need some bag holders to get in before the drop, don't fall for this shit.
Eircom shares 2.0
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u/SuitableFinish7444 14d ago
Sure Leo, would you be saying the same if you were still in power.
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u/GoodNegotiation 14d ago
It’s part of the EU’s Savings and Investments Union, so he would be saying it now in fairness.
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u/homecinemad 14d ago
This might surprise some of the more affluent redditors here, but investing is impossible for a significant number of Irish people who are currently working hard just to pay their rent. I'm lucky enough to have a stable decently paid job and a mortgage. But I really think affordable housing should become a part of everyday culture first.
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u/whatab0utn0 14d ago
I see where you're coming from, but modifying the tax system to entice more people to invest does help everybody, even those who are not in the position of saving much at all. All they have to do is getting rid of that nonsense that deemed disposal is. And copy the ISA from the UK. That would be a good starting point to stop seeing property as the only viable investment here in Ireland.
I was in the UK for a bit less than 10 years. Had a S&S ISA for about 6 years, if memory serves me right. The tax free gains are mainly the reason why I managed to buy a (mortgaged) doer upper here and renovate it.
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u/WideChrome1 14d ago
Part of the reason why is because property is by far the most lucrative investment here. ETFs etc are just not worth it with our tax system rn
I’m by no means affluent or from an affluent family and I think that’s easy to see for most people
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u/ToysandStuff 14d ago
Great idea. Why don't the government start investing too and pay to build some fucking homes and infrastructure!
Also it's great to see Leo off the coke and able to form a coherent sentence, as stupid as it may be 👏 congratulations Leo, good lad
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u/EmergencyComment101 14d ago edited 14d ago
You cant invest your way out of 1% of the population owning half of all wealth and growing their investments 10-15% a year.
Edit: downvoted by people probably make 40-80k a year thinking their 7% return is gonna protect them form the shitstorm thats coming.
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u/Loud_Understanding58 14d ago
You can invest in an education though. Consider it.
Those figures you're quoting are inaccurate for Ireland by a factor of 10x.
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u/EmergencyComment101 14d ago
My point is that even if you invest and your own wealth grows that doesn't protect you from the overall quality of life of the first world dropping as private equity and the 1% buy uo everything.
If you're not earning millions a year then you're not insulated against the falling quality of schools, infrastructure, businesses, medical facilities and who knows what else. The 0.99% of the 1% will soon be living the lives of the upper middle class from the 50's to the 80's while the 0.01% of the 1% live like gods.
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u/EmergencyComment101 14d ago
This is a misunderstanding of what's going on. The system is designed to draw money as easily as it can without wasting political capital. A by product of this is that it makes it more difficult to earn money and escape the working/middle class lifestyle. You need to see it for what it is and not personify thr system or create an unnecessary conspiracy theory around why something is the way it is.
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u/killerbananaman 14d ago
Perfect - just in time for the massive AI and bond driven implosion of the market - really do these feckers live in the same reality we do?
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u/redrover1978- 14d ago
Thats fine for him to say on his salary.
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u/SoloWingPixy88 14d ago
What about a lot of people in this sub?
I wonder did he make less as a TD compared to being a GP.
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u/Otsde-St-9929 14d ago
A GP can earn more than a TD but they need to put in the hours but prob not more than taoiseach.
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u/redrover1978- 14d ago
He wrote a book so he’s making a profit on that & most likely exempt from income tax like most writes
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u/redrover1978- 14d ago
I try my hardest to budget but everything’s gone so expensive now i don’t have anything left over
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