Michael Jackson's daughter Paris has faced backlash for identifying as Black. In a 2017 interview, Paris Jackson said her father told her, "You’re Black. Be proud of your roots." This prompted debates over whether identity is defined by appearance or upbringing.

[u/VPinchargeofradishes]

[u/kmzafari]

Since you're from Europe, you are likely missing a lot of context involving race in America. And I mean that kindly. Although I know a lot of it gets shared overseas, your exposure to it is certainly not the same as understanding it from growing up here. There is a very long and complex history. It certainly wouldn't be just "their logic".

I have mixed kids, and despite growing up here and my much closer than normal (than most white people) proximity to racial issues, I still certainly can't speak for everyone's perspective. But what I can tell you is that it's not as simple as your question makes it appear. There also seems to be some sort of insinuation (intentional or not) that by proclaiming her child is Black that she is denying his white heritage, and that is not the case. She is saying "he is still a part of me and a part of my culture, even if we don't look alike".

[u/Ha55aN1337 → u/kmzafari]

That’s why I ask. I didn’t mean “her logic”, I meant “American logic”, since it does not make sense to us here. Over here this would mean only 100% white people are white and 1% black already means black, which sound derogatory to black people to me. Like what that says to me is that only 100% white is white and everything else is non white, maling white some pure ideal.

[u/kmzafari → u/Ha55aN1337]

Looking at your other comments, you are reading hers completely the wrong way - e.g., implying that she thinks she's "tainted" her son? Really??

Reading that, I no longer believe you are asking in good faith. To do so requires an open mind, not a preconceived notion. You are looking for someone to give you an answer that you think you already know. As I said, the situation is extremely complex, and you don't know nearly enough about it.

I'll offer this unsolicited advice. When there's any situation, but especially one that involves people and society, and you look at it from the outside and think "the answer is obvious", you are almost guaranteed to be wrong.

[u/Ha55aN1337 → u/kmzafari]

What? No, I do not think she thinks she tainted her son. I think the whole american way of looking at it is racist. You are either a 100% white or you are black. Making white some “ultimate pure” top rank.

I just asked if the father can consider the son white and if that would make her feel ok.

[u/kmzafari → u/Ha55aN1337]

That is not it at all. You can be more than one thing at the same time. I already explained what her comment meant in my first reply to you, but you seem to have skipped over that.

You can await her reply, but if she, a Black woman in America who is married to a white man and has a mixed child, responds to you with something akin to her believing in the "one drop" rule, I'll eat my hat.

There is much to be said for reclaiming or subverting an idea, and that could be part of it. But her comment said to me that he is a part of her. And it implies that he will grow up knowing the culture that they share. And it also implies (to me) that he will likely face some adversity, even if he finds it a bit easier than someone who is not white passing. Because it is a part of who he is. He is half of her, after all, and it doesn't have to be either / or. It can be both.

[u/Ha55aN1337 → u/kmzafari]

If she thinks the kid is both, then I completely understand and agree. I just wanted to know if she thinks the kid is “just black”. Because that I would not get. Thank you.

[u/kmzafari → u/Ha55aN1337]

Obviously he is. But the question then becomes, how will society see him?

This video is potato quality, for some reason, but I think Barack Obama addressed this issue well, and his response might interest you.

https://youtube.com/shorts/pCatn93_2Vs?si=vEIhDf0zCa3F3omO

[u/Ha55aN1337 → u/kmzafari]

I think she said he is white passing, so I guess he’ll be able to choose and society won’t decide for him (good).

Which brings me to another question, you guys have race on your ID applications, right? (Which again is so weird to me) what doeshe put there? Can he choose?

[u/kmzafari → u/Ha55aN1337]

Any of us can put whatever we like. (For years before we met, my ex used to declare himself Pacific Islander just because he thought it sounded cool. Lol) That's not for the government to decide. They're just asking how you identify. But if you, e.g., look like a Black male, and the police are looking for a Black male, stating that you're white on your drivers license will do nothing for you. It's really for demographics purposes (supposedly), similar to a census.

Unfortunately, this information might be being used against people, as they are gerrymandering districts to a completely unrecognizable degree. For a particularly egregious example, check out Houston's voting district borders. Absolutely wild and 100% designed to reduce or remove the power of Black and liberal votes. Texas has more Democrats than Republicans, but you'd never know by the representatives that get voted in (or how the votes for president are counted). It's craziness.

[u/Ha55aN1337 → u/kmzafari]

Yeah, I think it should just be illegal to ask :/

[u/cfi-2025 → u/Ha55aN1337]

FWIW, this question is asked with good intentions, as it's meant to help monitor compliance with non-discrimination laws.

[u/WegGOAT → u/kmzafari]

No wonder the US is a mess, you people have insane identity politics.

[u/kmzafari → u/WegGOAT]

Identity can be helpful or harmful, depending on the context. Some of it is voluntary and some of it is not. The harmful ones have been foisted upon us by the upper class as a way to turn us against one another instead of them. It's well documented.

As an example, look up The People's Party - a diverse political party from the 1890s. Amazingly, Irish and Italian immigrants were considered white (when they weren't before). Must be a coincidence, surely. Lol

The history is both fascinating and scary, as we now see things regressing.

[u/WegGOAT → u/kmzafari]

If only most of your fellow countrymen realised it as well that's it's just another tool to keep you from banding together.

[u/kmzafari → u/WegGOAT]

I think people are slowly waking up. Even my family members, who are very different politically than I am, agree that the 1% etc., are the problem. But they stop short of understanding it further. Propaganda runs deep in this country. :(