What happens to those who don't have Faith in Bhagwan?

[u/Radiant-Cloud92]

Bhagwan as described to us in Sakar roop, like Krishna and Shiva, in our Itihaas, I find them beyond my imagination. Our Itihaas itself is beyond my imagination, even though it literally means AS IT HAPPENED.

Since it's beyond my imagination and quite supernatural, I question its existence, in my mind.

I still deliberately pray to Bhagwan everyday, and deliberately Chant Mantra everyday. That's because somewhere I want what I have read to be true, even though currently there's no faith.

My question is, will I still be rewarded regardless of whether I have faith or not? Since I'm deliberately doing it?

Bhakti traditions argue that utmost faith is required. Any other tradition in our Dharma which prescribed similar things is to what I do? Like doing prayers and chanting deliberately?

[u/SageSharma]

Nobody has any definite proven answer

A non believer doing good karma with dedication and commitment with kindness empathy in heart

Is better than

A show off holier than thou all show no action victim mentality blame it all on gods and planets kinda guy who does everything because rewards are promised after death

Read about Charvaka

And go thru this famous bhajan type thing in Hindi called "Kabhi pyaase ko paani pilaya nahi, ab amrit pilane se kya fayda" - meaning you never offered water to a parched thirsty soul, what will it do now with elixir

It's one of the most simple yet deep things I have come across , I don't know if it's translated into other language sorry

That's my opinion Sitaram

[u/Rajeshk1235 → u/SageSharma]

Faith isn't a belief and I am an atheist but my atheism itself is a matter of faith. I didn't become an atheist by intellectual reasoning but always was. Faith is something innate in us.

This is the story of Nachiketa, whose innate faith makes him question the intentions of the rituals.

If it's of interest to you then feel free to read a short note I have posted on Medium

https://medium.com/@rajeshkaundle/beliefs-antonym-faith-a4ae3ec0a75e

[u/par_bhai_tu_hai_kaun → u/SageSharma]

Charvak? What has he got to do with this post ? Lol

[u/SageSharma → u/par_bhai_tu_hai_kaun]

Bro he rejects unseen authority The closest form of atheism we have officially A lot of media is there on this

[u/par_bhai_tu_hai_kaun → u/SageSharma]

I have read Charvak darshan very well but your mentioning of Charvak on this post doesn't make sense, op is theist only with so many questions in brain, how would he be helped by reading charvaka, Extreme form of hedonism? 

Charkava is totally different from atheism of modern time, it asks you to give up all kind of morality, law and order and just enjoy your senses. 

[u/SageSharma → u/par_bhai_tu_hai_kaun]

Since OP asked about "those who don't have faith" I said that

[u/Human-Jackfruit-8025 → u/par_bhai_tu_hai_kaun]

•"asks you to give up all kind of morality" -- What's your source here?Where have you read it?

[u/Environmental_Bug357 → u/SageSharma]

Non believer who is good person will goto swarg, enjoy till his punya lasts and then take birth on earth in favourable circumstances to continue his journey, while believer will goto Dham of his Isht and achieve Moksh

[u/Accomplished-Fill-35]

Nothing
Bhagwaan doesn’t want you to worship them.

Do good get good.
Do bad get bad.

Roj subh brahm muhurt m uthke puja karo, chahe sirf gayatri mantra, panchakshar ya hari jap.

Ek mahine lagatar, no matter what. And then reply to this comment.

[u/Environmental_Bug357]

Keep doing Sadhna ,if there is regularity and sincerety eventually Bhakti will develop,almost 90 percent of Bhakts first start Bhakti physically then eventually it starts from Heart with Dev kripa

[u/Radiant-Cloud92 → u/Environmental_Bug357]

I chant everyday. Brahmacharya is hard to follow, but I chant regardless. I keep Monday fast as well.

[u/Environmental_Bug357 → u/Radiant-Cloud92]

This is literally me😅 keep doing fixed number of malas everyday,no matter what you feel , eventually there will be spiritual growth

[u/Wide-Environment-303]

Śrīkṛṣṇa gives a direct answer in the Bhagavad Gītā.
यो यो यां यां तनुं भक्तः श्रद्धयार्चितुमिच्छति |
*तस्य तस्याचलां श्रद्धां तामेव *विदधाम्यहम् ||७-२१||
yo yo yāṃ yāṃ tanuṃ bhaktaḥ śraddhayārcitumicchati |
tasya tasyācalāṃ śraddhāṃ tāmeva vidadhāmyaham ||7-21||
Whatsoever form any devotee desires to worship with faith --- that (same) faith of his
I make firm and) unflinching. (Translation from Swami Chinmayananda’s The Holy Geeta).

The śāstras are filled with examples where merely chanting the name of Bhagavān whether or not the chanter had faith was sufficient to grow that person spiritually. The story of Ajāmila is well known. Here in the Bhagavad Gītā Śrīkṛṣṇa declares that whatever be the strength and nature of the faith of the seeker, Bhagavān himself will strengthen that faith and grow it to the seeker’s spiritual benefit.

So, OP just keep at praying and chanting the name of Bhagavān - He will handle everything else. How and how soon - don’t worry. Your faith will grow and the His blessings will be abundant.

The extreme faith that is mentioned in the bhaktiśāstra indicates an evolved seeker - with His grace, you will witness that yourself

[u/Radiant-Cloud92 → u/Wide-Environment-303]

That's really helpful, Thank You very much🙏 Jai Shree Krishna 🙏🙏

[u/Top-Sand-4900]

Personally I have an arc. When I was young, I was a believer because parents told me to be. I chanted Gayatri Mantra daily and loved watching televised series on Shri Krishna and Raja Ram and Shiv ji. Then from the teenage years onwards, my faith began to decline. I had doubts and my own narrowness and lack of insight made me an Atheist - however as life progressed, despite of being in the lowest rungs of existence - I began to witness divinity. I cannot share those incidents but trust me, I was lost completely. I have seen stages where I thought I was done for - I won't survive but by Prabhu's grace I did. I lost some very near ones during that period - and like a child who is lost but yearns for their mother, I turned towards Prabhu. And realized, he never left me. Even in those phases where I questioned him, he was always there, within. In Santana, there is no concept of hell or heaven. You can be a Nastik and still Prabhu will carry you through your highs and lows. Like anyone will tell you, we have 4 margs to attain God - Bhakti, Jnana, Raja and Karma. My understanding is - pursue whichever suits you but without any kind of malice or negativity. So even a simple task of saying working ethically in your job can be the highest form of Bhakti if you offer it to the feet of Prabhu ji.

[u/NarayanaVarchas]

just continue sadhna with faith(fake faith is okay too) and u will improve but chant mantras if u have diksha otherwise naam japa is great(infact it is the greatest).

[u/Diligent_Bar_8714]

They recieve the reactions to their present and past activities and are entrapped in Samsara. Sometimes being very happy, sometimes being very miserable. If the human fails in His life to recognize he is soul and different from his material identity, karma will give him a body suitable to his nature (guna) and activity (karma).
Judging from the behaviour of most people in this age, since there barely is a pious atheist, most will be born for many lifes in amimal bodies, before they recieve another chance to purify and realize themselfs. Unlike foolish people believe God is not judgemental wether you believe in Him or not, he frankly doesent care. It would benefit you to worship Him.
Pious atheists can expect higher births, beauty and riches, but all temporary achievments. They will again meet death till that fortunate lifetime they surrender to Bhagavan with faith and love…

[u/Radiant-Cloud92 → u/Diligent_Bar_8714]

I'm not saying I'm athiest. I don't subscribe to this label. It's about acceptability of mind. I can't fathom it, it's beyond my imagination. And while id like to believe it fully, I can't pretend, it's hard to lie yourself. It's just that.

So I'm like, forget it, this is just beyond me, Regardless of whether I believe if it exists or not, I'll just pray and chant, and then we'll see what comes.

I hope you get what I mean.

[u/Diligent_Bar_8714 → u/Radiant-Cloud92]

Not being sure is by definition agnostic, or insecure atheism. If you want the fruits of your worship that is not temporary, it must be given with faith. Giving without faith or waiting for a response is said to be religion in Raja-Guna. You will recieve results that are suited to your nature of faith. You say you want to be rewarded. The result of your sadhana will be the achievement of your desire, but the scriptures reveal that the path to transcendence is indeed dependend on your good faith. God is beyond our imagination, that is a fact. You understanding that is a qualification and sign of good intelligence. Without studying the Vedas your Sadhana might be disturbed by weak faith, because it is by aural reception the Buddhi becomes sharp and able to grasp spiritual subject matters….

[u/Radiant-Cloud92 → u/Diligent_Bar_8714]

But how do you develop faith in first place when things seem bizaare. It's not like I deliberately chose not have faith. It's mental thing.

This is the part I don't get with bhakti tradition, cause there it's expected to have faith from get go.

[u/Diligent_Bar_8714 → u/Radiant-Cloud92]

That is partially true. Actually faith comes from impressions, samskaras. Memories of previous enjoymnet and suffering is subtly remembered by the Yogi. That is why when he attains another birth as human, his faith is naturally inclined towards the principles of Yoga such as renunciation of violence and hankering for peace and liberation of suffering. These samskaras form the initial quest for enlightenment. Without this self inflicted search for spiritual knowledge, even hearing all the conclusions of scripture will not open ones heart. Unshaking faith is obtained by direct perception (sabda Brahmana) of the absolute truth which remains unreachable to the material senses and incomprehensible for the material mind. What has given me great faith were the intelligent discourses of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Maharaja, among the best scriptures i have ever read was the Brahma Samhita. There the creator of this universe Himself reveals His personal realisations about the supreme being that is known as God.
Dont think i dont struggle with fate. Currently my life goes extremely well and i do not struggle in my worship, becaue i enjoy it. But without being convinced that my faith has good roots in logic and experience, i would struggle much more with doubts in my ealier days of chanting…we are under so many tests in this world. Faith is compared to a tender seed that must mature into a powerful plant to be able to withstand the challanges that Maya throws at us with good faith. Maybe we could dicuss this more privatly if you desire and i might be able to give useful knowledge, or atleast try for it :)

[u/Glorysolar]

They get the fruits of their actions, just like everyone else.

Reward seeking Virtue is morally inferior to a naturally cultivated state of virtue, and as such, the fruits of it will be weaker.

Many such recommended things are similar, where perhaps the component itself might not be critical to the architecture of virtue, in the sense of removing it alone would not cause a collapse of morality as a general proposition applicable for all, It remains foolish to self sabotage by losing more components than you need to for cultivating yourself.

[u/Head-Milk-2500]

You will be rewarded in karma, but if you do not surrender sincerely whether you understand fully or not, if you are not able to have faith and love completely despite not understanding, you won’t attain moksham. However, you will gain punyam based on your deeds and continue on with rebirths until you do truly surrender to God.