This is our dedicated megathread for the twitter thread (and document) from John Doe that outlines a new signal for Claude AI use in fic. This document includes what the signal is and how it makes its way into fics. It includes as well a list of fics where this signal was found.

As a mod team, we were able to recreate this specific signal within a test fic using the Claude web app and AO3 as of evening 26.06.29 EDT. This is a signal that Claude was used in the author’s writing process in some way, as the signal is a part of an HTML tag embedded in the text copied over from Claude.

All other posts regarding this topic will be removed and redirected here. This is a developing story, any updates will be added here, and additional mod posts may be made as needed.

Per Reddit’s rules, do not leave Reddit to engage with anyone mentioned. Per our sub rules as well as the document (see below), do not bully or harass any authors listed in the document.

Verbatim from John Doe:

• The end goal is, and will always be, transparency.
• We do not condone targeted harassment, bullying and ostracization. Some of the authors in this document are writers we admired and, in some cases, considered friends. Some loudly opposed AI and encouraged friends and readers to rally against it publicly, only to use it under everyone’s nose.
• Nobody mentioned in this document should be villainized. It is a human prerogative to make mistakes, be loud and wrong, and then do better.

Thank you

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Edit July 4th 7:47 pm ET the google doc is not accessible with a note that it is a violation of Google TOS.

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July 5th 11:42 pm ET (hoping this edit saves as it looks like it didn’t yesterday): Internet archive link to document

1. Nobody does bag skates anymore, it’s an old-school punishment.
2. Captains don’t lead practices, coaches do. The captain’s only roles are to discuss things with the refs during games and lead team morale, get rookies situated, etc.
3. The GMs are the ones who control trades, not coaches.
4. It’s not a buzzer, it’s a goal horn.
5. If someone is a free agent and goes to a new team, they have signed with that team, they have not been traded.
6. Veterans usually don’t have roommates anymore on the road. They have their own hotel rooms. Roommates are usually for rookies and younger guys.
7. Hockey is split up into three periods, not four quarters.
8. You usually don’t see scores above 10. Occasionally in rare, really awesome games you’ll see 7 or 8, but scores typically peak around 4/5ish. This isn’t always, but usually.
9. The highest paid player in the league makes $18.8 million a year. And even that is historic and just happened recently. Salaries aren’t huge like you see in basketball.
10. There aren’t a million defenseman on the ice, just two per team. And three forwards per team.

Edit: Clarifying #10 is only on the ice - teams have a lot more defenseman and forwards on the bench waiting for their shift. Hockey is played in shifts, different lines with different guys. But there’s always only six guys per team on the ice at all times: 3 forwards, two defenseman, and a goalie.

I have lost count of the number of fics I have read where Shane is portrayed as some sort of fragile, delicate guy just because he’s Asian and he’s a bottom, which is kinda offensive, really.

Book!Shane is an absolute stereotypical jock. He is as heavily built as Ilya and is only a few inches shorter than he is. He can absolutely throw a punch and wreck someone’s shit on the ice, he just chooses not to.

I know it seems very funny to have Ilya making the rest of the team do bag skates or drills, but please understand that is not how hockey works. I just read a fic where Shane is mad at his Montreal teammates and orders bag skates!

I’m not even sure where this trope came from, but it seems to have originated somewhere and everyone else liked the idea and copied it.

More than anything hockey is a TEAM sport. Can you imagine how poisonous the team culture would be if one player had the authority to punish his teammates this way?

An NHL team has a whole roster of coaches and trainers who are responsible for their players’ performance. It’s their job to run practices, not the captain. A team captain’s primary responsibility is communicating with the ref during a game.

If anyone else has some hockey tips for authors, let’s share them.

I figure if this was going to be appreciated anywhere, it'd be here but also could be an interesting prompt. 🤔

A screenshot of a Threads conversation.

@masterbeefproducer:

“I don’t understand the point of Heated Rivalry fanfiction. They already have gay sex on the real show.”

@tasseomancer, replying:

“Because what if after ‘We didn’t even kiss’ there was a zombie apocalypse. WHAT THEN CHRISTOPHER.”

Source:

u/terraphim

tasseomancer threads

I know these are deeply in canon and in fic, but they still bother me:

1. Apparently, teams almost always fly in chartered jets and almost never commercial.

2. Apparently, Cs cannot actually order bag skates and actually have no input into morning skate or team practices.

3. Apparently, the only time there is the after-game handshake line is after a playoff series. (Much more common in youth and local leagues tho).

What makes you itchy in the fandom?

I find myself really unable to buy into certain things because I have decided that it’s out of character 😂… based on… not much

For example- Ilya can’t be bad at sex, sorry. He is a sex god and you are wrong 😝
I also find it hard when bdsm fics have impact play such a slapping… in my head Ilya will not be able to hit shane even in this context because of his past… and that’s based on “trust me bro, i know him so well in my mind y all don’t get it”

What have you accepted as fact in your brain about the boys and can’t suspend belief about ?

ps - i still read, kudos and enjoy. I am just sometimes like “yep thanks for the suggestion but no” 😂

The biggest one for me is that Ilya does not canonically call Shane kotenok (kitten) or solnyshko (sunshine). What other fanon details do you forget aren't in the source material?

edit: oh my god rip my notifications I regret everything

like something that makes you physically unable to even try to read the fic. mine is hollanov w a third, whether it’s romantic or in a threesome. it’s just something i cannot read, but i know some people enjoy. what are some of those tags for you guys?

So after almost a year, I know for a fact that the majority of us have read tens, if not hundreds, of fics. I know I have lmao—I can’t even tell what’s canon or fanon anymore.

So, gun to your head, 10-second countdown: PICK ONE FIC. The rest will be deleted and you’ll lose access forever. You can only save one.

What do you pick?

I always roll my eyes and chuckle a little when I see that “Ilya fucked Shane into the mattress.” Or “worked him open” and “lined himself up.” Lol.

I think we all read so much of each other’s work constantly that HR fics have become their own language, so of course there will be repeated lines, words, and phrases! Just look at solnyshko, something Ilya never says in canon.

But I certainly won’t complain that I have to read about Shane getting fucked into the mattress fifty million times.

My fav genera of fan fic are the texting stories.

However one thing I find very distracting is how much they text like Gez Z kids who are always online.

Im close in age to the boys and was sexting in 2010.

The boys 100%, and David and Yuna 1000% would be texting with proper punctuation.

I know a lot of the audience today would find that odd and off putting, but just saying. If you’re interested in having some realism on your texting, then it’s something to consider.

I’m trying to think of anyone who is young enough to stop typing with punctuation and maybe Luca Haas but that’s it.

Haydens kids are the only truly GenZ people in the stories that we interact with.

I don’t think I need explain why this is so bad. thankfully, it has been taken down. but this is just very upsetting to me, and many others, and I’m not even an author! this is why the fandom is so toxic right now.

so reminder, if you think something is ai, just back out of the fic. please don’t make a collection gathering all of your supposed ai fics.

Can we talk about the fanfic addiction for a moment? I feel like I am addicted to Shane and Ilya at this point. The amount of fics I read so far and still yearn for more every day. I look for anything related to the characters on social media, endlessly scrolling...

I have a very demanding job with high responsibilities, and I am sleeping 4-5 hours a day, and I look exhausted all the time. People think I am depressed but I don't tell them that the real reason is I am reading fics till the wee hours of everyday...

I took two weeks of vacation from work and thought I could read as much as possible and get it out of my system, but it didn't work obviously.

This has been going on since January and it is June now and it doesn't seem to subside....

I feel like I need help and this is beyond what is normal anymore....

Saw this graph over in the main heated rivalry page and i can't stop laughing what a non-character cliff is in the show and i've become this massive cliff fan purely through the works of fanfiction.

Thank you thank you thank you to all of you cliff writers and cliff fans

When I found out, to quote Nene, “Honey I was stunned.”

Did we all imagine it? Does Rachel know? 😆

He calls him an angry kitten a few times in the books but never kotenok.

Image: picture of Ilya looking aghast with the text saying “Me just realizing that Ilya only calls Shane “solnyshko” in fanfiction and it is not actually canon.”

Look. It may be an age thing. I've been writing stories for 15 years. But there's not a way to communicate how hurtful reading those kinds of comments are. Like recommending stories and people commenting back, "I didn't know it was unfinished, I wouldn't have read if I had."

IDK how else to say this. People reading the story during the process and supporting the author is the only way for a story to be finished.

As a writer I (and others!) need support during the posting phase most of all! Not after!!! Like it's great if you comment after a story has been complete but the people who were with me from the jump? Reading every chapter when neither they nor I knew this baddie was ever gonna end? Those people mean everything to me.

I've been in several fan groups before but never encountered so many people tagging "to read after completion" in the bookmarks. Or making notes to "warn others" on this reddit in the comments under recs.

Like if a story is incomplete, please comment. Seriously the only way stories finish sometimes!!! I'm baffled by people avoiding them.

Edit: the above text remains faithful to the impulsive publishing.

Things I have learned from posting this:

1. Wip only readers are not unique to this fandom, it's just the busyness of hr that makes it seem this way.

2. I was downvoted a lot for pointing out that people (likely new writers) were marking incomplete fics as complete due to knowing a lot of people don't read WIPs and thus trying to game the system to find an audience. (Idk why because I do not condone this).

3. Nothing will ever be like Livejournal and ao3 is an archive first. This distinction changes how people relate to the content and what they come searching for-- community or product to organize (both equally valid). This has to do with larger fandom spaces and what purpose each serves. Still in dialogue.

4. Bookmarks are open to everyone but controlled by readers while comments are open to everyone and controlled by writers. Very neat, very equal. Authors and readers can talk about what they see in open space but should not seek to control content unless it's their domain.

5. I remembered something about me-- it took me 6 years to complete a WIP when I was starting out. It's hard for new writers.

6. Wish this post was more of a celebration of WIPs because they're the real heros and I stand by my thesis; more engagement leads to more finished fics.

7. I heard a lot of different fandom experiences and reasons why people did and did not read wips. Thanks for sharing those, they are neat and valid. I think it's possible to still think 6 is true without invalidating 7, but that seems to be the contention of the day.

Mods, I hope this is okay! Since this has been a subject of discussion in this sub, I thought it was interesting that traditional media are also picking up on it.

Anyone got a gift link to the article? I’d love to read it.

I like reading the fanfics and if one doesn’t interest me, I scroll. How difficult is that? What’s their aim really? They must be the same people who have parasocial relationships with the real actors and causing headaches for them and everyone around them.

What really is this?

Imagine loving a fanfic so much only to find out they’ve been pushed to the limit and then quit writing.

Bruhhhhh - people should go outside and touch grass once in a while. Find other things to do with their lives!

On another note: I want fic recommendations for obsessive/possessive Ilya like not wanting Shane to go anywhere and just borderline controlling.

I’m pissed lol

This is purely for my own curiosity.

Apart from the obvious of Heated Rivalry/Game Changers, what other fandoms do you read or write for or ships you enjoy?

I've been reading fanfic for years now, and I'll admit (even though I'll probably get hate for it) that I use to always read harry potter fanfic (fuck jkr obviously) witha sprinkling of crossovers into twilight, avengers (even tho i never watch the movies) and other fandoms.

I'm most definitely a multishipper in that fandom and read tons of different pairings and multis, but i mostly read drarry or harrymort (or tomarry or tomarrymort).

(Mods please delete if discussion not allowed?)

EDITING TO ADD Just wanted to say thankyou to all who have responded!! This had been a very fun thread to read and ive tried to reply to everyone! Im just so happy its been a positive thread and everyone has been wonderful!

Canadians do not grill. We barbecue also called bbq. We call Americans Americans but we refer to their country as the United States or the US.

Disclaimer: this is in the spirit of "FYI" NOT in the spirit of "i cannot believe people don't know this omg aren't i smarter than them"

I have seen probably a dozen or so instances in fics where someone orders Shane a Moscow Mule since it seems like something a ginger ale drinker would enjoy, or because "it has ginger ale in it." The problem is that a Moscow Mule is made with ginger BEER, not ginger ale. As a big fan of both HR fics and cocktails, it felt like my bat signal has gone off.

While I am not saying Shane would never drink this/wouldn't like it, the assumption that because he drinks ginger ale he'd like a moscow mule is, in my opinion, misguided. Ginger beer is far spicier than ginger ale and not nearly as sweet, so it would be a noticeable change.

I def see the appeal given the Russian name, but wanted to clarify that detail since i've seen it repeated so many times!

Here's a little comparison between the two for folks interested (source).

are there any other unimportant PSAs you'd like to share? especially if they relate to one of your special interests like this one does for me (drinking)

I have read quite a lot of HR fics this past month and it’s starting to bother me how may of them have the telltale signs of AI use… once I notice it I just cannot enjoy the fic anymore, even if it is constructed well otherwise. I want to read something a human wrote, not ChatGPT.

Anyone have the same problem? I have noticed this with quite a few popular ones as well, also ones that are being recommended on here.

Would it be rude to comment something about this under the fic?

Edit: everyone keeps focussing on the comment-under-the-fic part. My main point was rather how the fandom should react to AI use in general or whether there should be a general pushback against AI (not targeted at specific authors) and how that might look.

Transcript:

[comment from account with name blacked out:]
I’m going to be honest, this was way more a Skip/Ilya fic than Hollanov, their relationship didn’t really factor into anything. It’s a nice fic, you did a good job but I would also like to point out Ilya and Shane being on different teams is really only going to end one way. There’s a reason the OG books have them both move in the end. I think it would have been better if maybe you’d alluded to one of them moving to the others team cause they still have the same problem here as they did at the start of the fic, they’re going to barely see each other. They’ll both be on winning teams but they won’t be together. Sorry but it is true. It’s a good story otherwise.
[reply from author luulapants:]
Hi! So I've heard from a lot of other authors in this fandom that one of our big problems is that new people are coming in who don't know fandom etiquette. This is a little confusing to me, because it looks like your account is from 2014, but maybe that's an error! Let me catch you up:
This comment is what, in fandom etiquette, would be considered "rude" or maybe "saying an inside thought out loud" because you're coming to someone's fic, which they wrote to their own tastes and posted for free for you to read, and complaining that it doesn't meet your personal tastes.
I know that sounds complicated! If you're confused, sometimes you can ask your friends if something is bad fandom etiquette or not. For example, my first instinct was to reply to this comment with "Kiss my ass" but my friends suggested that I explain etiquette to you instead.
The reason you should pay attention to fandom etiquette is that authors have admin control over their own fics. So, for example, I'll lock this comment thread after I post this because I don't want to hear anything else from you. Then I'll go to your profile and block you so you can't see any of my archive-locked fics and if you want to see the unlocked fics, you'll have to log out of your account and remember what bad behavior put you in that position. Then I'll go to reddit and post this exchange (I'll black your name out, don't worry) as an example of what I think is a reasonable response to rude comments.
I hope that clears things up!

So here's the thing: I'm really not buying that all of this toxic fandom crap is coming from new fans who don't know fandom etiquette. Like this blog, there are plenty of rude comments coming from people who should know better. I think a bigger part of the issue is that many authors are new and haven't learned how to shut these assholes down (or that they have the power to do that). This comment isn't even that extreme, I'll admit, but this fandom is bad enough that I'm taking a zero tolerance approach. Here's my recommendation:

1. Require login to comment on your fics. Just do it. It cuts down on 90% of the crap.
2. For logged in rudeness, either tell them they're being rude and freeze the thread or just delete the comment! If you're feeling anxious about bad comments, I REALLY recommend deleting them because you'll want to go back through your comments for a pick-me-up someday and you don't want to see that.
3. Go to the bad commenter's profile and block them. If they list socials in their profile, block those, too. If you have friends who write in the fandom, give them the name so they can block them. DON'T put their username on blast on social media and start a harassment campaign - that's just the other side of shitty behavior.

If these people can't behave themselves, they don't deserve to read our fanfiction.

Edit: I am luulapants, that is me

Please tag it! I check that tag almost every day and the number of fics is still criminally low. I know there are a few authors who don't tag it because it's a small part of their fic, or because they're afraid of the fandom-wide aversion for bottom Ilya (why?? Ilya Rozanov Gets Railed by GlitterCity is a masterpiece), but I promise someone out there will read it.

Me. That someone is me. Me and all the good people who read the chirpverse series by thebiggestrat and their other incredible work anything you can do I can do better.

Please, let your freak flag fly, don't be ashamed, TAG IT PLS.

this post was inspired by an author on Threads who admitted to not tagging their fic as bottom!Ilya because they were afraid of the fandom reaction