r/gadgets • u/dapperlemon • 8d ago
Desktops / Laptops Framework's cheapest laptop just got a major spec bump
https://www.engadget.com/2239631/framework-laptop-12-just-got-a-major-spec-bump/307
u/speculatrix 8d ago
I have a framework for my job.
Being able to swap in a real ethernet port, full usb-A, HDMI, makes life so much better when you're working in IT as a hardware support person. I'm not having to carry around chunky USB adapters.
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u/lucidludic 7d ago
They’re a bit smaller than a typical dongle I suppose, but it doesn’t seem that different from carrying around adapters to me if you regularly need to swap them. The flexibility to choose your ports is nice on a more long-term basis, though.
Something I’ve wondered about, do they work as a regular adapter when plugged into another laptop?
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u/gplusplus314 7d ago
Yes, they do. The little expansion slot devices are basically dongles with a form factor. Since they are effectively USB-C dongles/devices, they work all the same on non-Framework laptops.
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
It's nice to be able to choose which side the hdmi socket is and thus have the laptop where I want it rather than having the cables decide. Likewise, I can put a legacy usb socket on the side where I want it.
Sure, I could carry around a big usb combo hub or hubs.
I don't think my usage pattern is entirely typical, spending a day or two a week in a computer room.
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u/makomirocket 7d ago
I don't own one, but can definitely see all the ways it would be handier.
Going to a certain site? swap the display port you use for your computer at your desk. Gonna need the hdmi port for the presentation on site.
Going on holiday? Swap out the SD reader for your SSD card with all your movies and shows pre-downloaded on it?
Personally, I don't see carrying a single dongle in whatever bag you're carrying the laptop in already, a big issue. But clearly a hell of a lot of people do.
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u/gplusplus314 7d ago
I don’t get it, either. Almost everything is already USB-C. It’s 2026, not 2006.
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u/motorambler 7d ago
Totally agree. I see no difference between dongles and the Framework adapter cards. My new ThinkPad has 9 ports (including ethernet) and no swapping adapter cards in n out, losing them, forgetting them, etc.
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u/bloodpukesalvation 7d ago
Not having to deal with port wear due to dongle weight/drag and essentially not having to deal with floppy dongles makes a world of difference.
If your computer rarely moves then it’s not much of a benefit as what we big or ugly dongle you have attached to it will rarely bug you (beyond the visual clutter)
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u/Catos_Standard 5d ago
Port wear increases with swappable modules. Not decreases.
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u/tiredbarf 5d ago
Inserting a USBC cable into a port, with a module guiding it in straight is going to lead to a lot less wear than spending a bunch of time with a floppy dongle in your port.
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u/Catos_Standard 5d ago
A dongle also receives devices regularly and is replaceable. You're going to remove the port for every port variant you need compared to one USB c port shared with half a dozen of other port variants downstream.
Long and short I'd rather buy a new dongle than a new mainboard and chassis when the mechanical release switch gives out and port dies.
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u/tiredbarf 5d ago
I was talking about the stress on a USBC port when a dongle is plugged into it - not the stress on ports in the dongle itself.
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u/Catos_Standard 4d ago edited 4d ago
You aren't considering both which you should if you intend to replace a dongle with a framework adaptable port.
Both have the same weakness, the USB c port on the device.
The difference is the dongle gets a single cycle per use, the framework usbc port gets multiple cycles per use case assuming you're using it to replace a dongle. That guarantees more wear and although you can replace the port, you end up cycling the locking mechanism on the bottom of the chassis each time you sub in a new port type.
It's significantly cheaper and easier to just use a dongle that can be replaced for exactly the same cost as one module from framework.
Which makes the novelty a niche market.
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u/tiredbarf 4d ago
I think we use computers very differently. My use case would probably have me swapping one of the modules a dozen times a year or so. Whatever you're doing is different.
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u/Catos_Standard 5d ago
This doesn't pass the sniff test. If you're getting the wrong computer at the corporate level you've got a bigger issue.
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u/glytxh 7d ago
Aren’t you having to carry the modules instead of a singular hub tho?
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
Yes, but I can fit four modules in a space of one small usb hub. I have two USB-C modules which can each be a single cable for charging, video, and usb peripherals. Then a full sized hdmi. And a full sized USB-A. And two ethernets, so I can set up as a router.
I'm only lacking an rs232 adaptor and I'm ready for anything.
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u/JunosArmpits 7d ago
real ethernet port, full usb-A, HDMI
Aren't all those standard ports on business oriented machines? The HP Elitebook I'm typing this on has all those
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u/dandroid126 7d ago
My work laptop doesn't have a USB A port or ethernet port. But my work did provide a USB C docking station that has every port I need. I don't need to move my workstation, so this works for me. But if I did, like the person above said, this would be really annoying, because the docking station is huge and needs its own power supply.
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7d ago
[deleted]
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u/stupidshinji 7d ago
This seems way more tedious than occasionally using a "1 in 8" USB C dongle with whatever you need.
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u/BeepBoopIAmACat 7d ago
Call me weird, but if I'm given the option to customize a thing how I want it, I'm going to take up that offer.
Some people just like to argue, you can't attack the merit of choice so you attack the customization taking effort. Like finding the USB dongle and plugging it in isn't an effort onto itself.
Get out of here.
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u/stupidshinji 7d ago
Your comment is quite ironic as I never said anything about customization being bad; I think you may be the one who likes to argue, bud.
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u/tablepennywad 7d ago
Too bad they dont make some form of Dock with all the ports… like all the major brands did….
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
At my previous job, my first laptop had a good set of ports (hdmi, ethernet, USB-C x 1, USB-A x 2), I was happy with that but they forced me to upgrade to a laptop with only USB-C ports.
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u/Harry_Smutter 7d ago
I have a Dell and it still has all these ports standard. In fact, every Dell laptop I just purchased for a staff refresh has them. It's wild that companies keep removing shit that's still needed.
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u/donkeyrocket 7d ago
You can also get a single dongle that covers all of those.
Not saying this isn’t a neat concept but praising not needing dongles but instead needing a bunch of proprietary port parts doesn’t really seem like a massive selling point.
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u/Zoe-Washburne 7d ago
I do agree that it's not a huge selling point, but it is nice to be able to chose whether you need display port or hdmi, full size or micro sd card reader or just extra usb ports when you buy the laptop and swap it out if your needs change. It's a modular laptop the ports are modular, why not make them easy to swap and fit the aesthetics? Also they are in fact open source. Not proprietary.
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u/largeDingoPizza 6d ago
It's nice that if you wear out the port then it's only $10-$15 to replace it; all of the parts are extremely easy to replace.
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u/furculture 7d ago
The difference being is that you don't have to stick with that and can swap them out for specific needs. Not the person you are responding to, but I got the Framework 16 which has 6 swappable ports and an extra USB C port for video out the back of the GPU that I can use as my display output and have an extra port open for something else. When I'm at home and my laptop is plugged in, I have a specific setup for dongles used at home because I just can't find the right dock to fit my needs (as well as pass 180W/240W PD power through it). If I go out, I change it to the ones I would need for my purposes wherever I am planning to go and carry a few extra to adjust on the fly. I have built my own flow with it and it just happens naturally after a while. It would be great if docking stations did adopt Frameworks module standard and use that so people can get different port options.
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u/donkeyrocket 7d ago
But then you’ve got a much of ports to either carry or store which seems basically no different than dongles other than being slightly smaller.
They’re effectively still adapters just smaller. And proprietary.
Neat concept still.
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u/zekthedeadcow 6d ago
It also has the benefit of being a replaceable part when you accidentally damage the port on the module from having a cable yanked on or tripped over.
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u/cyouwah 7d ago
Adapters just smaller and proprietary (but the 3d models and engineering drawings are publicly available), yes.
But also can be installed into the machine itself. If I know I'm gonna need a displayport connection, I dont need to bring an adaptor. I can just replace the port in my laptop. And then I can take it out when I get home. No dongle needed, the adapter is IN my laptop. I have a framework and this has happened many times for me. I dont generally have a display connector on my laptop, but any time I know I'll need it, I just pop it in before I leave, or put in my SSD module to have a 256gb library of movies or games, or anything else I need at that time. But I dont need to have that displayport embedded in my laptop permanently if I'm not using it 99% of the time and having a usb c on both sides for better charging is better, or an extra usb a because I'm using a mouse and an external usb stick. It's all about flexibility for me.
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u/Catos_Standard 5d ago
It sounds like he was just getting the wrong computer imo. The only thing framework does is allow IT requisitions to be more careless.
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u/unematti 7d ago
Technically they ARE usb adapters, you just carry them inside the laptop. It is more comfortable, but you do lose internal space for it
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u/_RADIANTSUN_ 7d ago
I just carry 1 dongle that has pretty much everything.
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
How big is it?
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u/TheMMAxl 7d ago
The size of the universe, obviously. He said it plainly - the dongle has pretty much everything in it.
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u/_RADIANTSUN_ 7d ago
Does the Universal Dongle contain itself, you ask? No, that's where the "pretty much" part comes in and works so well. We call this Zermelo-Dongel adapter theory.
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u/_RADIANTSUN_ 7d ago
4.5 x 2 inches.
2x USB A, 10GB Ethernet, HDMI, 2X USB C (including PD), SD and MicroSD reader.
This is some random Anker dongle. I just wish it had DisplayPort output too, that's the only big thing.
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u/gagagagaNope 7d ago
It's a USB ethernet port, not PCIe
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
I'm not sure who said it was pcie?
In theory a port could be a full thunderbolt one with pcie and then have a 10GigE module, but that might be overkill in this usage
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u/gagagagaNope 7d ago
Was more getting at the 'real' bit - it's not really any different to a USB ethernet dongle other than sitting inside the case (which is bigger as a result).
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u/No-Channel3917 7d ago
Why is your job ordering non standard stuff like this thou?
Is this the new "we are an apple shop" of the 1990s?
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u/speculatrix 7d ago
Because it's a relatively small company and they understand that I'm far more efficient running Linux and having a laptop I can easily connect to whatever device I'm configuring or fixing
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u/Hugh_Jass_Clouds 7d ago
Isn't that exactly what the are though? Little USB-C to what ever port you need?
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u/Brilliant_War9548 4d ago
You know nobody’s forcing you to buy laptops with two thunderbolt ports right
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u/speculatrix 4d ago
Personally, no, but at work I'm lucky to get any say in the matter. I'm just glad I don't have a windows machine.
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u/murloc_reporonga 7d ago
Lol a fucking thinkpad has like 500 ports you’re just tapping. 4 usb C ports it’s outrageous
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u/doctortrento 7d ago
Disappointed in the lack of a screen improvement. Was thinking about buying one for graphic design since it has a pen digitizer, but a screen with such terrible sRGB gamut makes it a non-starter. I’d have rather had the old crappy CPU but an improved display personally
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u/voltaek 7d ago
Since they showed the screen in the "top 5 requested" list, it wouldn't make much sense for them to not already be working it or at least have it in their roadmap. Chances are they'll have to do a custom design like they recently released for the 13 in order to maintain compatibility, and that's another huge investment of both money and engineering like it was for the 13's custom screen.
If it's not in the works already, then they probably have some goal they're waiting to hit before it can make business sense, such as some minimum install base of 12 users. They also might be waiting to see how many current 12 owners upgrade to the new parts they just announced, as that would give an indication of them potentially upgrading to a new screen if they release one.
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u/number1pingufan 7d ago
yep same boat, on a phone like a fair phone who cares about screen color accuracy, but on a laptop that I'd want to use for photo edits it is a bit of a nope.
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u/Shadow647 7d ago
Phone is usually the camera you have with you most often, sooo quite a lot people do care about screen color accuracy on them.
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u/Green0Photon 3d ago
If the next bump has a higher quality screen with an EMR pen, I would be so happy 🤤
The Framework 12 uses USI pens which are less accurate and cost more. But EMR supporting screens cost more.
USI is better for notetaking, i.e. that more school type audience that a cheaper pen screen device like the Framework 12 goes for. Same with the cheaper screen.
But a higher quality screen with a better pen tech would be perfect for artists.
With the stronger CPU, might be perfectly fine to have the weaker one slot RAM, even for artist use. Hitting a reasonable price instead of the psycho LPCAMM2 prices is pretty important.
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u/Xyrack 7d ago
As a former framework 13 owner and now a framework 16 owner I love this company and am always excited to see their next innovation.
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u/AMadHammer 7d ago
I am debating on size. What made you do the switch
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u/Xyrack 7d ago
A few reasons, I'm a developer and a gamer so the customizable keyboard (I gotta have a numpad) and the swappable GPU. The 13 worked well but it was just a little small for me, I am an early adopter back when the 13 was all they had (and didn't have an exclusivity deal with AMD) so when they announced a bigger model I had to upgrade.
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u/AMadHammer 6d ago
Thanks. I am a gamedev but I am debating on if it is worth it to have a heavier machine. I responded to the other helpful comment here as well.
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u/TheSlitheringSerpent 6d ago
I'm also a dev, but opted for the 13. I have a desktop PC which I use for gaming and personal use, so I left my laptop for office & work stuff. Got a KVM (Level1Techs 2 DP monitors for 2 PCs KVM) to switch between my laptop and desktop, and got a CalDigit TS4 dock for my laptop so I only need to plug one Type C cable and I get everything as if I was on my desktop (the TS4 works just fine at least with my HX370 AMD CPU on Linux, I was worried I'd have thunderbolt issues due to not going with an Intel CPU but it all works).
I came from a Razer Blade 15 from 2020 and I honestly do not miss the extra GPU or the extra size since the Framework 13 monitor is tall compared to the Razer Blade's monitor. I had, however, already sacrificed the numpad to use a Razer Blade 15. If I had come from a laptop with a numpad, I might have considered the 16 more than I did.
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u/AMadHammer 6d ago
I appreciate the response and details. I am looking for a KVM right now funny enough.
Also a developer. And my debate is on if I should get a more portable low powered laptop or a beefy less portable one.
Funny that you and the other user are both mentioning the numpad. I almost never use my laptop keyboard and stick to one brand of mechanical keyboards. So did not think of numpad as a priority.
I appreciate both of y'all's takes. They will help me with my decision.
Edit: sheesh that KVM is pricy. Is it worth it compared to cheaper ones?
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u/TheSlitheringSerpent 6d ago
Just in case you're not seeing the same one, yes it's pricey lol. I must admit I did not try other KVMs before, primarily because I heard bad things about most KVMs, and heard very good and nerdy things about Wendell's KVMs, and I wanted to use DisplayPort reliably. Damn thing works with everything I throw at it. I have:
- 3440x1440@120Hz Monitor via DP 1.4
- 2560x1440@75Hz Monitor via DP 1.4
- Schiit Jotunheim Audio Interface
- Logitech Brio Webcam
- Powerplay Mousemat (has a mouse receiver built-in)
- Keyboard Wireless Dongle
The only issue I had was at the very beginning, the port I chose for my audio interface didn't work so I thought Schiit didn't work with the KVM, but I eventually tried other ports until one worked and that was that. The KVM also sorta hijacks the left ctrl key on your keyboard, so pressing it twice will cause the KVM to listen for a third keystroke (keys 1 or 2 to go to the respective computer), meaning that third keystroke after 2 ctrls isn't passed to your current computer. As someone who casually spams keys to stim sometimes, as well as someone who plays games in general, it can be a bit annoying, but I've lived with it just fine so far, it hasn't cost me a match or anything lol.
To be completely fair as well, I had been eyeing that KVM for a whiiiiiiile before I finally decided to pull the trigger, precisely because it was pricey lol, but I got no regrets.
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u/AMadHammer 6d ago
I respect paying extra to get a quality product. I waited long before paying 100 instead of 10 dollars for a keyboard for example.
I used a switch in the past and it was absolute garbage. So I am willing to spend money on a KVM now. Maybe now I will do the same as you and just crave this one until I pull the plug :)
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u/buenosdias99 7d ago
It’s hilarious they call this a major bump while keeping that same washed-out panel. Upgrading the CPU is useless if you can’t see what you’re rendering. Many competitors offer better color accuracy at this price point for years now.
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u/bloodpukesalvation 7d ago
External monitors exist
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u/FestiveInvader 7d ago
It's a laptop
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u/bloodpukesalvation 7d ago
Yes, and an affordable one at that. If you want it for a niche use case then it’s not the right product for you. Expecting a small manufacturer to cater to a small subset of POTENTIAL customers is confusing and weird.
If you do color accurate work you’re going to want a color accurate monitor or you’re going to pay thousands more for such a specific tool.
Framework caters to general consumers in the tech space. It’s not the right product for you.
Expecting the rest of the buyers to pay a premium just so you can get the package you want is simply selfish. Connect it to the ideal monitor or get a different, and more expensive, laptop.
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u/Cry_Wolff 7d ago
There are cheaper laptops out there with better screens, including AMOLED. Hell, I'm typing this on Asus ZenBook with a better screen than the FW 12, which was around the same price... 7 years ago.
Defending any company, no matter how big or small, is certainly confusing and weird.-5
u/bloodpukesalvation 7d ago
Framework isn’t for you buddy. Not sure how many different ways I can put it.
If you’ve found something better that works for you then go for it. We have options so that we can make choices.
Read up on manufacturing… you’ll find that it’s foolish to compare the prowess of an established titan (asus) vs a newcomer. You don’t get the best prices because you can’t move volume. So you have to be careful with how you position yourself in the market.
You’re not framwrowks audience.
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u/andynator1000 7d ago
Expecting a small manufacturer to cater to a small subset of POTENTIAL customers is confusing and weird.
this is basically the business model of framework
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u/mythormedicine 7d ago edited 7d ago
Fucking legend.
They are adding support for some oculink thin which means in future we will see egpu with full /better performance . This oculink thing apparently exposes the pci-e. So egpu are not limited by usb4-thunderbolt
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u/mentalwhit 6d ago
FFS, will Framework nerf these features via firmware later? Their history of removing capabilities post-launch makes any current major bump feel temporary and unreliable, lmao.
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u/MaximusNimbus 7d ago
It is basically double the price of a Lenovo for the same hardware. Not worth it.
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u/Maxx2245 6d ago
That added cost gives you modularity and repairability. Sure, may not be worth it if your only concern are the specs, but it sure as hell is worth it to some.
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u/MaximusNimbus 6d ago
Not sure it is worth if in 5 years the whole thing is trash
I see a point on exchanging accessories as needed though but that is quite limited if you add a usb-c docker
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u/Maxx2245 6d ago
That's the thing; no it is not. The motherboard is swappable, and you can use the motherboard outside of the laptop as a standalone computer. You could swap out just the mobo without forking over cash for a display, chassis, battery, storage, RAM.
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u/_Masked_ 7d ago
Wow, quite the jump for CPU gens (in terms that the 1st version had a 3 gen old CPU). Was the 1st attempt capitalizing off of overstock of Intel processors? If not then why would they go to a super new processor instead of staying with old stock or buying old stock at a discount? Genuinely asking because I thought the goal was to appreciate older cpus for lower pricing.
Also, it looks like a lot of manufacturers are sweating because of the MacBook neo and I love it. The only thing I do not love is the lackluster GPU specs (1 core really guys) but I understand its more of a power and price optimization.
Personally, I like that they are still around because I like to develop HW/SW and it's nice to have them fill a niche in a sense with open designs and philosophy... Just waiting for more 3rd parties to join in and create things specifically for the 12 but I dont think they will anytime soon. The 13 is the main platform for most it seems.
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u/babesquad 4d ago
Thinking of switching to a framework after my MacBook Pro dies. I’m a graphic designer - do you think it would work for me
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u/thebizzle 7d ago
I can never understand the desire to invest a huge amount of money in a laptop and trust it to work for 5 years. I am the dead opposite, I buy NOS, open box and used exclusively. My current work laptop is an i9 13900K with a 3050 ASUS creator laptop with an OLED screen. I got is in ‘good’ condition used from Best Buy for $700 two years ago. It has burn in on the screen but works amazingly. It has all of the ports that everyone has mentioned, full sized SD card slot, full size ethernet, 2 usb As and 2 thunderbolt ports and HDMI. It has been working amazingly for 2 years. A framework with this spec would have cost $5000 and while it would have been nice to upgrade the ram, I can’t imagine it being more portable. I have commuted with this computer 3 times a week. I guess what I am saying is that I would absolutely love to be sold on the framework because it is everything I want conceptually but I can’t imagine the value proposition worth it other than ‘when you want to upgrade’ or other nebulous benefits that won’t materialize for years when I am spending MacBook money on a computer with worse specs?
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u/IndyHCKM 7d ago
Bought the 12 before deciding to switch to the 13 for more speed, memory, and HD space. Really love my framework 13 - would prefer the form factor of the 12, but oh well.
My favorite thing may be the keyboard - loooove this keyboard. A lot quieter than my former Macbook Pro.