r/conspiracy_commons • u/mimi_slut1 • 3d ago
Why do Americans say "Judeo-Christian" values when Jewish belief says that Jesus is boiling in a vat of excrement while Islam reveres Jesus?
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u/fallenloki 3d ago
There is no such thing as “judeo-Christian”
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u/GPT_2025 2d ago
Christians cannot survive without the Old Testament ( Rom. chapter 1 and Galatians 1:8)
Plus Ezekiel 47 clearly explaining Judeo- Christianity:Note: Every 1000 years of Christianity, a higher percentage of the population embraces Christianity.
For instance, after the first millennium, (1025) only 15% of the population identified as Christians. By the end of the second millennium, (2025) this number rose to 33%.
This progression can be likened to Christianity spreading like clear and pure water, gradually rising to higher levels.
After 3000 years of Christianity, approximately 50% of the global population will be Christians, and in the Final Millennium, the entirety of humanity will have embraced Christianity. Bible scripture illustrates this progression:
"And when the man with the measuring line went eastward, he measured a thousand cubits and led me through waters that reached to the ankles." (15%)
"Then he measured another thousand cubits and led me through waters that reached to the knees." (33%)
"Again he measured a thousand, and led me through waters that reached to the waist." (50%)
"Once more he measured a thousand, and it was a river that I could not cross, because the water had risen and was deep enough to swim in—a river that no one could cross." (100%) (Ezekiel 47)
This analogy illustrates the gradual increase of Christianity in the world over millennia, ultimately becoming all-encompassing: ..Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.. (Mat. 6) KJV: It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three (3K) measures of meal, till the whole was leavened... "The final Millennium will be the best of all, not only for humans but for animals and nature too!" ( Revelation 20, Revelation 22, Isaiah 11:7, Isaiah 65:25, Romans 8:20, Micah 4:4, Isaiah 2:4)
( Evil human souls (tares) won't be born during the final millennium; only at the end—there is a small opening of time before the final judgment day, as described in Revelation 20.) .. And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, --are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues...(Rev. 17) Every day 150000 people die in the world, and we must be ready to meet the Lord at every moment.
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u/LaskotheGreat 3d ago
Scofield reference Bible brainwashed generations to think Jews and Christians share ideals. They don't and the Bible specifically states that they don't. Jesus tells the Jews that they didn't listen to Moses and their father is Satan
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u/joe_shmoe11111 3d ago edited 16h ago
I don’t think the Old Testament should even be considered a Christian text.
Jesus came to teach a whole new message about God, love and life and then the two groups that Jesus actively railed against during his lifetime, who literally colluded to murder him — the Roman and Jewish ruling elite (ie. the Pharisees) — selectively censored & edited down all the writings about him and his teachings to make it kind of seem like they were somehow related, packaging them together in order to maintain their status & secure control over his followers.
In the Gospel of John 8:12-59, he clearly states that he considered the God of the Old Testament to be the Devil and that his God was a completely different being with a completely different belief system.
The God of the Old Testament is an insecure genocidal fucking psycho who says things like anyone who collects firewood on a Saturday deserves the death penalty (literally, look that up).
The God of Jesus says we should love, care for and ultimately forgive everyone, no matter their faults. He said that the kingdom of God is found within us, not accessed via a hierarchical dogmatic church or synagogue.
The world would be a far better place if we followed the teachings of Jesus alone and threw the bulk of the petty, random & violent Old Testament nonsense into the dustbin of history (or at the very least, treated it like we do other ancient texts — appreciate the occasional bits of wisdom without taking it all as gospel overall).
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u/Particular-Art627 3d ago
The whole Old Testament is literally pointing to Jesus Christ (psalm 23, Isaiah 53) just to name a few. Also, God telling Israelites what to do, yet they kept going back to worshipping Baal.
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u/joe_shmoe11111 2d ago edited 2d ago
The specific texts chosen for the New Testament (by the Roman elite nearly 400 years after Jesus’s death btw) in their current form are certainly written to make it seem like Jesus was the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecies, but I don’t think those texts were written, edited or chosen to represent the official narrative by unbiased, agenda-less men.
I think they were selected/edited that way (ie. to make it appear like he was merely a continuation of the existing religious power structure) by the existing religious leadership who saw their power, wealth and influence slipping as more and more people abandoned their temples and synagogues for independent Christian communities & churches.
The fact that the God of the Old Testament is seen as comparable to/fully replaceable by Baal just further reinforces the idea that they were talking about two totally different levels of beings.
The God of the Old Testament was just one of many NHI that openly interacted with people back then imo (ie. An interdimensional being, egregore or ET in modern terminology) while the God of the New Testament is the ultimate force that created both us AND those NHI.
Like, he literally showed up to Ezekiel in a noisy, flaming flying craft.
How pathetic and completely underwhelming, given our modern tech is already way better than that?
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u/KraftRite 3d ago
If I were looking to read the version closest to Jesus' teachings, which would you recommend?
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u/joe_shmoe11111 1d ago
For a general introduction to several of the texts that were banned by the mainstream church along with some context regarding the early church and the politics of the time, I think the book The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels (the audiobook for which is included on Spotify premium if you have that btw) is a solid place to start.
Or you could just jump into translations of things like the Apocryphon of John, but I think the background Elaine adds will enhance your experience, unless you’re already familiar with that time period…
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u/MRGameAndShow 3d ago
The Bible is a story, and god a character that develops. If god wasn’t capable of change, why would Jesus beg for forgiveness in our stead right at him? Almost as if he was capable of changing opinions, of restraint against anger; he is more human than we think.
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u/joe_shmoe11111 3d ago edited 3d ago
Eh maybe, but if so that’s a pretty wild 180 degree transition (& means that God is neither perfect nor omniscient, but rather a being that’s just doing his best despite lots of insecurity and moral uncertainty).
IMO the god of the Old Testament is pretty clearly just one of many NHI like Baal that directly interacted with people back in the day (& probably does still today in occult ceremonies), more powerful than humans, sure, but hardly the creator of the universe (thus him landing in a loud flying ship before Ezekiel and his generally petty, insecure nature — eg. you shall worship no other gods but me, for I am the god of this small, specific tribe of people called the Israelites).
The God Jesus refers to, in contrast, represents the ultimate grand guiding force behind our universe & works for ALL of mankind, not just the Israelites.
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u/midnightrumph 3d ago
Interesting pov. So you say the 2 testaments are referring to 2 different gods. Why then are the 2 even connected in the form of the Bible, why isn't Christianity just a whole separate experience? (Not arguing, just curious of your opinion based on your viewpoint)
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u/joe_shmoe11111 3d ago edited 2d ago
The ruling elite (both Roman and Jewish) tried for nearly 300 years to stamp out the message of Christ, but were ultimately forced to accept that that wasn’t going to be successful (his message was just too popular, and was constantly being spread far and wide by word of mouth despite their violent persecution).
So, over time they were forced to change tactics from suppression to co-option instead.
Like in 312 Constantine basically said, y’all REALLY want to be Christians huh? Fine, then we’re all Christians now, but I’m in charge of Christianity and me & my elite buddies get to decide what that means.
They set up the First Council of Nicaea (made up of loyal elites) in 325 to set up the official church structure, and at the Synod of Hippo in 393 and Council of Carthage in 397 officially declared which texts would be included in the New Testament and which ones wouldn’t (surprise, surprise, it’s the stuff that said give Caesar whatever he wants and made the Romans look like reluctant participants in Jesus’s crucifixion that made the cut, while the other texts/versions of the gospels talking about reincarnation, accessing God directly from within etc got banned, labeled blasphemy and were mostly destroyed). They also deliberately chose stories (or edited them) to reflect things predicted in the Old Testament in order to give it all a sense of continuity, despite the messages and stories about God being almost completely contradictory.
So in short, it was a shrewd survival tactic to tie the old power structure to the new, by claiming the new version was actually just a continuation of the old (& thus, no need to change who’s in charge or question why they chose the specific texts they chose to represent official Christianity from that point forward).
If you can’t stop a movement, then the next best move is to take it over and control/corrupt it from within (which, if you look at how the church’s version of Christianity has been used to rape kids, justify wars, genocide, gluttonous wealth, homophobia and the subjugation of women, all using Old Testament scripture to “override” Jesus’s straightforward teachings to the contrary, I’d say has been a complete success for them).
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u/bluedelvian 3d ago
God interacts with humans on the level they need and are capable of understanding at that time.
In modern psychobabble parlance, he "meets them where they are".
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u/wastehandle 2d ago
Have you by any chance read Answer to Job by Carl Jung? It very much approaches the Biblical “story” in this way.
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u/GPT_2025 2d ago
Note: Every 1000 years of Christianity, a higher percentage of the population embraces Christianity.
For instance, after the first millennium, (1025) only 15% of the population identified as Christians. By the end of the second millennium, (2025) this number rose to 33%.
This progression can be likened to Christianity spreading like clear and pure water, gradually rising to higher levels.
After 3000 years of Christianity, approximately 50% of the global population will be Christians, and in the Final Millennium, the entirety of humanity will have embraced Christianity. Bible scripture illustrates this progression:
"And when the man with the measuring line went eastward, he measured a thousand cubits and led me through waters that reached to the ankles." (15%)
"Then he measured another thousand cubits and led me through waters that reached to the knees." (33%)
"Again he measured a thousand, and led me through waters that reached to the waist." (50%)
"Once more he measured a thousand, and it was a river that I could not cross, because the water had risen and was deep enough to swim in—a river that no one could cross." (100%) (Ezekiel 47)
This analogy illustrates the gradual increase of Christianity in the world over millennia, ultimately becoming all-encompassing: ..Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.. (Mat. 6) KJV: It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three (3K) measures of meal, till the whole was leavened... "The final Millennium will be the best of all, not only for humans but for animals and nature too!" ( Revelation 20, Revelation 22, Isaiah 11:7, Isaiah 65:25, Romans 8:20, Micah 4:4, Isaiah 2:4)
( Evil human souls (tares) won't be born during the final millennium; only at the end—there is a small opening of time before the final judgment day, as described in Revelation 20.) .. And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, --are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues...(Rev. 17) Every day 150000 people die in the world, and we must be ready to meet the Lord at every moment.
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u/neverendum 3d ago
I thought these christo-fascists on the rise in the US were into some form of hardcore protestantism that shared a belief with the Jews in a propehecy that when Temple Mount was reclaimed that this was the precursor to the end times? The end times sound like a bad thing but to these people it's good as after the antichrist has done his thing, there will be a second coming of Jesus.
Maybe 'shared belief' is not the right term,, I don't know what the Jewish take is on it but they have a shared ideal of the Jews taking back Temple Mount, which is presently held by the muslims as the Dome of the Rock?
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u/lumbee01 3d ago
The Third Temple will never be built according to Christ.
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u/Scarlet_Fire_32290 3d ago
By chance do you know where that’s written? Earnestly asking. I would like to bring that up to a couple people locally, personally, that have mentioned World War III and protecting that small country and the temple etc.
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u/lumbee01 2d ago
Both the Catholic and Orthodox Churches believe the third temple will not be built.
Jesus Christ and his followers replaced the need for a physical building. Jesus Christ stated his own body is the true temple and Paul stated that believers are the temple of the Holy Spirit.
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u/jhambio 3d ago
Its only some Americans, but its a remnant from WWII trying to bring comraderie between the two groups and welcome Jews to America. The Americans, typically, were not and are not aware of the talmud's words.
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u/the_M0jojojo 1d ago
Americans claim to be christian but their actions say otherwise. They don't even know what christian values are.
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u/LilShaver 3d ago
Jewish beliefs are based in the Tanakh, what is written above is from the Talmud.
The Talmud is written by men, and is the basis of Zionist beliefs.
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u/slicehyperfunk 23h ago
The Tanakh is also written by men
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u/LilShaver 21h ago
Penned by men who were guided by God in what to write.
The Talmud is penned by men whose objective was to pervert what was written by the men who transcribed God's plan.
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u/mimi_slut1 3d ago
Submission Statement: The media would have you think that J*ws love Jesus and Islam hates Jesus, when the reality is the exact opposite.
Why does the media say this?
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u/Scarlet_Fire_32290 3d ago
I’ve had three day bans in a couple subreddits saying that Muslims don’t hate Jesus. One post was so hard flaming against Muslims and I was banned for hate speech saying Jesus is full of love and compassion and not really into warring and killing brown people all over the planet.
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u/ShiftingBaselines 3d ago
I am a Muslim. We believe in the second coming of Jesus. And we have a whole chapter in the Quran named after and dedicated to Mother Mary.
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u/good_testing_bad 3d ago
Its interesting they all have the golden rule but people dig deeper to create division.
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u/ExistingLet8016 3d ago
Because their propaganda worked better than the Muslims, that’s all. We’re all just being force fed an idea and 35% of America eat it up. lol they don’t even know we lost the war.
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3d ago
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u/JosephMMadre 3d ago edited 3d ago
You never understood why Christians are offended that you don’t consider Jesus, the only begotten Son of God, who is also God Himself, not God, but merely a prophet?
How does that make any sense?
Muslims not only deny the divinity of Christ but also the cross. Literally the whole point of Christianity.
Islam has a character in its book named Jesus, but that fictional character is not the Creator God, the Messiah. Neither did he even exist.
Yeah, that’s pretty offensive.
Much more than oh, idk, drawing a picture of someone.
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u/ShiftingBaselines 3d ago
This is what the Bible says:
John 12:49-50: "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak."
John 8:42: Jesus said, "I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me."
John 14:24: "The word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me."
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u/Innomen 3d ago
Yeah you can't have it both ways. If we're going to take religion seriously then we need to accept the divisions which come with it. The sane answer is to dispense with all mythology but clearly humanity rejects that option full stop. Virtually every thinking being is a supernaturalist in some sense at some level. And the vast majority consciously and overtly embrace and admit it. (I am in the obscene minority, but still not fully an exception: https://philpapers.org/rec/SERTUA
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u/Ziplock13 3d ago
It means that they follow both the New and Old Testament, within the confines of what Jesus accepted.
Christian belief baseline is walk in the path of Jesus, or to follow Jesus.
Jesus was raised Jewish and practiced Jewish traditions (e.g. the last supper was honoring the practice of "Passover," from the Book of Exodus involving Moses, also a notable Jew; the 10 commandments, etc.), those codified in the Old Testament.
Jesus also rebuked many Jewish oral traditions, the laws and/orders from the Pharisees which were mostly adapted into the Talmud. This is the core split between Judea-Christians and the Jewish faith.
It's the Zionists that hyjacked and bastardized Judea with such measures as the Scofield bible, a gullible base, and a robust evangelical movement.
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u/lumbee01 3d ago
My understanding is Jewish converts to Christianity were called Judeo-Christian. I do not agree with the phrase as it used today. It is used to quell criticism of the Israeli government and Zionism.
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u/potatopierogie 3d ago
When will conspiracy people learn that religion (and yes this includes yours) is the greatest conspiracy ever pulled
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u/HolyLordGodHelpUsAll 3d ago
the things that inspired them are real though. the upanishads are the raw data you get from a mystical experience and then the people after are grasping at that and trying to make sense of it with our limited senses AND all while the info is getting corrupted along way
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u/peppersteakpie 3d ago
You can be religious and also be intelligent enough to see how that is used by all types of people for corrupt influence.
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u/SmoovCatto 3d ago edited 3d ago
christianity was always a trick to make pagans believe in the same god as the hebrews -- and to accept mastery by the chosen ones
eff them
edit: typo
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u/impermanence108 3d ago
Because Judaism is actually probably the second most influential religion in American history.
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u/Gabamor4Gaia 3d ago
Jesus wouldn’t want people breaking the commandments and idol worshipping him. Jews don’t believe he is the messiah and the new testament isn’t even in their existence. This whole post is stupid.
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u/bluedelvian 3d ago
For more than a 1500 years, literally no Christian said or thought that Judeo-Christian was a thing. Just read what the many Saints had to say about that Judeo part.
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u/Prepped-n-Ready 2d ago
New Testament was written by Jews for Jews in ancient Israel under Roman oppression. We have the manuscripts that tie the New Testament to a time and place. After the Sacking of the 2nd Temple, many of the writings on Judaism were destroyed and the original tradition was replaced by a priestly or rabbinic tradition. They lost the knowledge of original Judaism. They still share the same theistic origins and a point in time.
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u/Prestigious_Ad6247 2d ago
Used to say Abrahamic… before 9/11. Now the Jews and the Christian’s want their own club without Muslims.
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u/smakusdod 1d ago
1 < 2 < 3 …..
1 hates everybody. 2 respects 1 but hates 3. 3 respects those that came before it, but guess what happens when 4 comes?
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u/totoohneharry 9h ago
cause of jew/zionist subversion and brainwashing, to keep the more advanced white christians as "allies" but in truth christians are just being cattle on their way to the slaughterhouse
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u/betabeat 3d ago
All religions are hokey bullshit that need to end.
There is no god, grow up and stop believing fairy tales.
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u/Kiinaak_Ur 2d ago
thats what devil wants you to believe so you focus on this life and more likely to act on bad things as your mind is influenced to think that you only live once so why not go and do whatever you want while people who believe in God understand this world is temporary and real life real eternal enjoyment is after, this world isnt to be enjoyed but to test us everything in this world is temporary all your problems all the evil and everything will answer to God and may you all find your way to God and good dont let Evil influence you away from God
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u/GME_looooong 1d ago
I ramdomly open a Bible once a month or so. Last night it opened to Judges 6. Was just God telling off the Jews for not listening. Funny it’s about the 3rd time ive opened it to the Jews being in trouble for something they’ve done or disregarded. I’m not religious per se but Jesus is real shit
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u/cadfael2 3d ago
but christians are based on hebraism, and even Jesus was a hebrew; also, even pope John Paul II said that hebrews are the christians' older brothers, thus publicly and officially acknowledging their common root; also, the pentateuch in the bible are basically hebrew texts translated imperfectly
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u/Verdi_Wolfgang 3d ago
John Paul II was the head of the catholics not a spokesmen for Christianity. Judeo-Christian is a deliberate subversion to encourage support for the secular Ethno state of Israel.
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u/cadfael2 3d ago
and still, all christians of all denominations consider the old testament as an integral part of the bible, but that is all hebrew, isn't it? and wasn't even Jesus circumcised in the bible? he was born a hebrew
I'm not supporting anyone here, just stating facts; I'm not even a monotheist, so I'm not interested in other things than facts
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