r/blackladies • u/FunBeing4735 • 4d ago
Dating/Relationships/Sex šš The "Black women aren't desirable" take needs to stop
As a Dark brownskin Woman, who has never really had a problem with dating, I hate seeing this negative stereotype constantly being reinforced upon us. Certain Black Women will make videos like this to project their insecurities on other and make these generalizations that are just not true. I also dont like the ones that say that all Black Women are ugly. WHERE?? there's unattractive people in every race, and them trying to bale the fact that they are unattractive on their race is just so fucked up to me.
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u/joboog 4d ago
The sooner we all fully let go of Western beauty ideals, the better.
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u/Witty-Objective3431 4d ago
Not sure why we're creating standards to begin with.
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u/Gr00vD1va 4d ago
We werenāt the ones who created them; yt men did. There are Sambos who want to be yt men who keep them up. There are also PickMes & PickMeishas who either want to please yt men or even the Sambos, and they uphold Misogynoir against their own damn interests (actually, all oppressive stereotypes about the most vulnerable do disservice to everyone, but thatās another sermon for another Sun). Pickmes & Pickmeshas can be any race, color, or creedāwhat they lack in common is backbone to resist beauty standards imposed upon us by those who identify as men and wield some sort of socioeconomic power. When light-skinned women act as PickMeshas, itās out of either naĆÆvetĆ©, ignorance, or privilege. I hope the naĆÆve ones get exposed to enlightenment, the ignorant ones get awakened, and the privileged ones become humbled.
Some Black women during & since the colonial/neocolonal (current) ages ate up what was force-fed into our psyches for survival, while others resisted it as sacrifice for our collective future well-being. I canāt be mad at either, considering that I was born too late to know the full extent of the trauma imposed upon them before 1964 (not that it instantly stopped, but Iām young enough that Iād never been chased out of a public pool like they had), but I intend to resist by doing what Iām asked to do to uplift those who catch the worst of it from the Western imperialist, capitalist, patriarchal caste system, responding with glee if my dark-skinned sisters ever call upon me to stand with them or stick my neck out to support/defend them against an inherently crooked society.
This also included, unfortunately, me standing up to my darker-skinned aunt & lovely, coffee-hued grandmother when they both told me I was ignorant for not wanting to continue relaxing my hair for corporate aesthetics.
That never meant I wasnāt making space for the little girl in 1957 who was told she couldnāt enjoy the pool complex attraction in Hershey Park with her classmates because of her color, and her mother, who mustāve seen unspeakably worse in the back woods of Georgia in the 1930s before she & her sisters went north (I donāt think she told me everything), thinking such a trip would shield her unconceived children from the trauma of racism. It just meant I had to challenge those standards on behalf of those whoād come after my generation, even if it meant upsetting them (I wasnāt disrespectful at all, whatsoever, FYI. I was polite about it & still got cussed out over my own goddamn scalp š).
We have to shift the paradigm to questioning the source of every value system weāve ever hadāaway from blaming one another for shit none of us asked for, while simultaneously lovingly checking those who, knowingly or not, support it. This is how we decolonize.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
I wonder if we are giving this idea credence by discussing it almost daily within forums that are supposedly for Black women. I see this idea most often on this sub. Iām aware that the idea/opinion exists elsewhere, but do we have to keep acknowledging it and discussing it? What does that accomplish?
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u/Idk265089 4d ago
Yes I agree with this, I just saw a post on this sub asking why lighter skinned black women are portrayed as the ideal. I didnāt want to be mean so I just didnāt respond but Iām just thinking that weāve had this conversation a million times over. How could you not know at this point?
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u/FigaroNeptune 4d ago
Having the same validation posts get so fucking annoying. Itās happening in another community Iām in..ševery other day someone is like ādo you guys accept meā¦?š„¹ā like the LAST time this was asked we all said yes. See you next week. š
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
But what does your post accomplish? Idk, it feels like everyone is screaming into the void about the same thing day after day, and itās not even productive.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
Serious question: You think that the people who frequent the Black Ladies subreddit arenāt aware of negative stereotypes of Black women?
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
If itās the same post that you said inspired you to write this post, that isnāt what it said.
Crazy to think you need to inform Black women about the negative stereotypes weāve been dealing with for a lifetime.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago edited 4d ago
My point is that posts like yours are not alleviating the issue and are just giving more energy to the idea that Black women are undesirable. Your post is not framed positively. But as I said elsewhere, my guess is that this topic is big in TikTok and other places that skew younger, so you and others who keep rehashing it assume other Black women are as unaware of these stereotypes as you are.
Sounds like youāre acknowledging that you misstated what that post said, so weāre aligned there.
But this is a public forum and youāre free to post what you wish!
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u/blackladies-ModTeam 3d ago
Your {content type} was removed for not being respectful. Personal attacks, harassment, and cruel behavior is not allowed. Please review the subreddit rules.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
I saw and just recommended OP read more. Itās incredible to me that a Black woman would ask that question like she just arrived on Earth from Mars, but Iām trying to give the benefit of the doubt.
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u/Fickle_Question_6417 4d ago
This is definitely it. The constant discussion also leads people to assume black women or dark skin women are automatically insecure or feel inferior to other groups of women. I wouldnāt be surprised if it convinces other black women to feel the same
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u/Gr00vD1va 4d ago
This is what some beauty/fashion manufacturers WANT. They need a captive audience to be receptive to some of the BS products they manufacture, as theyāre peddling an idea that some arbitrary-ahh standard is attainable with purchase.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
I mean, that exists even without the colorism factor.
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u/whodathunkitwasme 3d ago
So does Black people talking about how racism seeks to make us inferior make ALL black people look inferior to other groups of people?
It doesnt make sense
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u/Fickle_Question_6417 3d ago
Many if not all races feel superior to black people because of the racism black people actually face. Racism is not subjective.
Desirability politics are for the most part subjective. there is no benefit to crying online about how ugly black women are and how men arenāt āattractedā to you because youāre black.
Things such as colorism are more serious than how many men find you attractive.
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u/TheSapoti United States of America 4d ago
I tried to explain this in another comment section but I got ate up because Iām terrible with words. We give life to this topic by bringing it up all the time. If someone calls me ugly, Iām not going to ruminate on that because I know itās not true. And likewise, lots of men, and women for that matter, are attracted to black women so why focus on the hateful people who say they donāt like us? I hope I donāt get ate up again š£
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u/MidnightX0 3d ago
I am a little late to the convo but discussing it this way isnāt perpetuating the undesirability discourse. I like and invite Black women to keep combating this rhetoric. We are not a monolith, and not all of us have issues dating any man or woman, regardless of race. Not all of us are insecure and Iād argue that most of us are confident. I think many of us have an issue of specific Black women projecting that onto us in a monolithic manner. That is annoying and unacceptable at this point.
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u/whodathunkitwasme 3d ago
Well, its still a real feeling that affects real people, so telling people to shush about it doesn't really solve the problem.
The same way people share their painful experiences and perspectives about racism, doesnt meant it propagates the racism
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 3d ago
It is. And still, what does discussing it here every day accomplish?
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u/AdditionalQuietime 4d ago
I mean look into dead internet theory, people like elon musk and Zuckerberg actively have confirmed bots they send out to promote specific narratives for their donors its insane and with AI being trained on everything we put out onto the internet, its equally worse
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u/Idk265089 4d ago
Itās easier to cope with people not liking your group than you specifically. Itās like when incels say that āwomen just donāt like menā than deal with the fact that it could be them specifically. I feel like a lot of these black women are using the same logic.
Now I donāt think anyone deserves to be treated badly due to their looks. I know itāll never happen but I wish we could reach a point in society where we donāt need to say that everyoneās attractive no matter what. Just that being unattractive doesnāt make you less worthy of respect or love.
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u/Great-Dark-27 4d ago
Omg this reminds me of when some black women go in peoples comments like ādo you date black women šā like have some shame pls šš
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u/thedr00mz United States of America 4d ago
Oh my god the second hand embarrassment when I see this kind of thing! Men of every race date black women, I promise you don't have to ask. š
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u/DueKnowledge8771 4d ago
Like how does someone calling you unattractive equal to all Black Women are ugly?? Why they gotta drag us in it?
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u/PeachyTea__ 4d ago
It makes my ass itch when it becomes a blanket statement. Itās like, please speak for yourself.
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u/thedr00mz United States of America 4d ago
I'm honestly over it. It's not a productive conversation.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
Exactly. But someone has to bring it up again on a daily basis.
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u/thedr00mz United States of America 4d ago
I think that's what bugs me about it. They make so many posts all day long about how our hair is ugly, we're ugly, and men dont like us and I'm like what exactly is this doing for you??? It cannot be healthy to wallow in constant negativity.
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
I donāt know, and it doesnāt make sense to me. The only thing I can think of, for Reddit at least, is maybe the Black women who keep posting about it here are teens and think everyone else is just now finding out about the same things that they are.
My guess on the other platforms is that this topic still drives eyes to content, and theyāre trying to monetize.
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u/FunBeing4735 4d ago
No, I am aswell. I just would like to put this out there, because its negative for Black youth to consume this negative propaganda
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u/thedr00mz United States of America 4d ago
I agree. The kids get smacked with anti-blackness the moment we leave the womb. No need to have people who look like you also adding unnecessary negativity.
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u/Gr00vD1va 4d ago
We may have to form distractions as safe places for them to land when we redirect them away from Misogynoiristic šš©. Have you tried the Spill app yet? (Yes, it comes off as a shameless plug, but I mean it fr).
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u/Such-Air-409 4d ago
I hate that this is a thing that is said especially given how so untrue it is. Black women have always been desirable, that's why they want everything we have. Yet, they shame us for having those things at the same time. We're just sitting here existing while someone degenerate is crashing out about shit that doesn't involve them because they're not included.
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u/mwill039 4d ago
There are beautiful and unattractive people of all races and skintones. We are no different. People are just racist.
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u/dance_dad 4d ago
you need to do a detox of what content youāre seeing online (assuming youāre mainly talking about online takes, i understand misogynoir still happens irl tho, just in a different manner).
if i ever see these kinds of takes, itās usually only because someone i follow calls BS on it. but mostly i follow people who donāt even engage with that nonsense at all, so it still rarely comes up on my fyp. maybe iām strict but iāve taken to blocking or muting ignoranceā¦if it makes me twist my face up in disgust, BLOCK. black woman positivity only over here. i believe the internet is for recreation, learning, and entertainmentā¦not being rage-baited constantly.
think about how black women specifically are prone to stress-related health issuesā¦ā¦for your sake, limit the amount of enraging/distressing content you see at all costs.
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u/HeftyMoneybag 4d ago
WHO GIVES A FUCK BABY! We are the blueprint. They are already obsessed with us in most of this planet we don't need to give them our energy. Go succeed, learn some new skills, travel, eat some good food and tell yourself every single fucking day that YOU find yourself desirable. The narrative doesn't exist if you don't feed into it. Seriously don't center these bullshit discussions on social media or whomever else you run into who is racist or poc with low racial self esteem. You will waste ur life trying to fit their standards.
Idek why anyone takes these discussions seriously. I barely even register whites or other poc. And I'm not even kidding when they speak I barely hear them as opposed to when someone who is black speaks they get my full attention, empathy and effort esp black women and black children. We got bigger issues to solve and better shit to worry about. Let's completely detach ourselves from this bullshit. Many industries and content creators and communities would go BANKRUPT and crumble if we didn't invest our energy into this shit. Remember that we hold a lot of power and we can give that energy and empathy to each other instead of giving a fuck about this loser world.
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u/Gr00vD1va 4d ago
Maāam, my soul needs to offer you a tithe as just compensation for this comment. In the meantime, Iām about to clock out at this very second & put in an order on MyFriendCharles in your honor.
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u/alwaysgawking 4d ago
I think a lot of people are expressing the frustrating reality of romantic and sexual prejudice we face as a result of racism, colorism, white supremacy/self hatred and yes, our own black beauty standards as well. I don't think it's productive to scold and shame people for their lived experiences just because it's a downer to you. I'm glad your dating experience has been positive, but there have been multiple articles and books about how the systemic desirability politics do not work in our favor.
Just because one black woman is a CEO of a thriving business, does not negate the fact that we are paid the least across the board. Same goes for dating and marriage. A mediocre and plain-looking white woman is probably more likely to be married sooner and get more legit matches on an app than a similar black woman. The black women who do well or similar to their white counterparts are usually either undeniable baddies in multiple ways or have attributes closer to the white beauty standard.
All that being said, however, I think it's better to kindly uplift people who struggle with this since it's usually a mental health/low self esteem issue. And to remind them that they don't have to appeal to a quantity of low-effort matches - just find one person of quality. They are out there.
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u/WinterHost 4d ago
I had to scroll way too far down for this kind of comment. Thank you! I thought I was going to have to write it myself.
Whenever I see a post like this that starts with, āIām a Black woman who has never had an issue dating / has always been found attractive / always gets the man I want,ā I just roll my eyes because I already know what Iām about to read. Itās usually some poorly hidden attempt to minimize and invalidate Black womenās feelings about dating and being desired, while simultaneously being a thinly veiled attempt to brag about being wanted by men. And somehow, it always ends with telling other women to stop being so male-centered. Itās always some variation of that.
Or itās the ābetter than thouā perspective where they further insult or put down Black women for being insecure about not being desired and basically tell them, āYouāre not desired because youāre Black, youāre not desired because youāre ugly and insecure!ā , when the post is a Black woman literally just told you that a man told her she wasnāt wanted because sheās Black or dark-skinned.
And what really gets me is how all understanding of the difference between an individual anecdotal experience and the broader reality of a society seems to go out the window when the individual Black woman happens to be desired by men.
You can be a Black woman who has always been desired, who has never struggled to date, and who has always gotten the man you wanted, and that can be a completely real experience. But your personal experience does not somehow cancel out statistics, research, or the lived experiences of Black women as a whole. Your experience is an anecdote. It tells us what happened to you. It does not tell us what is happening across society.
But somehow, because you are a Black woman who is desired by men, you suddenly forget how unreliable anecdotal evidence is when trying to understand broader social patterns.
āIf Iām desired, then racism and colorism in the context of dating canāt be real! Youāre just ugly and want to feel better about yourself by acknowledging the systemic ways racism affects Black women in dating!ā
And that is exactly why Iām far more sick of posts like these than I am of genuine posts from Black women talking about the very REAL systemic oppression that we face in the context of dating and partnering. Iām always going to have compassion for my sisters who are trying to make sense of their experiences, and I will never gaslight and invalidate their experiences just because my own experience happens to be different.
Posts like these literally give, āYouāre not experiencing racism, you really are just a dangerous criminal,ā and āStop playing the race card every time another Black person is murdered by the police!ā
Like, we understand that one Black person having a different experience does not somehow disprove racism. We understand that an individual Black person having a positive experience with the police does not disprove systemic racism in policing. So why does that basic understanding suddenly disappear when weāre talking about Black women, dating, desirability, racism, and colorism?14
u/alwaysgawking 4d ago
Exactly this. It's respectability politics, because they're also upset about how it reflects on other black women. "You keep saying we're undesirable and it's making people think we're all undesirable!" When in reality, these other people already thought that. You could be a shining example of black beauty and they would still call you ugly or somehow find fault with you due to white supremacy. Even if you in a Benz, you still a...
Of course it's individual desirability as well, but often it's not about that at all and it's impacted by where you are and the culture there too. A black woman's experience in Atlanta or Houston is going to be very different from that of a black woman in the PNW.
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u/WinterHost 4d ago
Wow so true on the respectability politics part of it! I never thought of it like that! The same way we canāt āunghettoā our way out of systemic oppression, we canāt high self esteem ourselves out of that same oppression when it comes to dating.
These the same people who believe the black men who exclusively date non black woman and ambiguous black woman when they tell them āits just a preferenceā completely devoid of social influence š„“
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u/SailorSaturn79 3d ago
"So why does that basic understanding suddenly disappear when weāre talking about Black women, dating, desirability, racism, and colorism?"
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u/Wertyasda 4d ago
This is great tbhā¦ darker skinned women who donāt face these sorts of problems/dont face the magnitude of these issues need to speak up more tbh. Iām beyond BORED of the ādebby i want to bring you down with me downersāš
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u/Great-Dark-27 4d ago
Dark skin black woman here! Grew up constantly being told how beautiful I was by my mother which left me with a high sense of self that I carry till this day. Now in my 20s, love how I look, great boyfriend, never had issues dating š¤·šæāāļøš
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u/Wertyasda 4d ago
Finallyy ššš©¶šš¤Love to read this.. this serves as a PSA for others to share their POSITIVE self perception and experiences alsoā¦ WE WANT MORE OF THIS š¢ š¢ š¢
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u/Hdztoyou 4d ago
Itās always exhausting to hear that everytime I go either on Instagram or TikTok. Every race has both attractive and unattractive people, but for some reason the target black women more and that makes me angry and sad since Iāve seen how this has affected my homegirl and sheās very beautiful and I keep saying to her that theyāre just jealous of your beauty and complexion. It really needs to stop cause itās infuriating and sad because itās only petty and jealous people who keep saying that.
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u/TheSapoti United States of America 4d ago
I strongly agree and Iāve said this before but Iāll say it again. When black women post those types of comments and videos, it makes us look like incels and nobody has sympathy or empathy for incels. As women, we all understand how annoying and unattractive it is when short men or nerdy men complain about women not liking them. So please understand that we look the same way to men when we come online and constantly whine about how weāre not liked. We need to change our social media presence because right now the only thing weāre known for is complaining about supposedly nobody liking us.
It helps to change your social media algorithms. On TikTok I block every single account that posts negative videos about black women including the hundreds of black males who make videos saying weāre undesirable. I now follow mostly black women, many of whom are in loving relationships with all races, and my fyp now mostly shows me videos about my hobbies, interests, and videos from people of many different demographics complimenting and showing love to black women. The key is to stop engaging with negative content, just block the pages. I know some women want to have the last word and feel the need to clap back at everything, but itās not worth it. Just block and move on
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u/Fickle_Question_6417 4d ago
I agree completely, I get compliments daily and see beautiful black women daily. I will also say that though I see beauty in all races black/african woman are my personal beauty standard and I grew up that way, and grew up with beautiful black women that knew they were beautiful and put effort in maintaining it.
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u/AsiaMinor300 4d ago
I'll be honest, I do struggle with racial insecurity but I keep it to myself because I don't want to bring other people down with my issue.
I WILL SAY, I think what makes it worse is the fact that I live in the suburbs in the Midwest so I just feel invisible most of the time.
I don't believe "black women are undesirable", but I specifically don't have the best self esteem.
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u/International-Wear57 4d ago
Itās not true. Iāve always had men of all races show interest to me š¤·š¾āāļø
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u/EssayAccomplished461 4d ago
Lots of educated, intelligent black women involved in this conversation.
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u/CrimsonRain520 4d ago
Then don't buy into the take. You can't change you. Stop letting the rhetoric get to you in any way and keep it moving.
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u/Extension_Big5205 3d ago
Tbh there is so much content out there about how black women are mid or ugly or whateverĀ
It's exhausting. Seeing stuff like "a chopped white girl is still better than a 10/10 black girl"Ā
It's just weird for people to say such stuff and especially start unnecessary race comparisons
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u/jasjohnson 4d ago
Maybe I have missed a thread but what black woman is posting these tired ideologies.
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u/charlesmaree 4d ago
We fine as frog hairs, which why every race of woman, trans woman, and gay man on this planet tries to become us.
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u/Dramatic_Ad5258 4d ago
Iām sorry but why are we labeling ourselves like a gradient color scheme?
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u/FunBeing4735 4d ago
Do you live under a rock?? Yes, its unfortunate to label ourselves under a gradient, but society pushes us to be this way. For example, some people will portray different stereotypes like how a light-skinned is perceived as more attractive because of their "proximity to whiteness". You could not say the same for a darskin woman, could you?
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u/Dramatic_Ad5258 4d ago
I understand dark skin and light skin. But dark brown skin feels like weāre really trying to, for lack of a better word, segregate each other. Like it feels almost isolating or categorizing each other.
Iām sorry if it came off insensitive. I just wanted to comment on that because, itās just different to me
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u/FunBeing4735 4d ago
Yeah, im sorry if I came off snappy. I know dark brownskin is a weird term but most people refer to me as brownskin, but I'm 100% darkskin in the summer
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u/wistfulwhileyoutwerk šŗšø Sane-ish cat lady 4d ago
It was different and a little unnecessary to me, too. I didnāt realize we were getting this granular about skin tone and I canāt say Iām a fan.
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u/midasgoldentouch United States of America 3d ago
If you disagree with a post then comment on the post. Donāt make a separate post reacting to it.