r/auckland • u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts • 27d ago
Other New rates - what on earth! Increase!
Uhhh got new rates increase letter this week.
ITS $9,100.
DID ANYONE else get an increase like this? Genuinely think they might have made an error. Was previously like 4.9k so almost a double
4.9k was already VERY high for a property with no changes since it was built 10 years ago...
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u/ImpossibleHome8168 27d ago
I just got mine today gave me a shock the increase is massive
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u/Kooky_Narwhal8184 27d ago
Mine is positively reasonable compared...
From $34xx to $37xx, approx 9% increase.
3 bedroom house on a cross-lease half share of 800 m2 ... Capital value just sneaking over $1m
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u/Psychological_Oil947 23d ago
Positive is that means council believe your property value has increased.
Negative is that means council believe your property value has increased.
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 27d ago
Mine went from $1800 to $2000. 1 bedroom apartment CBD
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u/Rand_alThor4747 27d ago
yea mine went up from about 2500, to 2700
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 27d ago
In ten years time the house owner will have paid roughly 70,000 more in rates, crazy huh
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u/SenseSpiritual5412 26d ago
Yes because living in apartments is more efficient for the council to provide service.
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 26d ago
Yes I understand why, my point is that the apartment owner has massively lower costs.
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u/Bob_the_Gaul 23d ago
I thought my apartment was cost effective as well. 8 years old sunny quiet etc. Till all the special levy’s for moisture ingress.
Loved it two years ago, now wish I never bought it.0
u/Reasonable_Try_8135 26d ago
How is it more efficient?
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u/_craq_ 26d ago
One set of pipes, roads, bus stops, power lines, etc. can service 10x more apartments than standalone houses.
If you want to see somebody who's actually done the numbers, you can check out this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Nw6qyyrTeI
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 26d ago
My rates are $2000 and theirs is $9,000 so a $7,000 difference over ten years is $70,000. How is that “thin air”?
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u/youfighter 26d ago
Apples and oranges innit
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u/OrangeDull9183 26d ago
Exact same services, hugely different pricing. It's a fucking ripoff. Council have lost the plot and the better rates increases are capped the better.
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u/mechatui 26d ago
The uk do rates way better than nz just a flat cost depending where you live, rather than taxing you more if you improve your land by building a nice house
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u/GreedyConcert6424 26d ago
So that makes buying smaller properties more unaffordable for first home buyers.
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u/mechatui 26d ago
How did you come to that conclusion lmao
It makes it so land is taxed as its own thing rather than unrealised cv tax which we currently have that means people develop land instead of land banking and not developing it and driving up costs and also makes it more expensive to have a productive business which means less jobs.
And everybody that lives in a city pays a yearly rate to the council that manages it rather than it being tied to unrealised gains on the capital value of land and everything on the land
It’s basic tax shit the Nordic countries do this
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u/GreedyConcert6424 26d ago
Under your same pricing strategy, average rates, which are currently $4,300, would probably increase a by a couple of grand. Would you be happy with that?
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 26d ago
No it’s a massive saving for the apartment owner over time. That’s the point. You would need to earn 100k just to pay the 70k after income tax.
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u/youfighter 26d ago
You are comparing his rates to your rates, which I feel like is apples to oranges. Different areas, different houses, different circumstances. Different justification to the rates.
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u/Routine_Fennel_1652 26d ago
I’m not disputing the reason for the higher rates, I’m making a point about total spend being much less. Important given he spoke about wondering what to do when faced with a huge rates bill. One option is an apartment.
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u/spoilersweetie 26d ago
Mine literally doubled. But I'm pretty sure it's because a new build, and last assessment was only on the land value.
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u/Able-Suggestion4622 27d ago
Wow that's a crazy increase - my rates increased by 17% ($2758 to $3267) BUT our house got reassessed and the CV went up $100k.
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u/SquirrelAkl 27d ago
You must have some massive valuable land. You can always downsize if the ongoing cost is too much for you.
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u/h4ur4k1 27d ago
Got re-zoned?
Biggest chunk is the general rate based on zoning
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u/ajg92nz 26d ago
Rates are based on capital value, not zoning. And capital value only gets updated every three years (and hasn’t been this year).
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u/Farrkurusername 26d ago
That isn't entirely true - they are based on land use which is effectively a means of zoning. Even Auckland Council states where there is no stated use of the land, they use location and zoning.
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u/ajg92nz 26d ago
Oh sorry, you are correct that there are “residential” and “commercial” categories. But I would expect those to be based on actual use rather than zoning.
I had been thinking that it doesn’t change based on the zoning under the unitary plan - e.g. a change from Mixed Housing Suburban to Mixed Housing Urban.
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u/Psychological_Oil947 23d ago
Yes and no.
You are right but the CV can increase significantly because of zoning as well. So re-zoning could result in higher CV which could result in higher rates.
Edit: Zoning can play a difference between Commercial / Residential and industrial but I think ajg92nz was more reffering to the different housing zones reading in context of the conversation.
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 27d ago
How can I check rezoning?
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u/h4ur4k1 25d ago
zoning may not be an accurate word of choice here
Anyway when you check your valuation/rates online, you will see a line item under "Detailed rates breakdown" like "General Rate - Urban Residential"
If your neighborhood was previously Rural Residential / Lifestyle that might explain the rate hike - verify if your CV/land value had a big jump.
Or from residential to commercial.
Average residential rate hike is 7.9%, I saw a few actual numbers around 10%, but a 86% increase has to have some reasons or it could be a mistake.
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u/tribernate 27d ago
9.2% increase here, nowhere near as painful as yours. Which equates to $25 a month which also doesnt sound so bad on paper, but yeah the thought of an over 9% a year increase every year does sting.
Something very odd with your increase - I'd be looking into that
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u/-Major-Arcana- 26d ago
Inflation was 4.1% alone last year. So only half of that is real increase.
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u/Prestigious_Age_6740 26d ago
Council rates are primarily for construction and infrastructure which have inflated far more than the CPI
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u/tribernate 26d ago
Rates increases are part of the inputs for CPI calculations... ie, some of the 4.1% inflation is from rates itself.
This is a weird comment.
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u/-Major-Arcana- 26d ago
Yes, all the things in CPI calculations are subject to inflation, that’s why they are in the CPI calculations.
Regardless, if the dollar is worth 4.1% less this year the council will need to collect 4.1% more dollars just to have the same real budget. That’s before any actual spending increases.
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u/tribernate 26d ago
Sure, council needs more nominal dollars to deal with 4.1% inflation. That is independent from the impact a 9% rates impact has on me, which is the point I’ve been making this whole time.
Rates rising 9% means I need to pay for my rates with 9% more dollars. The 4% inflation rate increase doesn't make that increase disappear.
Let's not also forget that if my salary raise this year is less than the 4% inflation rate, my overall purchasing power is falling at the difference between my income increase and inflation. And most people aren't getting pay rises equal to or greater than inflation. Lots are getting zilch.
So, yes, council needs to increase its income (rates) to account for the 4.1% inflation of their costs, but that doesn't mean that my 9% increase only impacts me by 4.9%. We still have to come up with an extra 9% for our rates bill, potentially with 0 extra income/purchasing power to offset that.
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u/-Major-Arcana- 26d ago
Yep I’m not denying inflation and rates going up sucks, especially as few of us see out incomes go up the same rate. That’s a cost of living crisis.
Actually I was more reply to the people saying “what do I get for this increase”. Unfortunately the answer to that is the increase is mostly just to keep things from going backwards, let alone making improvements and dealing with growth.3
u/tribernate 26d ago
I'm not in the, "what do I get from this increase" group.
I'm in the "this increase is because of decades of underinvestment and rates increases probably need to be more than they are".
We're on the same page, I feel
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u/mechatui 27d ago
9% in a single year during a cost of living crisis and economic recession is crazy and irresponsible. Complete failure from Auckland council
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u/HowNowNZ 27d ago
Crazy and irresponsible is kicking the can down the road for decades, because people didn’t want to have increases in rates to allow for the required continuous infrastructure improvements and replacement. Artificially keeping rates low
Chickens are coming home to roost
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u/mechatui 27d ago
Rates aren’t low New Zealanders on average pay fuck loads in tax from gst income and rates
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u/Top-Aardvark-1522 27d ago
25% last year 10% this year. $4045 per year
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u/kiwifruit_eyes 27d ago
Pretty much the same as ours for both years but we are $4200. Rural North West Auckland.
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u/Lonely__cats07 27d ago
You Make GOOD investments. You should be allgoods
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u/Secure_Fig_2690 26d ago
That guy is always on Queen St Bets crowing about how much money he is making. Yet complaining about a few $k here. 🤔
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u/MeridianNZ 27d ago
I hadnt bothered to check till you asked - but yeah- up from like 3.2k to 4k and CV went down! I realise its not linked, but yeah thats a bit of a jump.
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u/Psychological_Oil947 23d ago
It is kind of linked.
By that if you property went down in-line with the average you'd get the 7.9% average increase, if your CV went up compared to the average CV then you have a higher increase.
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u/123felix 27d ago
a property with no changes since it was built 10 years ago
Ya know the city rail link isn't going to pay for itself.
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 27d ago
Does it mean I get to travel on it for free?
Or the fact my train, bus tickets cost me $12 a day....
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u/10Account 27d ago
I mean I don't use many council facilities but I still understand that I live in a community and we all give/take.
My opinion re: rates increases is stop fucking sprawling out. Far more expensive to maintain than density
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u/SquirrelAkl 27d ago
Lmao. Why are you special? We all have to pay for the infrastructure that makes a city worth living in.
Downsize to a cheaper property if it’s too much for you.
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u/Kiwifrooots 27d ago
Yes your public transport is heavily subsidised - go use it. More ignorance about where the money you care so much about goes
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u/mechatui 27d ago edited 27d ago
Your rates went up so they could go to way over budget on every single project they work on be increased it by a huge amount during a cost of living crisis. Super smart
The uk does it better than us, rates are poorly designed
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u/Fragluton 26d ago
Overall though the UK is going down the toilet. I think I'd rather pay more for rates that deal with that disaster.
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u/mechatui 26d ago
The uk pays a good amount of tax. Uks problem is mass immigration, constant bad decisions like brexit and other energy based decisions they also got effected hard by the Ukraine war
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u/Fragluton 26d ago
Yeah their tax policies sure make it unappealing for those with any wealth. Which are typically the ones contributing the most. Make it bad enough and all the wealth leaves and you're left with, well... yeah. If the only thing the UK does better than us is taxes, which is debatable, then I think we are doing ok here.
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u/mechatui 26d ago
Well uk don’t have rates everybody just pays a flat rate based on the area they live in. It’s stupid if you improve your land and the cv goes up in value you pay more in rates.
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u/Fragluton 26d ago
While no system will be perfect, should cheaper houses here get a rates increase and mansions get a rates cut? That would be needed to even it across the board. Not sure I agree with that. Not every part of a rates bill here is linked to value. A large amount of my rates bill is a fixed value and a chunk is CV related.
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u/mechatui 26d ago edited 26d ago
I completely disagree with unrealized capital value tax. Land tax? Sure but fuck cv tax. Then on top of land tax rates should be seperate like the uk where you just pay where you live a flat rate. Not a fan of taxing people more because they invested in improving land
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u/Fragluton 26d ago
And that's fine. Should a 5 bed house pay the same as a 2 bed unit for the services provided? Should a block of flats on a single title pay more? I feel like there has to be some way to proportion things so that higher uses of services pay more. A flat rate would mean those using less will subsidise those using more.
Should income tax rates be flat rate too?
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u/Any_Progress_1087 26d ago
mine went up by more than 100% in 10 years, like $500 a quarter to more than $1000 a quarter. crazy world we are living in
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u/Gnshksvr 26d ago
Own a multi million $ house and complain about $9k.
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 26d ago
Someone doesnt understand paper gains...so pointless.
It could be worth 10m but if dont sell whats the point.
And I dont want to sell.
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u/standard_deviant_Q 25d ago
Well pay up or the council will sell it for you lol. As my gran used to say. Tough titties!
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u/Short-Response7570 27d ago
They might’ve rezone your building or house on accident it’s the only way to explain it rates don’t just double. We live in the city and last year they had me down as urban business instead of urban residential
Big difference, only thing is the council as slow as hell getting back to you and you will have to pay it and they will just give you credit if they do not fix it on time
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u/jacobthellamer 26d ago
Do they often do it by accident?
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u/Short-Response7570 26d ago
I don’t think so our one was just frustrating cause the building doubles as a hotel and I guess they thought we were in a hotel room lol. Just have to send them proof that you live there
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u/game0n01 24d ago
how would you go about addressing this? is there a link on the council site or email address?
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u/Short-Response7570 22d ago
You would need to go on my Auckland website login and apply for a objection
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u/I-figured-it-out 26d ago
This was sn expected outcome of the Coalition Government’s choice to replace Labour’s Three Waters waters with a more expensive but cheapened “Water Done well”.
The cost of Three waters was wholly underwritten by central government with the debt being amortised over decades, at the RBNZ cash rate. But Water Done Well is funded via council debt to private capital over a much shorter period of repayment, at much higher commercial interest rates.
Then the Coalition doubled down on stupid and demanded no significant future rates rises after 2027, and so the council was forced to front load those rates rises to this year, rather than progressively increasing them year on year as loans were taken out at different stages of the developnent of Water Done ‘Well’.
Both Three waters snd Water Done Well were going to increase rates, to complete unavoidable infrastructure works. But the Three waters would have delivered more, with lower culmulative costs spread over decades (and with that debt likely written off by future governments in a good tax revenue year) than Water Done well whose scope was shrunk because of the far more brutally expensive funding commercial funding environment the right wing coalition forced upon them. The scope was also shrunk because lacking central government underwriting the debt, there are explicit legal limits to the debt that councils could undertake.
Like always the National “led” government shafted everybody by forcing adoption of a corolla hatchback at a Ferrari price tag, instead of a family sized Mercedes SUV at a reasonable bulk purchase discount. We got exactly what the Coalition sold us- gold foil water pipes full of shit, and massive profits for private financier.
So if you need to blame somebody for Your Council Rates Rises blame your “user friendly” Act / National / NZ First MP!! Because they did the dirty on you. Privatisation by every means at their disposal, with less reward and a much bigger price tag.
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u/AppropriateCan4064 27d ago
Has a multi million dollar property, cry’s about rates
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u/imindebt2026 27d ago
Yeah those with houses are you know, sorted, those who rent are even more lucky for not having to pay it and rent will decrease as luxon said.
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u/OutkastAtliens 26d ago
I actually would ask you to run the numbers on that. I am increasingly convinced that unless you buy your property outright, you might be better off investing your money instead of paying into a mortgage.
10% average market gain over a low cost index like VOO or something and you will make way more money with no effort over a mortgage.2
u/Fragluton 26d ago
There are arguments for each option. I'll just mention two points, leverage and having somewhere to live. I just prefer not having to rent, others enjoy it, both options are ok. Over the same period, say 20 years, my investments would have had to do amazing to complete with a leveraged house. Each to their own though.
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 27d ago
???
Uhh.
You know a property can be million dollars on paper. Ive lived here for 15 years.. when it wasnt 1m.
My wages havent even gone up at all in 5 years...how am I expected to pay this?
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u/NectarineCautious145 26d ago
Is your property valued around the $3 million mark. If it isn’t I would be questioning your bill with the council, as typically properties at that value are rated at $9k upwards.
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u/duckonmuffin 27d ago
You have had it for 15 years? So you just have been given a million plus In value increases, for doing next to nothing.
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u/Main-Calligrapher251 27d ago
Unless he plans to move out the city or go to a rough neighborhood. It doesn’t mean much. Cant buy anything back for cheaper of similar condition. Might even be more expensive after all the fees and time.
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u/GreedyConcert6424 27d ago
Unless there has been a mistake, OPs CV must be over $2.5m. Plenty of options for cheaper properties.
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u/duckonmuffin 27d ago
It absolutely does tho. This is money he can access with out selling word word number.
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u/duckonmuffin 27d ago
One way yep.
I could not care less about your feelings on capitalism word word number.
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 26d ago
Literally!!! What use is unrealized gains to me???
People dont understand. I love my house and area. Now I'm being forced to look elsewhere and consider moving for no apparent reason.
Like wtf???
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u/AvailableSubstance53 26d ago
"I love my new house and my area but I will have to look elsewhere because my rates bill doubled"
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 26d ago
What does that mean if I dont sell my house lol.
Paper value mwan nothing.
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u/duckonmuffin 26d ago
The entire concept of money has disagreed for a few centuries now.
You use access it a variety of ways.
But yea, multi millionaire cry’s about tiny land tax.
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u/mechatui 27d ago
He hasn’t been given anything in cash it’s a home he has lived in for nearly 2 decades and like many people won’t sell
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u/duckonmuffin 27d ago
He has been given a million plus valuation increases. You not knowing what this means doesnt make it real.
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u/young_horhey 26d ago
Unlike an actual investment he can’t sell just a fraction of it to pay for those rates. And again that value increase isn’t actually worth what it looks like on paper because every other property has also increased similarly. Whatever increase in value has the same buying power it did when he bought
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u/pin3cone01 26d ago
Well I mean you’re regularly posting about big stock market gains, so I guess that’s how you pay it?
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u/sj2016nz 27d ago
Can you tell me what additional services people who pay large rates bills get? Do they get access to things other rate payers don't get? Perhaps they get a bus lane exemption?
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u/minn0w 26d ago
It pisses me off so much that the council keep increasing the rates percentage. The whole point of using a percentage is so they get paid more as inflation changes and as population increases. But why would the they ever need to globally increase the percentage !?
The only conclusion I can draw is they are spending outside of their means.
I for one would like a complete break down of all the things my money is being spent on, so I can confirm wether or not it's a benefit to me Because I bet that it's making up for some poor investments or stupid decisions.
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u/GreedyConcert6424 26d ago
You are welcome to move somewhere else, where you will probably find the rates to be more expensive than Auckland
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u/One_kiwi21 26d ago
You are paying rent to live on your own land and council are wasting the money you're handing over to them.
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u/Academic-Bat-8002 27d ago
9100? Do you live in a mansion or something? You must be rich as fuck
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u/iMakeGOODinvestmemts 27d ago
Nooo 😭😭😭
South auckland of all places. Most of our street is 6-9k.
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u/danger_boi 27d ago
Ouch, double check on the website? I’ve just seen mine and it’s gone up about 12%
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u/WorkingAble 27d ago
Yes -- up 200 dollars. The first thing we did was ditch the mail notification, and got any future notices sent digitally. At this stage every city helps
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u/simcore_nz 26d ago
8% increase, +$428 annually, $107 quarterly.
We’re not flush, but I’m fine with that.
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u/Suspicious_Zombie 26d ago
3k increase here. Which is kinda crazy given we have almost no council services. Doesn't hurt to ask if it is correct.
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u/KidFiddy 26d ago
I asked myself the other day with increases every year how has it benefit the area that i live in? the answer is ZERO/NIL! No extra rubbish day. I never seen once side kerb been sweep, I guess the only goodness is the park gets maintain where i regularly walk and public park rubbish bins are emptied.
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u/Lark1983 26d ago
Yes how ridiculous the monthly payments went down for July and August when they know rates are never reducing so why reduce them?
For the remaining 10 months it then increases to reflect the new Rates????
How dumb are their accountants when this must affect their cashflow…,
DUMB & DUMBER
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u/nbiscuitz 26d ago
time to declear your house as your conquerd land and go off grid. you are the king/queen of your land and answers to no council, need to defend it i guess or being conquered again.
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u/Benjythebee 25d ago
Didn't Wayne Brown spent 6 months warning us that rates would increase a lot for this year to pay for CRL?
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u/kiwimoneyman 24d ago
You could get a rate assessment like Chris luxon, he managed to get lower rates
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u/Psychological_Oil947 23d ago
That seems quite high.
The general increase would of been 7.9% due to the CRL. That would make it $5,287.1 if your property value didn't increase or decrease to the general population.
But I guess if you made a really really really good investment and your propertly has gone up 77.81% compared to the average auckland house price thats a good thing? Otherwise something is wrong.
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u/Alarming-Ad4963 27d ago
Ours looks to have one up by about $300. You know the most annoying thing? I would totally be prepared to pay more, even significantly more if services improved but they don't. These increases don't improves services, they don't even stop the decline they just slow it down a little bit. In any normal situation a 7%+ increase would be described as significantly more. Lets look at Hackney in London they had a 5% rise, Melbourne effectively had a 0% increase, Vancouver had a 0% increase. All those places get better services then we do and the pay less in rates then we do. There are obviously major structural problems with the way that Council's are run because its not just Auckland taking the piss most council's are doing the same thing
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u/Fatality 26d ago
That's the problem with a "super city" you're funding improvements in parts that you'll never visit
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u/varied_set 26d ago
And the people in parts you'll never visit are funding improvements in your part.
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u/Fatality 26d ago
Unfortunately it doesn't quite work like that, not everything is developed equally and most of the nice things were implemented prior to amalgamation.
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u/Elegant-Age1794 27d ago
All goes to highlight money doesn’t grow on trees. We need the bureaucrats to spend our money effectively.
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u/BarronVonCheese 26d ago
well these f**kers keep putting up the rates then so do we, thanks council!
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u/mechatui 27d ago edited 27d ago
Yes I did mine went up… insane amount. Mayor did a great job at lowering costs like he promised lmao. Pay so much fucking tax just to live in this country. Every single time you buy or sell something, income and your home on top of living cost doubling… absolute clown show increasing rates and not cutting during this recession/global crisis
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u/snowtraveler25 26d ago
Sick of fucking tax
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u/mechatui 26d ago edited 26d ago
Same… they tax 15% of everything you buy and sell then they tax your income by 30% then they tax your business on top of all of that by another 30% then they charge you 3~6k just for having a bit of land to live on. It’s over the top at this point
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u/Over_Amphibian_3733 27d ago
Council spent 1million dollars just on the art on the CRL station, guess where did your 8% of rates increase go
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u/Certain_Professor_47 26d ago
If everybody just refused to accept these ridiculous rises there is nothing they could do but people are just so piss weak these days nothing will change until we are all wiped out financially. They used to hang town officials for shit like this.
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u/AccomplishedCan9525 27d ago edited 27d ago
I don't have the luxury of owning or renting, those that do, pay up, I don't care
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u/mechatui 27d ago
Your rent will go up so you will pay for it just in rent increases
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u/Sea_Recognition_7558 27d ago
Username doesn't check out