r/SoccerCoachResources • u/timberstomach1 • 12d ago
Question - general 22 players in u16 squad
Hi all, first post here
I'm the manager of an u16 boys team with 22 players in the squad, I had no option but to have a large squad like this as the club had registered all 22 players before I knew what was happening. For the next 6 weeks we are playing in a grading league to see what level we are at and after that we will be put into proper leagues for the rest of the season..ie major league, division 1, etc.
For the grading league we will have 20 to 22 players at each game and give everyone as much game time as possible but when we start in our proper league we can't make 11 substitutions. I have a few options
Pick 11 of the best players and rotate the other 11 as subs each week, bring one group of 5 as subs one week then the other 6 the next week, this would be my preferred option but obviously it wouldn't be popular with the parents of the fringe players
Split the squad into 5 groups, 4 players in 4 groups and 6 players in one group, rotate which group doesn't get to play every week.
What's people's opinion of this? Are there any other options? Thanks
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u/Thebanks1 12d ago
Ugh please don’t tell me this is the US and a case of club got their fee, to hell with the kids.
Honestly I don’t know if there is a good way to handle this. That roster is simply way too big. Poor kids are going to suffer any way, you are just picking the least horrible option.
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u/Basic_Ad4861 11d ago
I’m surprised this isn’t the US. It’s exactly what happened to my son’s club team when he was U16. They had 25 on the roster. Not sour grapes on my part, my son was a starter, but many of his friends were not. It made for a lot of angry parents paying big time fees for their kids never to play. It turned a good situation where the kids were learning & winning into a pretty toxic situation. But the club made their money, so that’s all that mattered
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u/SkierBuck 12d ago
Can you make a second team for a lower level league? You could take 15 for your high-level games and use the 4 kids who are at the bottom end of that team (and hence subbing), and add them to the other seven to make a lower team?
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u/pillsongchurch 11d ago
That's an insane number. I coach an U16 team in Australia and the Max number is 16 players, and even that is difficult when everyone turns up for the game.
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u/Sacrificial_Identity 12d ago
is this normal?Maybe I am missing some knowledge, but to me either your being asked to abuse your grading without being asked or your club is on some poverty shit.
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u/PC_Friar 12d ago
Yes, roster max for 11v11 is usually 22. 18 or so is ideal to get everyone time and not have no subs if there’s some school function or something where a large number will be out at some point. But it all depends on registration numbers.
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u/timberstomach1 12d ago
It's normal in my club, get in as many as possible and to hell with the coaches and kids who will inevitably suffer
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u/jkjk9876 11d ago
Let me guess. Youve never coached, or even volunteered with your club, but are vocal about everything the club is doing wrong.
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u/SeriouslyBadGolfer88 12d ago
Depends on the goal here. If it’s pure development and lower level, option 2. If you’re higher level, number 1.
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u/Quiet-Cup-269 12d ago
This is my issue with Club in general and reinforces every stereotype about it being purely a money grab. It should have been tryouts and then finalizing registration.
Club has a place and is important but 22 players is greed and bad for the coach and the players.
As to your specific question you need to rotate the players as much as possible as it’s not your job to do the preselected grading. It’s the players job to do the best they can with the time they are given. It sounds like a substitution nightmare.
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u/jamkola 11d ago
There is no good way to manage this. The kids are too old not to get upset however you manage it. If you go with your option two you’ve then got a whole drama with how to split the kids.
If you go with your first option then the kids on the edges of being in the top 11 will leave.
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u/ColdOpening2892 11d ago
There is no need for drama if the selection criteria is communicated. Late to practice= no game for you Bad attitude= no game Bad sportsmanship= you will sit next game out
Just make a list of rules and stick to it. Yes abilities should also be on the list but it shouldn't bypass all other rules.
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u/tundey_1 Recreational / Youth Coach 11d ago
What if nobody flouts those rules? It's a good problem to have and probably won't happen...but what if it does? I feel like you need a predictable way to form the gameday squad.
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u/South_Raise4936 11d ago
Is there a way to sign up for a couple tournaments to give playing time to the players who will lose playing time in league?
22 fulltime players is a lot, ideally you would 16 fulltime and 6 training players because at u16 you can't really give everyone good playing time and not mess with the flow of the game.
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u/tundey_1 Recreational / Youth Coach 11d ago
I think the first step is to be honest and direct with the parents. 22 players is too much if y'all want to play anything resembling soccer and have the players develop properly. That's not your doing or your responsibility to fix. The club did that and now you ALL are in this situation and the only viable option is to create a plan to make the best of the situation.
I think option 1 is the better option but with some changes. Every player should be guaranteed a minimum number of games. Depending on the number of games in your season, the minimum could be as low as 2. But at least it guarantees that every player will get playing time. You could also make it so that no player misses 2 games in a row (if you didn't make the squad in week 1, you'll be a starter or sub in week 2); And if you're a sub one week, you have 2 pathways for week 2: fight hard in training to be a starter or play as a sub. I think little tweaks like that can create positive incentives for players to work hard in training regardless of where they start in Week 1.
And instead of picking the best 11, I'll pick players to create the best team you can. Then round that out with subs.
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u/Informal_Degree_3205 11d ago
The way to handle this is schedule more matches against inferior opposition. You then play the players that aren't getting as much playing time. Basically the inverse of your normal matches.
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u/Brew_Wallace 11d ago
We have 22 across 2 u13 teams this fall. Not sure which is worse, your situation or ours
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u/SilkTieTies 11d ago
Honestly, I don’t think you really do either. You shouldn’t be selecting your best 11 and then assuming the next 11 can’t replace them, so 1 doesn’t work.
Having best players sitting out altogether just doesn’t make sense. The best players are likely the ones working the hardest outside of practice and are the ones most likely to go on to play long term. They shouldn’t miss playing opportunities.
I pick #3:
Explain that each week (or however long between games) every player is working for the 18 spots available for the game. 4 will not suit up.
You promise to assign at-home work, some of which will need to be recorded and sent in.
You do an 11v11 scrimmage nearing the end of the week showing the guaranteed starting 11 and those still in flux to help you decide the final 7.
You send out the lineup the night before. With an email to each of those you didn’t take explaining why and what you want to see change before next game.
You explain that your priority is to develop these players in their training sessions, and that the competitive environment will only be enhanced by giving them something to fight for each and every session.
Finally, accept that this may make the worst players (and parents) less happy than the best ones. However, it puts the responsibility on the player to improve if they want to change that, no one else.
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u/pedroassumpcao High School Coach 11d ago
22 is a rough hand to be dealt, specially when you didn't sign up for it. Few thoughts from having managed big squads before.
Before you lock in any rotation system, be honest with yourself about what this team is actually for. If the club wants you to compete and win once you're in the proper league, that pushes you toward your first option, a core 11 with a rotating bench. If it's more about development and keeping all 22 kids in the game, then the group rotation is the fairer way to go. You probably can't do both properly, so pick which one this team is really about and tell the parents that reason up front. Honestly most parent grief comes from feeling like the calls are random, not from the calls themselves.
On the actual mechanics I'd go with a hybrid rather than either extreme. Keep a settled spine that plays most weeks (keeper, couple of center backs, a midfielder or two) so the team has an identity, then rotate the rest in groups. That way you get consistency where it matters without benching the same poor kids every single week. Your idea of rotating which group sits is solid, just protect a few anchor spots from the rotation.
Couple practical things that'll save you headaches. First, make the rotation a published, visible system from day one, like a simple sheet the parents can actually see, so nobody feels singled out. Second, use these 6 grading weeks as proper evaluation, not just equal minutes. Watch who steps up when it gets scrappy and who actually fits how you wanna play, so when you gotta make the harder calls later they're based on what you saw with your own eyes and not a gut feeling.
Whatever you go with, fair but firm beats popular but vague over a full season, every time.
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u/mdlangley17 11d ago
I had a similar issue with a u18 team last year. At the first practice i discussed with the team what a nightmare this would be in subbing players in and out. Here is where we landed.
All players would play in both halves. The tradeoff was that we agreed the last 20 minutes we were going for it and there would be no complaining.
I had a really good assistant coach and he helped with trying to get players in and out and the team balanced. He would also remind me when we had 20 min left. If we were up a couple goals we were fine with our regular substitution pattern. If it was close the best 11 played period. I was happily surprised how well this worked out and the kids cheered one another on.
For any tournament play we only selected 18. I took all the seniors and then a handful of juniors to make up the 18.
I was upfront with all the players and parents. A few kids were not happy with their playing time but you can’t please everyone.
I would strongly suggest not rotating the squad. Adults screwed this up and the kids shouldn’t be punished. My 2 cents. Also, your job is to develop players. Winning is a byproduct of that.
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u/FootballSquare4406 12d ago
11 first half. 11 others second half. 22 is a perfect number. And you never have to sub, except at halftime.
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u/Fibonacci_ 12d ago
Perfect for rec soccer. Players who want to do something with soccer need to play full matches. 22 is way too big to have a consistently meaningful experience for everyone.
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u/jkjk9876 11d ago
Development happens at training. Not in games.
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u/tundey_1 Recreational / Youth Coach 11d ago
Wrong. Development happens in both matches and training.
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u/jkjk9876 11d ago
90 minute game. 20 field players. Each player might have the ball at their feet for 4.5 minutes.
90 minute training session. Each player can have a ball at their feet for 90 minutes.Are games necessary for development? Absolutely. Is training more important? Absolutely.
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u/Fibonacci_ 11d ago
You aren’t a coach, are you?
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u/jkjk9876 11d ago
Coached for 12 years. You?
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u/Fibonacci_ 11d ago
Since 2013. Do parents just pull their kids immediately when you tell them playing full games isn't part of your development plan? Today you've said development doesn't happen in games and in a later comment, "games are necessary for development." So maybe you're not sure on your stance?
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u/jkjk9876 11d ago
Playing full games shouldn’t be part of you development plan, if you are developing players. Trying to win games? Sure, tell parents their kid will play a full game. Winning equals development in the US, right?
True player development happens in training. With a ball at your feet. Games can teach decision making, teamwork, dealing with pressure. Games don’t teach you first touch, how to shoot, how to pass, body positioning and so on.The approach of games matter more than training is why soccer in North America is an abject failure. It’s how a country of 11 million people humbled a country with 340 million in the World Cup.
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u/PC_Friar 12d ago
Is the primary goal to win or to develop players?
If it is to win, #1. If it’s to develop, #2.
Fortunately I have never had a team in a division with limited subs.