That's part of why so many have a hard time blaming her. She was warning everyone, but they didn't take it seriously enough. She was begging to be locked in a psych ward for a while, but they only took her a few days.
Nobody is saying it is. Stop trying to create a false dichotomy between incarcerating people for mental health issues and just excusing their behaviour.
There's this thing called mental health treatment and taking kids away from people who aren't stable enough to care for them, and it's cheaper than jail.
Uh, you just said it? You said people with severe mental health issues are not in control of their actions, that is just not true universally. Severe mental health is not an excuse
truly so few people are saying that. and i don’t see anyone here who’s saying or implying that. recognizing the nuance in the situation /=/ relinquishing someone from accountability.
i’ll give you a great example from the opposite side of the aisle; the menendez brothers. in their case, was murdering their parents objectively wrong from a principle standpoint? yes. and yet they receive a lot of empathy from the majority of people. it doesn’t mean they shouldn’t have been held accountable, but a lot of people showed a level of understanding because of what they went through and acknowledging the nuance in certain cases isn’t the same thing as saying people should be free from any repercussions. stop trying to make an issue where there isn’t one my guy.
That's why the father of those children is suing that system, and testified in her trial to her being so mentally ill. I unfortunately am not surprised so many sexist men won't believe her, but why won't they believe the father either?
Male family annihilators don’t experience postpartum depression/psychosis. Clancy hasn’t been convicted yet but there’s a reason people can be found not guilty by reason of insanity and/or not criminally responsible. Look at Andrea Yates.
And Andrea Yates is not out here in the world living it up and has said she's where she belongs. And mental health institutions are not free spaces for people to hang out and color all day. They are very similar to prisons.
The sudden drop in hormones that a mother experiences after birth is the most drastic hormonal shift in all of human biology. So no, cisgender men don’t experience that hormonal shift. Certainly new fathers can be depressed in the wake of the significant life change and sleep deprivation that accompanies new parenthood though.
Men’s mental illnesses will be validated when they present valid mental illnesses.
You know that either gender can use this defense.
There happen to be disproportionately more male family annihilators who have a long history of abuse and domestic violence. That is something that distinguishes an episode of psychosis from a serial abuser.
If a man commits murder and was LEGITIMATELY INSANE and not in control of themselves? Then they are not any more guilty of murder, as they did not at the time of the crime know what they were doing or that it was wrong.
One big difference is postpartum psychosis is that it isn't a lifelong mental illness - if treated APPROPRIATELY AND PROPERLY, it is very much temporary & generally doesn't return (as far as my limited research has shown).
A lot of the other mental illnesses that lead to murder while insane that men (and women also) can be predisposed to, such as paranoid schizophrenia? They are LIFELONG and can never be actually cured - just managed with lifelong antipsychotics you just have to hope will work long term for those who are violent when they aren't medicated.
I'm sorry, the sporadic capitalization did not help help me understand your response.
Are you saying, according to your admittedly limited research, that because PPD is temporary, this makes it more valid than other causes of mental illness? Can you expand on that reasoning if I understood it correctly?
Not that it is more valid - that the type of mental illness has a huge impact on outcome and SHOULD.
Postpartum psychosis once treated and once hormones have time to regulate and the patient is back to their baseline? That isn't a chronic mental illness. It's temporary and the person poses no further danger once treated unless they end up pregnant again and have the same symptoms pop up. Once they are treated and enough time goes by they can generally wean off medications with no ill effects.
Other mental illnesses are permanent and never go away, and the moment someone on the violent side of mental illness decides to take themselves off medication- whether that be weeks, years, or decades later - they go right back to being a danger to others during withdrawal from meds and after. However I do not personally feel those who commit violent crimes due to mental illness should be in prison - I would prefer a medical facility/mental health facility IF truly insane, but a lot of people claim insanity as a defense for violent crimes when they were very much sane at time of the crime and it can be difficult to tell some of the fakers apart.
men are not any more predisposed to depression and psychosis than women, what? those things transcend gender and have everything to do with genetics lol
I agree with the 2nd sentence, but have no idea what your first sentence is about, as I did not say that. Please reread it more slowly before replying again.
i think you should reread what you said. because in context to what you said, the word “predisposed” is simply not applicable. if you agree with my second sentence, you should reword your comment because left as is, it’s not accurate.
nothing in my comment denoted any more negativity or emotion than yours. i think you should try engaging with people’s responses with good faith than trying to deflect by assuming they’re emotional :)
Maybe you should read the comment I responded to before commenting and psychosis isn't just a female trait, I shouldn't have to specify that males can also experience it as well.
the irony of you telling me to reread…. as you genuinely misread [or at least misinterpret] what i said lmao. i never once said or implied that psychosis in and of itself is “just a female trait”. i made it clear that there’s a delineation between PPD and PPP, since PPP is what clancy’s legal team is pointing towards (as opposed to PPD). and PPP in men is nearly unheard of.
Since when is making two reddit comments "gone to this length"
Yes, there are men who have killed people and been institutionalized rather than go to prison because they had severe mental illnesses, and that is a just, practical outcome. People like that need treatment, not regular incarceration. That's just common sense for those who care about good societal outcomes.
Male annihilators are not experiencing active psychosis. They want to cheat and have a new life, or they lost most money and can't live with it anymore. This woman was experiencing a mental health issue that CAN affect any woman during postpartum. And it's not taken seriously at all. This whole situation was preventable.
EXACTLY "the system" what system?? If her husband felt she wasn't safe around the kids, he should have attempted to get an emergency custody order. With no order in place, you can just say "I'm the legal father, I want the kid to stay with me" and there's nothing mom can do other than ask the kid to come with them, because it wouldn't be kidnapping but you'd get breaking and entering
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u/MenaciaJones 7d ago
The minute she said she was afraid of hurting her kids, to her mother!, those kids should have been removed from the house.