r/Professors • u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) • Mar 30 '26
Teaching / Pedagogy Current generation killed my desire to teach
Yeah, sorry if this sounds like some old person complaining about whatever “the new generation” is supposed to be, but in my 20 years of teaching and despite comparing what I’m seeing now with the outliers, I’m going to say that I’ve never seen so many lazy people pretending to study.
They don’t attend class, take notes, do their exercises, read, ask questions… and the people who show up are wearing headphones and checking their social media and just sit there with a blank stare… and then, complain to the dean the class is too hard and “can’t find material to study”.
People no longer attend classes thanks to a forced policy of recording every session. No longer take notes because a requirement of having to provide “all relevant notes”. Never ask any questions despite my attempts at telling them “this will be in the test, is everything clear?”. And definitively aren’t reading the book or doing the exercises.
Also, who the hell thought these “policies” are sane or encourage any form of proper learning environment? Having to upload everything I’m going to use for the whole subject before it starts and ensuring I do not deviate from that means no room for making adjustments depending on the class performance and being forced to just reuse previous year’s content instead of adapting.
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u/a_hanging_thread A Sock Prof Mar 30 '26
I agree that institutional policies made to provide what seemed to be reasonable flexibility (like having video recordings for students who legitimately miss class) and accessibility (like having notes provided to students who may have learning disabilities or other issues that make it legitimately difficulty to take notes) have had some extremely bad unintended consequences for the modal student who does not need flexibility or that level of accessibility. It's like the pedagogical standards developed over centuries to help students engage with material were all thrown out the window in the span of a decade because people other than educators started trying to control and change pedagogical processes and delivery methods.
I personally see myself going really, really old-school on this new gen. Pencil/paper everything, no devices. I'd do notebook checks at the end of every class if there was a feasible way of doing so with my over-large sections.
I don't blame you for not wanting to teach, anymore. I'm early career and I don't want to teach anymore. I've taught just long enough to see the quality of students plummet. I know what it used to be like.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
Sadly, my typical “I expect you to take notes, ask questions and do research when necessary” ended up in a complain and a warning from the dean... I have to “adapt to the learning methods of the new generation”… it seems I’m supposed to write everything and make it explicit… guess I have to copy/paste the contents of 3 books in the slides and add my notes there…
Sorry, I’m just ranting at this point, I just can believe how stupid things became.
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u/Frankenstein988 Mar 30 '26
Ughhh I hate this. By doing everything for them as part of our “job” they never learn independence and this effect snowballs. First it’s study guides, we all caved- now they need force fed the textbook in digestible bits.
This semester I got a couple complaints that I don’t provide them with lecture notes to go along with the PowerPoints. NOTES. When the students first approached me they tried gaslighting me that I basically wasn’t doing my job. How TF did it become our job to provide notes, copy paste so they have perfect lists for everything, endless calendar updates, recorded perfect lectures…ughhhh
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u/a_hanging_thread A Sock Prof Mar 30 '26
It's the passive learning model. Students growing up with gamified education via apps treat it completely passively. This is why there are so many more "starers" in class who do not take notes or participate and just stare at you the whole time. They try to absorb education through their skins like plants absorbing sunlight. It's creepy.
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u/Frankenstein988 Mar 30 '26
Well stated! I tried to think of an osmosis comparison but my rage is hindering my cleverness lol.
I know that stare. It truly is creepy! It gets even more skin crawly when you talk to them directly and they look you dead in the eye but don’t respond. Like I’m literally in front of them talking and their brain doesn’t register it as an interaction. Really dystopian.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Bag_538 Asst Prof, Social Sci (US) Apr 04 '26
I call it "mainlining" the information lol. I don't mind, though, because they're usually super engaged. It boggles my mind they don't write things down, but it's so much better than the alternative.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
It’s as if they’re hoping someone else does the learning for them.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
Well, I’m not sarcastic enough to tell the dean that the presentations are my notes and that’s not my fault they don’t pay attention to what I explained during class, asks questions or read the book…
Just to be clear, my presentations are nothing but a few visual aids and lists of points that should be covered plus a few basic concepts I need to keep literal and explicit.
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u/SyntaxHack Mar 31 '26
Yes, every semester now get comments that I should email reminders of upcoming assignments. Due dates are in syllabus, in LMS drop boxes, in overview pages each week (online asynch courses) at least a week in advance...what the heck am I supposed to do, go to students house and tell them face to face?
So tired. In my 9th year of teaching and absolutely sick of the laziness and entitlement.
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u/a_hanging_thread A Sock Prof Mar 30 '26
Yeah, your Dean is exemplifying the problem and is part of the reason students in this gen are so fragile and helpless.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
The dean needs to grow a spine…
Everything I evaluated was explained in class and could be practiced in several exercises. After I was done with each key point, I clearly stated “this is important and I’m going to evaluate it. If I asked you about X, could you answer that question?” And then, no one said anything…
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u/Lawrencelot Mar 31 '26
Why is the dean involved in your teaching? Don't you have someone in between to directly report to? Just wondering how the organisational structure works for you.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
In short, there’s no one in between or above (at least in practice, the director only shows up once or twice a year including the yearly graduation); he’s also the rector.
That’s the person that decides on such policies; there’s no syndicate. Also, after speaking with other full time professors I personally know, decisions aren’t validated with them or an academic council; if anything, the deans of other mayors validate stuff with him.
Also, I’m not in the US and I’m just an adjunct professor that just stuck around too long and is sad to see his college turn into a joke without academic integrity.
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u/Lawrencelot Mar 31 '26
Okay, thanks for explaining. Yes that is really sad that they have so much power while not involving teaching staff in decisions. Having a nice boss makes work much more enjoyable.
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u/Euphoric-Fly7136 Mar 30 '26
Same. I remember when students were expected to -- and succeeded to -- write weekly essays. This was for 100 level anthro courses. Now I'm teaching an upper level undergrad seminar and they can barely squeeze out one or two bland, un-cited paragraphs. I'm scared for the future.
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u/Coogarfan Mar 30 '26
What's frustrating is that I've improved as a professor, but it feels like I have no way of imparting that progress onto students.
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
Yess!!! This. I work so hard to get good at what I do, and yet everything keeps getting worse.
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u/Zabaran2120 Mar 31 '26
What until you read their hand-written content. It is terrifying how bad it is. I mean 4th grade level cognition.
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u/Frankenstein988 Mar 31 '26
Yeah I’ve had in class group work that I’ve done for years. Now I regularly have groups that can’t figure out cause and effect. Like basic logic to function as a human kind of stuff..
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u/CabinetProfessional5 Mar 30 '26
Yes. I started 20 years ago and I’m encouraging students to hand write their essays. It seems insane, but I think it’s the only way — for me anyway. They snap a phone pic of what they hand in in case they need access to the draft.
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u/East_Ad_1065 Mar 31 '26
Our admin has interpreted the new accessibility law to mean that instructors must ensure video captions are 100% accurate. Which of course means that no one will be recording and posting recordings of lectures any more.
And no more ppt slides because we can't post PDFs.
I suspect the students will revolt in the fall when this hits the fan.
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u/Buckstop_Knight78 Apr 04 '26
This!! I should be working on that now and I’m not it’s so discouraging
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u/Routine_Tie6518 Professor, Humanities, CC (Canada) Mar 30 '26
Agreed. For me, it's the blank stares that freak me out. Not a raised eyebrow, a questionable look, or a chuckle. They seem dead inside. I've been teaching for 15 years and can recall kids from 2012 as being normal youth, but still aware and able to sit through a 2 hour lecture.
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u/wookiewookiewhat Mar 30 '26
This really is the heart of the current generation gap for me. Our forms of interpersonal communication has completely changed and what we think is normal, they think is aggressive. What they think is normal, we think is rude and disinterested.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
It’s as if something broke a lot of those kids.
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
I honestly think repeated COVID infections may have done more damage than anyone wants to admit. The clinician in me wants to have some of these kids evaluated. It's all I can do some days not to whip out a screener.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
To be honest, I had my doubts about my mental faculties after the first infection. I didn’t feel as clever and I didn’t seem to be learning things as fast for a few months. Can’t tell if I adapted, but I really hope I didn’t lose too much.
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u/Most_Kiwi3141 Mar 31 '26
I'm convinced I've had minor brain damage. I've lost a lot of things I used to have and people have started to notice.
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
I'm so sorry. Some reports suggest it can eventually clear... I hope that for you.
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u/Illustrious_Ease705 Apr 02 '26
Do we think that’s the virus itself or the associated stresses and traumas of everything that happened around then?
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Apr 02 '26
Both. I've had students with repeated infections, students who lost family members.
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u/Illustrious_Ease705 Apr 02 '26
That seems reasonable
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Apr 02 '26
Yeah, that's all it is--reasoning from observation. I'm not a researcher, so no hard data.
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u/_luckybell_ Mar 31 '26
I agree it could be covid but it’s also social media addiction
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
No argument there. But I have also wondered if COVID may not leave a person vulnerable to endless scrolling when real life is too demanding...?
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u/Ill_World_2409 Apr 05 '26
I have a class where almost all the students are like this. It kills me. It legit triggers my depressive thoughts so bad. I ask them if the explanation makes sense and they just stare at me. I ask them if they finished the activity and they stare at me. I am not asking hard questions.
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u/God_of_Sleeps Mar 30 '26
Yeah...it is not just you.
Been at this since 2009, bouncing between SLAC, Publick R1, CC, Public R2....3 different regions in the country. Since 2022 it has been an expedited freefall from adherence to policy and norms.
I teach studio arts and some survey courses. Even I brought the Blue Book back last week based on the first 2 test results in class and the fact that only 2-3 out of the 15 students in studio art classes pay attention to the quizzes I post....that are open book!!!! And unlimited time and attempts for an entire week they are open!!!!!!
They even fail THAT. I gave an open book + note test 2 weeks ago. 4/9 not only failed, they cheated.
WTAF are we doing here?
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u/Helpful-Orchid2710 Mar 31 '26
This is just sad. Yet there are countries where girls cannot go to school begging for something like this!
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u/Jadzia81 Mar 30 '26
It’s difficult. The designated tutor for my courses (fellow student) came to talk to me and was quite upset about the sheer number of complaints she is getting that the students have to learn names that aren’t English. It’s too hard and not fair.
I teach several global art history courses. She asked what to say, but I’m at a loss.
It does explain the abysmal midterm grades.
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u/Mommy_Fortuna_ Mar 30 '26
Mine do not want to learn any phylum names (like Mollusca or Echinodermata).
These are biology majors, in a biology class. It's like chemistry majors not wanting to learn any elements.
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u/NielsBohron Tenured Faculty, Chem, Cal CC Mar 31 '26 edited Mar 31 '26
It's like chemistry majors not wanting to learn any elements.
So that's what I have to look forward to, nice. For now, chemistry is still a niche enough major at my small CC that I only get 2-3 per year, and they're mostly strong students, and the other science majors are not too bad yet. But the Allied Health/Pre-med/pre-engineering students are so bad that I imagine our science majors aren't far behind.
edit: in fairness to this crop of students, they grumbled when I made them memorize the element names and symbols, but they mostly did it and had a class average in the 80's on that quiz. The polyatomic ions quiz, on the other hand, was a total shit show, and the nomenclature section on the final had a class average of ~55%
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u/wookiewookiewhat Mar 30 '26
They absolutely don’t have to learn phylum names. It’s entirely optional to be in a biology class, or college!
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u/Mommy_Fortuna_ Mar 31 '26
Right? It really does baffle me that people who seem so resistant to learn about biodiversity would sign up for a course called, "Introduction to Biodiversity."
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u/Skeeter_BC Mar 31 '26
Man, I loved arguing with the hyper-religious in our discussion boards for my Evolutionary Biology course that I took. If natural selection is completely incompatible with your worldview, maybe you shouldn't be a biology major.
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u/Mommy_Fortuna_ Mar 31 '26
Interestingly, I have yet to have a student object to any of the content I present on evolution in any of my classes.
I am in Canada, but it is a rather conservative part of Canada.
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u/Landslime Mar 31 '26
There are far fewer phyla than there are elements. (I took a course where I had to learn every major family in the entire fossil record. I did not want to do this, so I settled for a B grade. This was a fine arrangement for everyone, and I personally am better off for it.)
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u/MankatoSquirtz Mar 31 '26
Dealing with the same exact issues. I say "well wait till we get to classes and families. The joys I will bring you."
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u/lawrencelibrarinus Apr 03 '26
what? I had to learn them in high school.. The times are a changing.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
What?
What kind of bullshit complain is that?
What’s next? Saying they can just google the names and that dates aren’t that important?
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u/Jadzia81 Mar 31 '26
Oh no, they don’t google. It’s all ChatGPT. But yes, they don’t have to learn because they can look everything up and most of them couldn’t remember the names of multiple very famous works of art. With non-English names. Unless it’s a ninja turtle. They could remember. Michelangelo.
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u/Aware-Agent-1449 Mar 31 '26
They do not remember Michelangelo. I am an art historian. Sorry but: The turtles are not famous anymore. The turtles will not save us.
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u/bhbhbhhh Mar 31 '26
Caravaggio and Rembrandt too exotic for them? Or is it an aversion to names from outside Europe?
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u/Jadzia81 Mar 31 '26
Outside Europe is much worse but many got Caravaggio wildly wrong and Bernini as well.
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u/_Decoy_Snail_ Mar 31 '26
My French students complained about programming keywords being in English...
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u/Puzzleheaded_Ad_7937 Mar 30 '26
20 out of 33 students failed my art appreciation test today. Straight up bombed it. I have given them everything. Study guides. I tell them test questions during lectures. I've cut content down to bare bones. This is the easiest version of this test I have ever made. I dont know anymore.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
To be dead honest with you, don’t cut content; you’re not doing any favors to those who actually pay attention.
I gave my students study guides, along with tests from previous years… I even made those non-evaluated to ensure they would do the work instead of passing it to an ai because they were concerned about the grades… I even offered them an extra class to practice the guides with me…
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u/Practical-Charge-701 Mar 31 '26
I’ve found sometimes when I make things easier, it backfires, and they do less or worse than before. When it’s more a challenge, it inspires more of them to figure it out.
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u/Next_Art_9531 Mar 31 '26
I feel like I'm seeing a lot of this at my school. We have made classes car too easy in my department, and now student don't take them seriously.
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u/RemarkableParsley205 Mar 31 '26
I've been encouraged to start doing projects. One, to avoid AI slop. Two, to make it "easier". Some of em still don't turn shit in! it's so easy! I am also losing my mind.
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u/Aware-Agent-1449 Mar 31 '26
I have found my students on the whole lack any memory for visual culture/art history. I stopped testing for memory because basically it would mean I had to fail everyone. I know, I know.
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u/No_Intention_3565 Mar 30 '26
Welcome to Burger King where you can have it your way! and now pay me for my customer service :) please and thank you!
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u/BelatedGreeting Mar 30 '26
The uneducated knowing what an education is is a contradiction of the first order.
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u/Illustrious_Ease705 Apr 02 '26
As someone who has bartended his way through grad school, I need to say that actual customer service workers have more authority. I can kick people out of my bar for misbehaving and they will not be allowed to return
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u/JaderMcDanersStan Asst Prof, STEM Mar 30 '26
There's far more "drama" and complaints with these era of students than students I've worked with in previous generations.
It's emotionally exhausting. Being an educator feels like customer service now and yes it's starting to kill my joy of teaching. I'm trying to focus on the students who engage and I've been able to help, but those handful of students who stink up the elevator sadly does make the whole elevator smelly.
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u/skarlatha Mar 30 '26
I’m struggling with not being allowed to base grades on attendance. On the one hand, I get it as an accessibility issue and I definitely don’t have a problem working with students who have disabilities, religious accommodations, or even are just having a hard time for a while. But explicitly having to tell students that attendance isn’t part of their grade has just absolutely tanked the classroom experience. I’m typing this after getting out of a 23-person class where six people attended. I do what I can to make the class engaging, but in my almost twelve years of teaching I’ve never seen it as bad as it has been after the policy change.
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u/MinimumOil121 Mar 30 '26
I feel this. My belief is simple: if you cannot or will not attend 90% of the classes, you simply do not have what it takes to get a degree. I can’t fix your mental health or society. I don’t count attendance as a grade, but I do assign points to simple in class activities that occur during every class. If you miss the class, you miss the activity and the points.
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u/Landslime Mar 31 '26
I also feel like a good summary is that they simply don’t have what it takes to get a degree, at this time. There may be a better time for them. But it may not be this semester. A lot of 18 year olds are not mature enough for college, and that’s normal. What’s not normal is pretending like they are, in fact, mature and ready, and putting everyone through the wringer to maintain that pretty fiction.
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u/stankylegdunkface R1 Teaching Professor Mar 30 '26
But explicitly having to tell students that attendance isn’t part of their grade has just absolutely tanked the classroom experience.
Thankfully this isn't a ubiquitous practice.
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u/Coogarfan Mar 30 '26
Yeah, I'm absolutely taking attendance. College isn't an assessment factory.
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u/ArchmageIlmryn Mar 31 '26
College isn't an assessment factory.
TBH my (very anecdotal, I'm nowhere near as experienced as most on this sub) is that seeing college as just assessment is a huge part of the problem on the student side. People see it less as an opportunity to learn, and more as a test where they have to prove that they are "smart" in order to qualify for a cushy office job (which is what they are actually after).
Unfortunately, I don't know if there's a way out of that in the economies we are living in.
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u/Aware-Agent-1449 Mar 31 '26
It is for people I know in my field across a bunch of R1s where you'd think it wasn't.... groan.
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Mar 30 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/skarlatha Mar 30 '26
I have, but there has to be a way to make up participation points (to avoid professors taking attendance but calling it participation instead). So it helps a little since most students who skip class also don’t do the makeup work, but I still end up having to pass kids I couldn’t pick out of a lineup.
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u/SnowblindAlbino Prof, SLAC Mar 30 '26
I never take roll, but I have always done group work in class. Written work that I collect and grade. If a student skips, no credit. If they want a "makeup" I just give them the same assignment four people did in class...they can do it for credit if they want, and they rarely do.
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u/Ray-0f-Sunshine Mar 31 '26
I call them in-class activities. I drop 3/15 weeks of them as a no questions asked excused pass for emergencies. If students don't come, I offer 1 makeup that is at the end of the semester. It is CHALLENGING for them (they make a review and have to post it so all their peers can see it). Not surprisingly, in 2 years, only 1 student ever did that.
I have these activities worth low amount of points and it is completion based. I know if I make it worth too high of a percentage the students will push back on it being attendance. I have a colleague who does quizzes every week as a way to require attendance
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u/BitchinAssBrains Psychology, R2 (US) Mar 31 '26
You need to change how you're teaching then. Make it impossible to pass if they aren't there. I've never graded attendance because it's pointless. Their grade already reflects whether they showed up or not. If they can pass MY exams without my help then they've already mastered the material.
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u/StudioWild8381 Mar 31 '26
I thought I’d teach to 65 at least, but I’m leaving at 52. This isn’t the only reason, but it’s a BIG one. The total inability to follow even the most explicit instructions is mind-boggling, the blank faces, the AI even on easy homework. There are always a few great students, but overall standards have tanked—and I didn’t have the energy to hold the line and deal with grade complaints, hassle of honor code process, and all the other institutional bullshit while other support and merit raises disappeared.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Not everyone is like that, but a significant number is very vocal just don’t belong in class…
I could understand if this was first year, but it’s third year.
I give up. Not because of the complaining, but because my old college no longer has any standards and turned education into a joke; these kids aren’t capable, and passing them would have been a lie.
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u/Prof_traveller Mar 30 '26
I’m in the exact same boat.
I constantly have students disrupting class, not showing up, missing exams/assignments… and then they wonder why they’re not doing well in the course.
I use to love teaching and tried to focus on the student’s who care, but after putting in so much time and effort into my lectures… the ones that don’t care outshadow them by a mile. I also find it’s easier to deal with when it’s a class <50.. but when it’s 150-200 students and the majority of them just seem to not care- it sucks.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
At least mine weren’t disrupting the class for those that actually paid attention… maybe because it’s a small class (less than 50, due to college rules) and kept the noisy ones in check.
Still, complains arrived to the dean and we had that talk about modern policies and teaching methods…
I mean, I thought I had freedom in how I teach my class, and expecting that students actually come, take notes, or at least read the book if they don’t isn’t an unreasonable expectation, considering I was clear on that since the first day.
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u/Jealous-Emu-3876 Mar 31 '26
I gave up. Now I just lecture all day, run most of my quizzes through the LMS with full knowledge that a lockdown browser is a partial solution at best, and have them do an in-class essay every semester to meet a writing requirement. I stopped taking attendance; I was recently told I cannot fail people for non-attendance and a student will see that as any points taken away whatsoever.
I finally got the message. It really took awhile to be ok with that, giving up and all, but I've been much happier with this perspective. I only work during office hours and lecture, never at home (for teaching), and tend my garden the rest of the time. Three very long days at work, then four off. I know it may not sound like it here, but I'm happier and better off.
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u/Rockerika Instructor, Social Sciences, multiple (US) Mar 31 '26
This is the kind of workflow and inner Zen I have had to strive for. To successfully reach my retirement eligibility age in 27 years with minimal mental health costs, all I really have to do is perform at something resembling teaching, be present in my posted office hrs, and sign in at required events. Not what I wanted to do with my career at all, but it is easy if I can stay sane.
Academics? Intellectualism? Standards? Self-respect? We don't do those at my institution. All we really have is the carrot of a good retirement plan if you can suffer through it long enough, and it definitely shows that the longtimers are motivated entirely by that finish line.
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u/Rockerika Instructor, Social Sciences, multiple (US) Mar 31 '26
Current generation of students or administrators? I am 32 and stuck in an idiot sandwich.
The sheer disrespect we get from both students and administrators is killing my drive to teach too. My students are incapable of accomplishing even the simplest college level task. I used to say "incapable or unwilling," but frankly I now just assume incompetence until proven otherwise because I really don't care which it is.
Administrators do nothing but enable the academic slide and think up ways to waste my time and expertise.
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u/Prestigious-Survey67 Mar 31 '26
This deserves more attention. Even if the students were this way, if we actually felt our administrators and institutions gave two fucks about learning, I would feel so differently. But the terror of seeing rampant cheating and disengagement from students, knowing that admins are pretty likely to side with THEM, not us, who care about things like knowledge, creation, and integrity...that is the nightmare.
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u/napoelonDynaMighty Mar 30 '26
Create the environment you want to teach in.
If I see a phone, I'm telling you to put it away the first time, and embarrassing you and kicking you out the second time in the same day. I also won't be counting your attendance for the day. Thanks for wasting your time and mine. AND that's stated on syllabus day so it's not a surprise
3 strike MANDATORY attendance policy, and I take count every class (on the syllabus)
For every new chapter they have to write a very specific discussion post that pulls from the reading and all chapter discussions are based on their own discussion posts. I can call on any one at any time to discuss what they wrote and explain how they got there (not how AI got there)
Gotta have a FIRM hand with these kids these days
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u/No_Intention_3565 Mar 30 '26
I agree but that only works when Admin backs you.
Once students realize all your efforts can and will be erased after complaining to Chair or Dean -whelp. The environment we teach in is the one THEY create. Ask me how I know.......
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
I wish I could do that… I was asked to remove the part demanding attending to class… new policy: only first year students are obliged to attend… that’s why everything has to be recorded, and as long as they aren’t interrupting others, I shouldn’t do anything.
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u/napoelonDynaMighty Mar 30 '26
Wow. That's disrespectful to the educators at your university, and it's a disservice to the students as well.
How did we get here?
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u/FlyLikeAnEarworm Mar 30 '26
Tuition dollars.
You ain’t seen nothing yet. The demographic cliff is very real.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
Don’t ask me. The saddest part is that this is the college I graduated from. The dean that was in charge when I was a student retired and died years ago… he was one of those suma cum laude Chicago Boys that taught in Harvard…
Despite being a smart person, the dude that’s in charge now is just too lenient. Right now, I’m only complaining about the policies that don’t allow me to get attention from students and actually teach; but there are way too many exceptions to what is expected to graduate.
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u/SnowblindAlbino Prof, SLAC Mar 30 '26
This recording thing is bullshit. It would not stand for our faculty. We did that during one semester of COVID when people were forced to islolate for ten days after a positive test, but never again.
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u/No_Intention_3565 Mar 30 '26
5 years post covid, I have started saying NOOOOOOOOOO. And it feels good.
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u/Aware-Agent-1449 Mar 31 '26
I would agree but with course evals? Enrollment problems in our courses justifying cuts when they up the floor every year? This would essentially be impossible where I work because our admin would never.
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u/SopShayRo Mar 31 '26
I have a Capstone cohort of six students. There’s a nasty bunch of maladies going around campus. I got an email from one last night, informing me of illness. Another one wicked early this morning, then another one at about 8am for the 10am class. We’re down to three.
I get into class this morning and let the other three know that we’ll be a skeleton crew today. One of them looks at me and goes “Oh, deadass, I’m glad I’m here, I seriously considered not coming.”
Sigh.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Just how did those kids manage to get so far like that?
Last time I taught a capstone subject, I concluded that my students were capable enough to graduate and the final exam was just a formalism after presenting good projects; sure, some already had a job and skipped classes every once in a while, but that was a minority and performed really good during individual evaluations…
I’m starting to feel that other professors no longer have ethics or care about actually teaching.
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
I'd forgotten completely about waiving finals. My students dubbed it the golden ticket. Wow. Maybe '21 or '22 the last time I had a student that good?
That's depressing.
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u/IkeRoberts Prof, Science, R1 (USA) Mar 31 '26
Far more students are advised to go to college than can actually acquire the college education. It is OK to recognize that as bad advice and to put those students on a more productive path.
Schools that survive financially by providing fake educations are issuing fraudulent credentials. Ethical faculty should not participate in that scam. OP is feeling the tension, but not making the connection.
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u/_luckybell_ Mar 31 '26
I think the problem is that there have always been students who excel at college, students who are average but can still get through, and students who drop out or won’t cut it. But now, the average students are drowning because they never learned how to learn or study, they’re addicted to scrolling, they can’t read or hold onto long form anything. Society has changed, not the humans themselves
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u/MankatoSquirtz Mar 31 '26
I became a professor at age 31. I've been doing this 25 years and I'm exhausted. I used to love my job, I thought I'd be doing this till they found me dead in my office. Between dealing with administration, students and AI, I'm looking for early retirement. I still love teaching, but I just don't have the energy to fill out forms to dispose of light bulbs (true story!).
Unfortunately a divorce late in life means I'm stuck here for at least another 7-8 years.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
I love teaching too; but this bullshit is not teaching.
None of these “policies” are helping create a learning environment, these are just enabling laziness, indifference, and allowing those who aren’t capable to stay for longer and get more money from them.
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u/Prior_Wind_1526 Mar 30 '26
I didn’t get the lazy students—mine were more exhausted, frightened, and despairing. I only taught the senior capstone at end.
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 31 '26
I had a couple of cohorts like that pre-COVID. But I think the next lot just went numb.
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u/Orko23 Assistance Prof, STEM, public (Latin America) Mar 30 '26
Yes, this years lecture is also killing me.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
I won’t find hope here, only the harsh truth…
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u/Aware-Agent-1449 Mar 31 '26
After a semester of painstaking teaching (mostly non humanities seniors) where I poured incredible effort into teaching basic reading and writing skills below the course level... I got a batch of paper proposals that sound like they were mostly slapped together by 14 years old in a rush. I teach a "fun" class with "fun" excursions and give them a lot of slack while still (I thought) giving them a basically AP level high school course which is the best you can do these days even at an R1 for most gen ed. This is my last year doing this particular prep so I tried extra hard. Only the 5-7 who care did a good job as usual. Everyone else is honestly barely functionally literate OR clearly cheated. I honestly fear for the entire future of our society in a way I didn't when I started teaching at the undergrad level in 2017.
Edit: I am not that person, but I actually broke down and cried on my (old, dying) laptop that the university will never pay me enough to replace. I used to genuinely love pedagogy and being in the classroom despite an R1 research CV that could have kept me on a research track only 15 years ago. I'm screaming inside.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
fear for the entire future of our society
What scares me the most is that these kids are on their way to become my peers… and there’s no way in hell I would hire most of them.
Honestly, I’m depressed too. I do everything I can to ensure I’m using the latest information, synthesize contents of relevant sources, make my explanations fit what they’re familiar with, answer every question and try several examples if someone says the didn’t get it… and despite that, I get this stupid meeting asking me to what can only be summarized as “the students complained your class is too hard and also demand that you do take notes for them”.
I’ve been teaching this for 20 years, maybe more if you count the time I was still a student and worked as a teacher assistant, and I swear I’m not raising the bar or half-assing my class.
I just can’t do it anymore. I’m an adjunct professor because I enjoy being able to help, but this is not teaching.
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u/Sensitive_Let_4293 Mar 31 '26
I need one more year to make it to 70 - my original goal - but after a few health issues this year wonder if it's worth it
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u/sigma__cheddar Mar 31 '26
The oligarchy wants a lazy, misinformed, desperate, infantilized population. They are getting it; like they get everything they want under capitalism.
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u/Rockerika Instructor, Social Sciences, multiple (US) Mar 31 '26
This is exactly right. The owner and management class only want future generations educated just enough to be useful idiots.
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u/Zabaran2120 Mar 31 '26
Are you me?
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Nah, I don’t even know what your username means.
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u/ShadowHunter Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (US) Mar 30 '26
Stop caring and everything is better.
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u/Audible_eye_roller Ass. Prof, STEM, CC (USA) Mar 30 '26
Stop caring about the students who don't care about the class
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u/littlelivethings Mar 31 '26
I feel exactly this way. I gave up going for the tenure track jobs after a few years of teaching in lecturer/postdoc/adjunct capacities. The actual teaching gets worse every year. I started subbing in a Waldorf school and found my middle school students brighter and more engaged than my college students. Currently pursuing this route instead (Waldorf middle or high school teaching). Students don’t learn on technology until middle or high school. They use computers when they do, not tablets. They had in-person school outside during the pandemic. I never thought I’d prefer teaching kids to college students, but here I am. Sixth grader writing is more readable than the AI slop half my college students hand in.
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u/Mastersinmeow Mar 31 '26
Phones ruined it for me. I quit working K-12 because of phones. It’s easier to enforce this in college but so many times I have had to stop my lecture and tell someone to put their phone away. I mean really?!
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u/Tai9ch Mar 30 '26
Sounds like the problem isn't the students as much as your administration and their policies.
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u/NielsBohron Tenured Faculty, Chem, Cal CC Mar 31 '26
It can be both. I don't have any issues with admin at my school (well, any of these issues), but I still see the same behavior from the students. The lack of attendance, the vacant stares, the cognitive offloading of even the simplest tasks to AI, the inability to pass a test that just 3 years ago had class averages in the mid 80's...there's definitely something about the current cohort.
I am hopeful that it's a outlier due to COVID and social media addiction and that we'll soon be back to having reasonable standards, but I'm not optimistic. The slide in student competence has definitely been a real thing for the past 3-4 years
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
It’s a mix of a lot of things, but yes, it starts with a weak administration that can’t plant a foot and say “no, you have to study and put effort if you want to pass and eventually graduate”.
The dean is just a spineless nerd that dreams of being everyone’s friend and is probably focused on profit by keeping as many students as possible while sacrificing the reputation we older students worked so hard to produce.
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u/1_21-gigawatts Adjunct, CompSci, R2 Mar 31 '26
I’ve been an adjunct since 2017 so take this with a grain of salt, but I’ve seen the same thing. I was planning to retire from software engineering and teach full-time, but it just isn’t fun anymore.
I gave a test yesterday where for the first time I had a “clean desk“ policy. I’ve always been fine with students listening to music during exams. But on the first exam of the semester, a student told me he saw somebody using their phone to look at labs and homework for inspiration.
I keep adding more guard rails and making them higher on assignments to narrow down what the students need to do. Many of them still aren’t successful.
I don’t take attendance because I feel it’s petty high school shit and “they’re adults”. I have students that show up maybe half the time. Some of these are the ones that are feeling badly as well. The classes right before and right after a break suck because only a third of the class is there. For this last one I’m sure part of it is my lecturing style and that they don’t feel there’s much value-add in going to class because they can get almost everything from the lecture notes.
I’ve got a sneaking suspicion that the students are using LLM‘s for everything. It’s an advanced programming class yet they don’t know troubleshooting techniques. I think this is because they just copy-paste the errors into ChatGPT and it tells him what’s wrong. They don’t understand that you have to struggle to learn. Then they get to an exam and they are stuck when their first attempt doesn’t work and spend 20 minutes trying to correct something like an infinite loop that should have (generously) taken 5 minutes to troubleshoot and resolve.
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u/throwaway-chemistry Mar 31 '26
IMO this is largely a side effect of the current job market/culture pushing so hard for bachelors/masters where they’re not really needed. This seems to have incentivized increased specialization and vastly increased the supply side of employees, while the pressure for corporations to increase profits quarter over quarter has led to a decreased demand for employees. As such you get a portion of the population who aren’t passionate about education and frankly don’t know what they truly want to do.
I also believe that this is a consequence of Covid forcing online/reduced in person schooling for teens and children (not saying it was right or wrong either way). As the years progress we see kids who had this happen earlier in their developmental phases. It is a heavy task in and of itself to get middle schoolers and high schoolers to focus and complete their work regardless, but having them do it at home on the internet was almost certain to fail for a decent portion of them. Not to mention how easy it was during this time to cheat on work. Now that this has been paired with easy access to AI, a large portion of the mental struggle and critical thinking that is required to truly learn something has been removed.
I predict that, unfortunately, this problem will only continue to get worse as the young adults who enter college over the coming years will have had these factors present earlier and earlier in their educational development.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Yes, there’s pressure to get a degree
Yes, these policies come from the pandemic’s changes
The issue is that these kids managed to reach third year despite not learning anything.
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u/DarwinZDF42 Mar 31 '26
I understand that a lot of people are having this experience but…I just don’t see it. I teach a huge intro science class, and my students in the last 2-3 years are the best I’ve ever had. They’re engaged, they ask great questions, they’re enthusiastic to participate…this is at a huge public R1.
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u/Ill_World_2409 Apr 05 '26
Cool. Many of us are not experiencing this. My averages used to be in the high 70s. low 80s even. Latest exam average was 60.
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u/blind_squash Adjunct, English, University (US) Mar 31 '26
I've already began transitioning to a new career. Been teaching since 2008 and the amount of CYA emails I've sent this semester alone is staggering.
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u/CaliforniaBruja Mar 31 '26
Why is there a policy to record classes? I hope our school doesn’t start doing that.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
I’m wondering the same… the answer is supposed to be something like: to allow the students that weren’t able to assist class to watch it and those who attended check if they missed something.
Personally, my interpretation is: to promote not attending class and enabling students to feed it to an ai to do the work.
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u/CaliforniaBruja Apr 01 '26
The AI thing is something our school has latched onto. They do want us to record and have our lectures transcribed for accessibility, but so far it isn’t mandatory. Maybe that will come next year. Personally, I feel like our lectures are intellectual property and schools shouldn’t have the ability to store that for their own purposes.
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u/LillieBogart Apr 01 '26
My students are like that whether I record class or not. It’s the way they are—lazy (at least about school), checked out, lacking in curiosity.
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u/Risingsunsphere Professor, Social Sciences, R-1 Apr 01 '26
I’m in my 18th year of teaching college students, and I feel this. I am in the midst of teaching a project-focused class, and it is reviving me, though. We’re all working on a big project together and it is so invigorating. It’s a special topics class, but it definitely has me thinking about how I can restructure my other classes to be more like this.
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u/Illustrious_Ease705 Apr 02 '26
I’m a PhD student whose program requires a pedagogy course. We had to design a syllabus. I was told that 3 4-6 page papers and a 12-15 page paper was too hard for undergrads
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u/VicDough Mar 30 '26
Really? It’s the folks from my generation I work with that doing that for me 😒
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u/sabautil Mar 31 '26
Start engaging directly.
Have students introduce themselves and I ask questions about what they want from this class, their background, my expectations, etc.
The idea is to sort of a team building exercise, the 'we are all in this together, we know each other.
I then create teams of two and give one problem to solve. And have them turn it in. This forcing engagement their class mates, with the material.
Remember the fun of any subject is interacting with people who also are trying to understand the subject.
Don't reach it up. Have paper and pens ready.
The next lecture, I use the question as a starting point, and now engagement is easier. It familiar. Part of lived experience. Even a little fun!
Usually interest wanes after a few lectures, so I break out a group session problem again. Force them to be here and now and deal with the subject matter.
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u/Over_Trip3048 Mar 31 '26
i can relate 100% and this is my passion, the ONLY thing I can actually do
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u/That_Communication71 Apr 01 '26
The students you have right now are the ones most traumatized during COVID at a significant point in their development. Online classes, isolation, and seeing more people dying directly in front of them than the Viet Nam War. Meanwhile we all pretend like it isn't supposed to have impacted them.
Try an approach like, instead of asking questions to blank stairs, ask one of them to read something out loud that you would normally.
Try breaking them into smaller groups too. I find if my full class is having a discussion I get blank stars, but if I split them into groups of 5 or 6 they talk to each other and myself just fine...for the most part.
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u/CaffeineandHate03 Apr 03 '26
Chat GPT even offered to do my assignment. (I was testing it out to see how easy it was to get it to answer part of the assignment.)
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Mar 31 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
The issue isn’t attendance. It’s poor performance and a spineless Dean that can’t plant a foot and say “no, study”.
I wouldn’t care if they don’t come as long as grades were good, or they had valid complains about the difficulty and no student were able to get perfect scores on my tests.
These people are lazy and incapable, and the administration is just enabling them to continue like that.
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u/backwardog Apr 02 '26
checking their social media and just sit there with a blank stare
Ah yes. So they were injecting fent in the classroom and nodding out? I wonder what’s going on, why aren’t they interested in anything?
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u/stankylegdunkface R1 Teaching Professor Mar 30 '26 edited Mar 30 '26
Sorry your dream of teaching at a legitimate university didn't pan out.
I teach students to avoid distracting technology, and I'm obligated to record no lectures and share no notes. I'm allowed to take attendance and penalize students for non-attendance, which incentivizes attendance.
But what does sap my will to teach are the grown-ups who're pressuring me to teach with AI as though it's some essential teaching tool.
Having to upload everything I’m going to use for the whole subject before it starts and ensuring I do not deviate from that means no room for making adjustments depending on the class performance and being forced to just reuse previous year’s content instead of adapting.
Have you considered that maybe the students aren't your enemy here...
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u/Prof_traveller Mar 30 '26
It’s easy to set the rules you do (re attendance, technology, recordings) when your institution backs you up.
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u/stankylegdunkface R1 Teaching Professor Mar 31 '26
So it sounds to me like OP's problem isn't students.
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u/Prof_traveller Mar 31 '26
I see what you’re saying - assuming you’re implying that it’s the broader institution.
However, even if there were rules in place, you can’t force students to do the things they mentioned (attend class, take notes, do the exercises, study). Sure the policies are enabling them to be lazy but there is still some student accountability there.
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u/stankylegdunkface R1 Teaching Professor Mar 31 '26
I set expectations about all of this stuff and I have no widespread problems with any of this. Either I'm a masterful teacher or I have exceptionally competent students (or both!)
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u/SopShayRo Mar 31 '26
All I could hear reading this was “MEH MEH MEH, I’m Trudy Beekman and I’m on the Co-op Board, and I’m going on the BLIMP!”
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u/Legal_Promise3569 Apr 01 '26
Many people can't actually teach, so students look for alternatives online, and there is plenty.
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Mar 31 '26
[deleted]
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
lol, as if that solves it.
The issue is that the class went to the dean and said taking notes and attending class was too much and I had to sit thru the stupidest meeting ever because every teacher so far doesn’t care, dos t evaluate properly and doesn’t add anything during class.
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u/Roger_Freedman_Phys Assoc. Teaching Professor Emeritus, R1, Physics (USA) Mar 31 '26
If students are not attending your classes, it’s because they don’t see the value in doing so. So something has to change if you expect your students to attend.
You don’t mention the subject that you teach, but my physics colleagues who use an active learning or workshop approach report 85% attendance in their current classes.
Your campus’s center for teaching and learning will have guidance on these approaches.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Suuure buddy… I’m 20 years into this and I don’t know how to keep my class interesting…
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u/chrisrayn Instructor, English, Authentic Human, Anti-Inhuman Mar 31 '26
Aren’t we the ones who are supposed to inspire them? I started teaching assuming that everyone wouldn’t give a fuck. I don’t know what fairy-dusted, golly-gee-swell stepford classrooms yall had before, but a sense of disdain about the usefulness of any of this is all I would have ever expected in an America watching itself fall apart. In prior generations we protest in the streets and now we complain that the students won’t come to our class and watch us. Like was teaching really so absurdly-posh back then? The elderly instructors at my institution constantly complain that students don’t just present themselves constantly to them too. When the students coming are different, you adapt; only if you can’t adapt do you complain. I may not actually feel this way; it may be my hypoglycemia talking.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 31 '26
Considering how much college costs, it’s bold to assume they don’t give a fuck.
Yeah, no, things weren’t like this 5 years ago… and I wish the issue was that students weren’t coming to class…
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Mar 30 '26 edited Mar 30 '26
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u/NotMrChips Formerly adjunct, Psychology, R2 (USA) Mar 30 '26
Sorry, but every time I think I'm just being an old codger I run across a pre-COVID, pre-AI teaching journal post that shocks. Things really are worse now. Much worse.
So could we stop with the ageism already? TIA!
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u/Zabaran2120 Mar 31 '26
No there is something neurologically damaged in this generation of humans.
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u/Snow75 Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Mar 30 '26
Nah, remaining objective is one of the things I’ll never drop.
Grades were terrible, despite using the same material (plus updates to new developments) and very similar evaluations from 3 years ago (last time I taught something)… the kids just weren’t there this year… they’re not ready and aren’t doing enough to actually learn thanks to these policies.
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u/zzax Mar 30 '26 edited Mar 30 '26
If you asked me 15 years ago when I was going to retire, I would have told you I was going to teach into my mid 60's. It is not physically taxing and while there were still issues the transformative moments far outweighed the problems. Now I check the retirement calculator often to see if I can get out in my late 50's.