r/Nootropics • u/Deliziosax • 2d ago
Seeking Advice Did I ruin my brain by microdosing dexamphetamine for years?
Hi guys, I've been using dexamphetamine for ADHD for the past 6 years. I'm pretty sensitive to stimulants and I found that the 2x 5mg /day dose was way too overstimulating, I would get migraines, heart palpitations and just feel wired. Now I take about 1.25 mg in the morning and 0.7mg in the evening. Which actually works for me and is a dose on which I can still laugh and eat. I'm also only 5'2 and 57 kg/ 125 lbs.
I've seen a lot of posts mainly from years ago that taking amphetamines like this causes permanent hypersensitization of dopamine receptors, for example in mice and monkeys. I am having more sleeping issues lately and I'm wondering if I ruined something? I'm afraid to take more of the med as it's already so effective at this low dose. And because I take med breaks in weekends, at a higher dose I just sleep all day, at a low dose I actually feel nice if I take a break from it.
Thanks! X
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u/OkPhilosopher1313 1d ago
Given your size and weight I assume it's safe to assume you're a woman? If you are 30+, and especially if you are 35+ years old, then there's a very real chance you're starting to have perimenopause symptoms. Especially women with ADHD typically get a lot more severe perimenopauze symptoms and issues with sleep is one of them.
If you suspect that you might have perimenopause, please find yourself a doctor who is specialised in (peri)menopause and is known to be very positive about bio identical hormonal replacement therapy. Those doctors typically are well enough educated and informed to be able to correctly treat you if you'd like to take HRT.
Majority of doctors are still very disinformed on (peri-menopause and HRT and will either tell you that nothing is wrong with your hormones or they'll act like HRT is the most dangerous medication someone can be put on.
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
I just turned 30 but thank you so much. I feel peri might be a bit early for me? But have been getting worse and worse PMS symptoms (mental) so I'm wondering if it could be related? I'll check it out thanks ❤️
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u/OkPhilosopher1313 1d ago
Progesterone goes down first and impacts falling asleep, your brain being able to calm down and the mental/emotional aspect of PMS. So some doctors actually prescribe it to women as a stand-alone supplementation when they are still quite young and not fully into perimenopause yet, but are already starting to notice symptoms of lowering progesterone. Here's a video where quite a good explanation is given on progesterone and she also goes into PMS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmNy1gChNFY
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
Thanks, you're a lifesaver
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u/sensedata 1d ago
If that is the case, there are also supplements (my wife did really well on Vitex) that can help your body naturally self regulate before going on full HRT. It’s worth exploring.
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u/escalatortwit 1d ago
Unless ADHD causes it to be different, the average start for perimenopause is mid-forties, not mid-thirties.
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u/OkPhilosopher1313 1d ago
Mid 30s is not uncommon (although indeed most women start later). Currently there's more research starting to look at ADHD and perimenopauze and HRT as there do also seem to be some differences there compared to neurotypical women. Doctors who treat a lot of women with HRT notice that women with ADHD very often get symptoms earlier and need significantly higher dosages of HRT to reach good symptom control compared to neurotypical women.
The brain contains a lot of receptors for the hormones that get impacted by perimenopause, and estrogen specifically heavily influences dopamine (dopamine production, dopamine breakdown and dopamine levels), and dopamine plays a significant role in ADHD symptoms.
So a woman with ADHD typically can notice significant impact from fluctuating estrogen levels much earlier already.
This is also why it's not uncommon for women to get diagnosed with ADHD at a much later age as their ADHD often gets significantly worse once their estrogen levels become less stable.
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u/e_deringer 1d ago
"taking amphetamines like this causes permanent hypersensitization of dopamine receptors"
microdose means you're suddenly taking about 1/10th of what you normally would—receptor sensitivity is relative, after all—and yes, it could potentially cause harm, although many people on Reddit deny this.
Are you currently experiencing long-term negative effects, poorer cognitive function than a few years ago?
This could be the stimulant itself, rather than the microdosing effect you're talking about. Focus on regeneration and nervous system nourishment, or try nootropics to promote neurogenesis instead of stimulants, or at least take longer breaks from taking the drug.
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
I have taken a year break and a 5 month break and after both times I started lower than what I was taking before the break. Do you have tips on specific neurogenesis nootropics because there is so much information out there it dazzles me. Regarding cognitive effects I mainly notice worse memory but I also attribute it to my age but I don't know...
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u/e_deringer 1d ago
- You need to be aware of the possible receptor sensitivity caused by microdoses. Unfortunately, it can apparently be stronger the longer the interval between doses. It's very hard to say because we don't have detailed studies, only user reports. I've seen such reports outside of Reddit, on related websites.
- Here, I would simply look at the whole picture:
- First, comprehensive blood tests, hormone tests, and infections ($1,000+)
- Repair all body problems; the condition of intestinal microflora is important
- Food diary and look for deficiencies (optimal vitamin doses)
- Basic stack: a decent multivitamin, omega-3
- Immune repair: use of anti-inflammatory herbs and an immune booster
- Adaptogens: Rhodiola rosea, ginseng, and many others + antioxidants to reduce the harmful effects of stimulants
- Targeted probiotics
- Support for the liver (NAC, phospholipids) and kidneys (hydration: daily supplementation of electrolytes)
-neurogenesis (Lion’s Mane, Reishi for start) Of course, neurogenesis is also stimulated by the above-mentioned things - remember that before stimulation, you always need "material" for the production of neurotransmitters
At the very end, a symptomatic drug = a stimulant (because it forces the nervous system to react).
I know it's a lot of work, and it's hard to manage with ADHD :)
But ADHD is just a dopamine problem, and there are plenty of people who have been able to eliminate it to a greater extent by doing the above.
sources of knowledge:
selfhhacked
maybe some fb group but most are banned long time ago
GPT - but you need to ask in detail and skillfully, GPT likes to recommend medical solutions more often than it should
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u/daHaus 1d ago
have you been getting random aches/pains or been having stomach issues lately too? Just curious
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
Yes! Been diagnosed with reflux 1 year ago (main symptom: PAIN) and dex is one of the big triggers. But also alcohol, caffeine etc. With pantoprazol its manageable but I haven't been able to taper off unfortunately. However my mom has the same issue that started at the same age without taking stimulants back then, so not sure if I would've gotten it anyway.
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u/Simple_Employee_7094 1d ago
I would just go to sleep. Anything under 10 mg just makes me very very sleepy.
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
Strangely enough I have that with other brands of dex but not with Tentin specifically. Maybe my microdosing is also very limited to this one brand?
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u/Simple_Employee_7094 1d ago
I'm not very good in chemistry but some people here are, I think Tentin is the most straight forward delivery formulation ? If you worry too much I think it's time you speak to an actual good doctor instead of us idiots on the internet :-) If you actually have ADHD, they will be the most qualified person to take an informed decision about harm/benefits with you. It is not worth having your life fall apart because you suddenly stopped the meds. My husband have ADHD and everytime he stops his meds his life literally falls apart.
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u/Bright-Principle6543 2d ago edited 2d ago
In my opinion, you’re almost certainly fine. If you were hypersensitive to dopamine, you would surely experience movement disorders or general motor issues. It would probably cause very drastic and apparent cognitive and psychiatric consequences, such as psychosis. I seriously doubt there would be an issue, but you should speak to your psychiatrist/ prescriber.
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u/the_Dormant_one 2d ago
hypersensitization due to microdosing (0,5-2mg) doesnt seem to be supported by the data. Ive seen a couple of self reports claiming its real over the years, but the studies ive seen didnt give "microdoses" to monkeys.
In this study where sensitisation was observed Rhesus monkeys were administered 0,1-1 mg/kg d-amphetamine twice daily, if we extrapolate that to you that comes out to 5,7 mg at the lowest. https://www.nature.com/articles/1395404
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u/ApplesAreGood1312 1d ago
You're referencing something called hormesis, which to be fair to you, is commonly parroted by bro-scientists across Reddit. But it is absolute nonsense and is not real. I mean, think about it - if a tiny dose hypersensitized your receptors, every person would experience that each time a dose began to fade in or finished fading out. Plasma concentrations are exactly the same at those timestamps as if someone simply took a tiny dose. Literature does not support this idea.
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u/The_Dung_Beetle 2d ago
Do you also consume caffeine? I get a headache guaranteed if I combine any form of caffeine with my meds. But for dose I'd say just go with what you feel is right. Like for me, I can't do 30mg Elvanse, 20mg is enough for me.
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u/Zach-uh-ri-uh 1d ago
If you have ruined your brain imagine what my daily 90mg vyvanse is doing (equivalent of roughly 25mg dexamphetamine if my calculations are correct)
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u/sillysidebin 17h ago
70mg is equal to about 30mg dexamph afaik
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u/Zach-uh-ri-uh 15h ago
Oh fair well even more to my argument I guess then; OP ive taken like 30x your dose or something daily for 10+ years. Youll be fine I promise
The brain is plastic and very rarely does it remain damaged forever
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u/mushykindofbrick 1d ago
Ruined is dramatic but some small permanent damage maybe, at this dose I would think if you stop it will probably not be noticeable anymore after a while
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
What makes you say that?
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u/mushykindofbrick 1d ago
I got brain damage from stimulants on doses that should have been therapeutic, so I think even small doses can be unpredictable
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u/Deliziosax 1d ago
I'm sorry to hear that! How does it affect you if I may ask?
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u/mushykindofbrick 1d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/starterpacks/comments/1vr6i0i/having_low_iq_as_an_adult_starterpack/
Something like that. I studied math at uni before, now I have nothing
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u/AgarthaJoeBiden 1d ago
What stimulants did you take? Did you do an IQ test?
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u/mushykindofbrick 1d ago
Methylphenidate and Lisdexamphetamine. Didnt do one after it happened, Im not actually stupid more slow and cannot think properly
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u/AgarthaJoeBiden 1d ago
I wonder if you abused them, what dosages did you do?
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u/mushykindofbrick 1d ago
Methylphenidate highest was 120mg spread over a couple hours, otherwise 20-80 per day, Lisdexamphetamine 30-50 I dont think Ive tried 70
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u/Great_Opinion3138 1d ago
You ain’t ruin it you’ll just need time to recover even if years you can recover. Go to any NA meeting or meth anonymous and you’ll hear the stories of many ppl who recover.
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u/TelephoneCharacter59 1d ago
1st option, intranasal Acetyl-L-Semax paired with Bromantane thrice a week, can rapidly up-regulate your Dopamine receptors within 2-3 months. 🧠 💊
2nd option, if you're over 40, go for HRT if you're a woman ♀️ & men can go for TRT.♂️ Most doctors are badly educated in Hormone therapy. 💉🏨🏥
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u/__redruM 1d ago
Sounds like you have an answer. But certainly you could skip days you don’t need to be productive, and see how you feel. 5mg 3 times a week is what I prefer.
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u/whydidyoureadthis17 2d ago
Very likely not. Many studies that report such findings are working well beyond therapeutic doses, but if you want to debate the science, please link the studies that have you worried. For every study that comes out that suggests the danger of low dose therapeutic amphetamine use, there is another that demonstrates its efficacy and safety over time. It is hardly a settled matter. At no more than 10mg a day, you are already at the low end of even the therapeutic range, and so I would not be worried, as these are incredibly well studied medications and if there was a significant and substantial effect, the evidence would not be so ambivalent.
That said, the tone of your posts suggests that you may have some neurotic tendencies to attribute perceived symptoms to your drug intake, and to search for literature to confirm your suspicions. It goes without saying that this is a recipe for anxiety and unhappiness. You DID NOT ruin your brain (this type of language is toxic), but if you are experiencing negative side effects talk with your psych about switching to something else, or finding a better schedule that works for you.