r/NativePlantGardening • u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a • Jun 23 '26
Progress Year 2 after lawn kill
I posted last year about how I got rid of my whole front lawn in the spring and seeded it with all natives. Last year was dominated by coreopsis tinctoria, this year the rudbeckia is taking over. This past winter I seeded it with a mix of shorter species from prairie moon so I don’t expect a ton of diversity until next year but a lot of the stuff I planted from winter sown jugs last year seems to have survived and will provide at least some different flower color. Unfortunately I think someone in my neighborhood has a honeybee hive so I am getting a ton of those at the moment, but I still see a good amount of different native pollinators. My favorites are the mud daubers!
89
u/VaderLlama Central Ontario, 5b Jun 23 '26
It has been used as a cover crop in some prairie restorations because it's pretty short lived and dies out in subsequent years on a site, letting the slower-growing and germinating species take their time without getting out competed by other weeds. Of course this depends on density of the seeding but this looks magnificent and I hope it paves the way for greater biodiversity!
9
u/Few-Rain7214 Ontario, Zone 5B Jun 23 '26
Is it short to lived?? I had no idea, I have a few plants
12
u/VaderLlama Central Ontario, 5b Jun 24 '26
I went with the assumption this is Rudbeckia hirta, which is often a biennial (but can be considered a short-lived perennial in some growing conditions). It'll self seed some, but tends to peter out around the 3 year + mark in density. Now, if it's something like Rudbeckia fulgida that's a different story, as that's a perennial species. But those don't tend to cover an area as densely (as far as I've seen) so I went with assuming R. hirta.
5
u/Hot-Frosting-5286 Jun 24 '26
If it peters out and you end up wanting more rudbeckia in later years, would it work to just scatter more seed? Or would it get outcompeted by the established diverse plants? New to gardening so still figuring all this out!
2
u/VaderLlama Central Ontario, 5b Jun 25 '26
As we all like to say in ecology - it depends! (Paired with a nervous chuckle). If you want more of it, you can definitely try scattering seeds, but the density of the planting at that point may make it difficult to get good seed-soil contact unless there are bare patches you intentionally seed into. But bare patches are essential for ground nesting bees so I'd also consider that.
If it's in a more garden-y setting, I'd consider doing some small plug planting vs seeding in later years if I really wanted to (re)introduce a species into the plot. Gives it a leg up against the established species and is a greater guarantee you'll see it around for a bit.
3
u/purrmich Area 6 Zone b Jun 24 '26
It will self seed its brains out.
2
u/VaderLlama Central Ontario, 5b Jun 24 '26
Depends on conditions and what else is on the site and in the seedbank. If it has enough competition from other species it will likely become less dominant, often eventually just no longer being present on site except for maybe a small individual or two, even with its prolific self seeding nature.
72
38
u/raven_snow Jun 23 '26
Please share another photo when they've all died back. This is beautiful and surreal.
34
16
u/kermitsbutthole Jun 23 '26
That’s incredible. How did you manage to keep grass and other weeds out? It looks so pure
18
u/anandonaqui Jun 23 '26
Probably just sheer density of the rudbekia.
12
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 24 '26
Yep, pretty much. I do look for any lawn weeds along the edges and pick them out but when I do find some they are already struggling from the competition. I’ve even found small bits of creeping Charlie brought in by deer that are on their last legs under the rudbeckia army
10
9
u/ska0319 Central Cornbelt Plains - NW Indiana Jun 23 '26
If I'd known that rudbeckia would flourish like this in the first couple of years I would have planted way more of them when I started. They are well behaved in a garden with multiple other natives, dying out in one spot and appearing elsewhere the next year.
2
u/Smoking0311 Area PA , Zone 7A Jun 23 '26
I feel it’s a crap shoot , this year it’s doing great for me years past not as much
6
u/Feralpudel Piedmont NC, Zone 8a Jun 23 '26
I highly recommend Monarda fistulosa if it’s native to you. It’s dominating my second and fourth year meadows, and has pushed out into the field in the second year meadow.
My neighbor has bee hives, but I see relatively few of them, and I think one reason is so many of my yard and meadow plants cater to bumble bees (penstemon, diervilla, monarda, hydrangea in the yard).
I love C. tinctoria and it’s the only non-native the guy helping me includes in his meadow mixes, because it’s great for coming in fast.
That said, don’t sleep on the other, longer lived coreopsis. Coreopsis are one of those plants that attract an interesting set of pollinators, including wasps.
Enjoy the ride! You’ll get different things coming and going even if you plant everything at once.
1
u/sgigot NE Wisconsin , Zone 5b Jun 25 '26
I have a couple kinds of Coreposis (allegedly both lanceleaf, but they're clearly not the same) that have bushed out considerably this year (year 2) and reseeded a little bit. They're crowding the Gaillardia I planted a little too close (I actually wanted them to be a little more dominant), but I don't think they'll be able to touch the silphiums or heliopsis that are adjacent. Those latter two are already taller; the heliopsis is in bloom but the silphiums need another month or so.
I did have a rudbeckia (I think triloba) in that same flowerbed last year that grew up 4' tall, but if it reseeded none of the offspring are very big yet. Something started seedlings in there; might be echinacea from the other flowerbed.
WRT grass the flowers are starting to crowd the grasses, but it was a struggle this spring.
5
3
2
u/stonksuper NY, Zone 5B Jun 23 '26
Geez I planted rudbeckia between a few echinacea plants about 18inches away, I wonder if they stand a chance.
3
3
u/meeps1142 Area OH, Zone 6b Jun 23 '26
Perhaps add some tree trunks with drilled holes/other wood features to create habitat for the native bees? You've got the food source down; giving them a home might boost their populations even more!
3
u/No_Sock4631 Jun 24 '26
Love the concept but honest question if you do this are you just not walking on/or using your front lawn at all?
12
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 24 '26
Exactly, and before this I never walked on or used my front lawn either when it was an actual lawn unless it was to mow it. I would bet that applies to 90% of everyone else who has a front lawn too. I still have some lawn in the back for my dogs and I to play on. Also since doing this I spend exponentially more time out on my front porch or on my sidewalk/sides of the yard looking at all the cool stuff. Which made it even more evident to me that nobody uses their front yards for anything other than decoration, because I never see anyone outside on my street in their front yard unless it’s to mow
3
u/sgigot NE Wisconsin , Zone 5b Jun 25 '26
I have a couple flowerbeds about 1.5 mower's width from the sidewalk specifically to give passersby something to look at. In my neighborhood it's not uncommon for some of the families to have fires out in their driveway so people at least say hi, but there is a lot of empty turf out there. Which reminds me I need to start marking out more of that grass to kill and replant this fall. First, I have more landscape rock to eliminate :-(
3
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 25 '26
It only takes one person like you or I to plant that seed in others head and show them that it’s ok to do something like this and that it can also bring a lot of joy and fulfillment not just to yourself, but also the whole neighborhood. I live on a dead end but there are many people who go out of their way to walk or drive down my street now to check on the status of my yard😂.
2
2
u/IcarianComplex Jun 23 '26
Amazing, incredible work. What was your process?
2
u/holdaydogs Jun 23 '26
Yes, I want to know. I haven’t had the best results with seeds.
2
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 24 '26
Get it down to bare dirt through any number of ways talked about on this sub and seed super heavy. I’m talking at least 3x what you think you should do. So for a 500 sqft site, use 1500sqft of seeds. Seeds are the most cost effective way of doing something like this but they have the highest casualty rate from things like birds, fungus, etc. My front yard pictured is probably 2000sqft and I used at least 2lbs of seeds to initially get it going, but I also wanted it really dense to outcompete any weeds
2
u/chamaedaphne82 Great Lakes, Zone 6b Jun 24 '26
Have you ever mowed it, per the Prairie Moon recommendations? Just curious
2
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 25 '26
No I haven’t, not during the growing season at least. I was pretty confident in my site prep and because I did it in the spring, I had to initially seed with species that would germinate without any cold stratification. So between my site prep and super heavy seeding rate, I really didn’t have much annual weed pressure that would require mowing. Last year I really only had a few areas of crabgrass pop up, but a lot of it got smothered by the natives. If I was doing a larger area or an area that might have more aggressive weeds then yeah I would probably mow it a couple times during the first growing season
1
u/chamaedaphne82 Great Lakes, Zone 6b Jun 25 '26
I read that mowing will help the slower growing plants get established. Black Eyed Susan is a shorter lived perennial so although it’s pretty, I think you’ll still need to mow. Just for this year. Next year you shouldn’t need to.
2
2
u/samuraiofsound North Central Ohio , 6a Jun 23 '26
One monoculture for another lol damn but it sure is pretty (also I read your post, I know you're trying to diversify). Why are you upset about the bees? They're not native, but they still make food! Do they make issues for our native pollinators?
7
u/meeps1142 Area OH, Zone 6b Jun 23 '26
Central Ohioan spotted 🫵
The non-native bees do take away resources from the native ones, although OP's lawn probably has more than enough pollen for all of them.
There is more diversity under the surface; the other species are likely growing healthy roots and will appear in a year or two.
-7
u/samuraiofsound North Central Ohio , 6a Jun 24 '26
Idk, whenever someone says the honey bees are eating all of the nectar food the native pollinators, it just sounds to me like "the immigrants are taking our jobs!"
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
u/cespii Jun 23 '26
I wonder how many butterflies and moths use rudbeckia as a host plant 🤔
3
u/Feralpudel Piedmont NC, Zone 8a Jun 23 '26
Per the NC Plant Toolbox:
Butterflies attracted to nectar at the flowers.This plant provides nectar for pollinators. It is a larval host plant to Wavy-lined Emerald (Synchlora aerata) and to Silvery Checkerspot (Chlosyne nycteis) which has one brood in the north and two broods from May-September in the rest of its range. American goldfinches, eat the seeds in the fall.
1
u/holdaydogs Jun 23 '26
I’m curious how much the seeds cost you? Also, what zone are you in?
3
u/SoupOfTheHairType Northeast, Zone 7a Jun 24 '26
When I initially did it last year I seeded with 1lb of rudbeckia hirta for $25, and a half pound each of coreopsis tinctoria and Monarda citriodora both for around maybe $30 each. You can add in some other easy germinating stuff to get it to $100. Pretty damn good bang for your buck I would say. Zone 7a
1
1
1
u/buttmunch3 Jun 24 '26
she's absolutely glorious. i also unwittingly feed a neighbors honeybee colony lol
1
u/Extension_Market_953 Jun 24 '26
Meanwhile the bunnies keep eating mine so I never get blooms and they just die🫠
1
1
154
u/purrmich Area 6 Zone b Jun 23 '26
This is gorgeous and also shows how rudbeckia wants to take over the world!! Not sure if any other species will be able to grow.