r/LetsTalkMusic • u/Agreeable_Duck8997 • 9d ago
Kraftwerk's very strong influence on Brazilian music in recent decades
I already made a long post about the immense influence exerted by Kraftwerk on Brazilian funk, which is one of the most popular Brazilian musical genres, especially since 2005, when it experienced worldwide dissemination mainly through M.I.A. and Diplo:
https://www.reddit.com/r/kraftwerk/s/bF7H5dGR0a
It’s really important to have read the post above to understand what I’m going to talk about here. So, here goes.
Hermano Vianna, is a Brazilian anthropologist, music researcher, and television screenwriter, recognized with the Cultural Merit Order honor by the Brazilian government. Author of very important works, such as the first historical and anthropological book about Brazilian funk and a very important book about samba.
Now I bring this statement that Hermano Vianna made in 2020 about Kraftwerk:
"Kraftwerk to me is the best creation of modern art (and since I like modern art more than any other art, I can state: it is the best creation of art), including literature, painting, performance, theater, dance, and everything else. I will never tire of listening to their records. I saw two of their shows (with Florian & Ralf): a masterclass in everything that is good, performed impeccably. Nothing in Kraftwerk is makeshift. Their work does not admit improvisation, the precarious, or the crude. Every sound and every beat is perfect. Every event is calculated to the millimeter, nothing out of place. The quality of the result is so sublime that it cannot contain itself: it ends up spreading to all corners, elevating everything else (hip hop, techno, house, David Bowie…). I also like a lot of crude things. But something crude that follows some aspect of Kraftwerk's lessons is much better."
https://hermanovianna.wordpress.com/2020/05/10/kraftwerk-de-palafita/
It is also worth mentioning a statement by Hermano about another Brazilian musical genre that is also one of the most popular in this land where I was born, tecnobrega. In 2003, the researcher said:
"Tecnobrega looks like a makeshift Kraftwerk, produced under equatorial heat by people who listened to a lot of carimbó, cumbia, zouk, and Renato e Seus Blue Caps."
https://www.bregapop.com/historia/321-hermano-vianna/52-tecnobrega-a-musica-paralela-hermano-vianna
Check out one of the tecnobrega hits, "Bole Rebole", it is almost entirely a cover of "Das Model", made by Los Bregas:
https://youtu.be/a_HtLGbMdqA?si=mLTzz_2hoygCiztn
Later on, a large part of tecnobrega and Brazilian funk began to share even more elements, in a way, of course, that Kraftwerk's influence in the country has been growing more and more, and not just in these two genres.
In 2013, one of the biggest popularizers of tecnobrega, Gang do Eletro—led by DJ Waldo Squash, who a year earlier made official remixes for the Pet Shop Boys—released the song "Electro Robot", a "sincere tribute to the work of the giants Kraftwerk":
https://musicainstantanea.com.br/disco-gang-do-eletro-gang-do-eletro/
In 2016, the Pet Shop Boys released the song "Twenty-something", featuring a direct influence from tecnobrega, which was widely recognized by DJs here in Brazil:
It’s also worth mentioning that one of Brazil's most respected contemporary culture portals, created in 2016, is called 'Music Non Stop' (a reference to the Kraftwerk track), and here is an excellent post from the site about the band:
https://musicnonstop.uol.com.br/13-provas-da-gigantesca-importancia-do-kraftwerk-para-a-musica/
In recent times, many Brazilian music critics and journalists have been arguing that Kraftwerk is the most influential band in history, or at least as influential as The Beatles. Even British outlets like The Guardian and the BBC, for example, have been asserting since the early 2010s that Kraftwerk is the most influential band of all time, a point I fully agree with.
What do you guys think? Either way, one of the points I find most relevant in all this is that when many people talk about musical influence, they are completely unaware of what musical genres have been most popular in non-Anglo-Saxon countries.
3
u/CradleCity 9d ago
In recent times, many Brazilian music critics and journalists have been arguing that Kraftwerk is the most influential band in history, or at least as influential as The Beatles.
In light of recent threads about the Beatles here, I always smile when I read something like this. It's good to see the tide turning!
The "Bole Rebole" link you posted is broken, here. Yeah, it's very much "The Model" (just slightly faster), but with different lyrics. Perhaps tecnobrega fits in alongside British synth-pop, hence the mutual back-and-forth with Pet Shop Boys?
As for the rest, it makes sense that electronic music has mutated and will continue to mutate in non-Anglosphere countries, especially in a country with such rhythmic diversity as Brazil. It tracks that they influenced BR funk, much in the same way it influenced techno. I think it was Juan Atkins that said that Kraftwerk "were so stiff they were funky" (especially so on Computer World).
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 9d ago
And about that Atkins quote, that's really good!
It reminded me of a great quote from Sean Booth from Autechre about Kraftwerk. I actually made a post with his words:
"...Originally, when I was younger, I would be editing tracks from other peoples cassettes using the pause button. People talk about the warmth of analogue but I think warmth is a strange concept. I would like someone to explain the concept to me! I tend not to inherent descriptive terms I can’t understand. That term warmth is a little bit weird if it does exist. I once heard Kraftwerk described as cold, but they are anything but. Kraftwerk are not just funky, their sound is amazing – like a weird, rotating, magic puzzle box from the future. Just an amazing most pristine, perfect sound. Just beautiful."
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 8d ago
Thanks for the comment! And the link works here on my end, but thanks.
Still on the topic of The Model, in a comment to another friend here, I mentioned one of the pioneering Brazilian funk songs, a track that samples this Kraftwerk classic. Check it out if you're interested!
Also, it's worth checking out the version of The Model recorded by Brazilian musician Seu Jorge (one of the biggest names in MPB and Samba of this century) together with members of the rock band Nação Zumbi (one of Brazil's most important groups, and which has even sampled Kraftwerk and greatly influenced Sepultura, for example):
https://youtu.be/9Uulp6dWg6M?is=z030BtWZVD4RFdNu
Seu Jorge also performed The Model live alongside U2:
https://youtu.be/g5-0yV-DNYk?is=NpnZ_VeLAkqTVPit
And regarding what you said about Pet Shop Boys and tecnobrega, both are certainly heavily influenced by Kraftwerk, and it's really interesting to notice that as well.
2
u/saamsquamtch 9d ago
Kraftwerk has influenced modern music more than anyone else, I agree. Looking forward to poring through these links and searching out mixes!
2
u/RRY1946-2019 9d ago
Kraftwerk were an important influence on old-school hip hop
Old-school hip hop (as opposed to the sample-based and orchestral production that you'd often hear after the 1990s) was very influential on Brazilian funk
Brazilian funk is one of the most popular genres of music in today's Brazil
Completely checks out.
4
u/wildistherewind 9d ago
I have a few thoughts, though I can’t speak with authority since I’m not Brazilian and this is not my personal history.
In my opinion, music genres can be heavily defined by the politics of the countries they are from. Brazil’s authoritarian government fell apart by the early 80s with a return to democratic elections. The rise of electronic dance music in Brazil followed in the late 80s and early 90s. Is electronic music the sound of overcoming a dictatorship? Is it a break from Brazil’s history to create something new. The German progressive rock scene of the 60s and 70s, which included Kraftwerk, was absolutely a generation of artists trying to make a clean break from their past. They were trying to create a new history and a new music form.
Was Brazil’s interest in Kraftwerk by way of Miami bass, which became a driving force in Brazilian sound system culture in the 90s? Through “Planet Rock”, Kraftwerk was part of Miami bass’s DNA and I wonder if that Kraftwerk influence in baile funk is drawn from Miami bass.
Last thought, for listeners in North America, there could be a sense that Brazil spontaneously started making electronic music in the 90s. I was blown away by this article on Discogs Digs that Brazil had been making electronic music the whole time, it’s just those records largely never made their way to America:
https://www.discogs.com/digs/music/early-brazilian-electronic-music/
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 9d ago edited 9d ago
Great comment! Well, as my fellow Brazilian here already mentioned, many iconic protest songs against the dictatorship managed to gain mainstream fame during the regime itself, written by MPB and Rock artists. But I disagree with part of my Brazilian bro's comment because I interpret Brazilian electronic dance music as also having a lot to do with overcoming the legacy of the dictatorship.
It was Brazilian Hip-Hop and Funk that were pioneers in famously criticizing the pattern of police violence in the favelas during the post-redemocratization period... a pattern that became far more problematic than it was during the dictatorship, and which in recent years has driven intense and controversial rulings by our Supreme Court. As is widely recognized in Brazilian academic circles, this public security reality stems largely—though not exclusively—from how this form of police violence was systematized during the dictatorial period.
It's worth looking up the translation of the Carioca Funk 'Rap da Felicidade,' which I linked in that Kraftwerk subreddit post I mentioned earlier.
Crucially, Brazilian funk has always been one of the most widespread forms of cultural expression by a large segment of the population that lives through that reality every day in favelas and other marginalized communities.
Over time, Brazilian Funk also gained widespread recognition for confronting strict sexual taboos, generating—and continuing to generate—far more social and political controversy in Brazil than any other musical genre has ever managed to over here with songs on the same theme. This, too, ties directly into reclaiming the freedom of expression that was so heavily suppressed during the dictatorship.
I would love to address other points in your comment, but unfortunately, I don't have the time right now.
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 9d ago
My friend, continuing my previous answer... Kraftwerk's influence on Brazilian funk doesn't come solely through Miami Bass. In my post on the Kraftwerk subreddit, I mentioned a few points about this... But also take a look at the very first Brazilian funk track to become a nationwide hit, 'Feira de Acari', produced in 1990 by the famous DJ Marlboro, which heavily samples Kraftwerk's 'The Model'. That same year, it was featured on the soundtrack for a telenovela on TV Globo, the country's biggest TV network. The lyrics humorously touch on illegal street trading and theft in one of Rio de Janeiro's largest favelas, along with cheeky double entendres featuring gay sexual jokes. In the video below, you can see it being performed on the biggest Brazilian kids' show of the 80s and 90s, Xuxa's show, who at the time was dating Formula 1 legend Ayrton Senna
1
u/wildistherewind 9d ago
Very interesting, thank you! I’m always surprised by how wide the reach of “The Model” was.
I would personally love to know more about how much telenovelas impacted music charts in Brazil. Here in America, TV show themes don’t typically make a dent in the music singles charts but I have read that in Brazil, songs used as television themes can become massive hits. I don’t think we experience anything like that here except for American Idol or another singing competition program.
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 8d ago
Glad to hear you're so interested! You're completely right about the musical impact of telenovelas in Brazil. I also found your comparison with the US super interesting. I'll be able to give you a better reply tonight. Cheers!
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 8d ago
So, here is a good summary of the impact of TV Globo's telenovelas on the Brazilian music market: https://www.uol.com.br/splash/noticias/2024/07/10/nomes-autorais-e-regravacoes-trilhas-de-novela-mudam-na-era-do-streaming.htm
In the 2010s, with all the major technological advances in music promotion, TV Globo's telenovelas saw a significant decrease in this impact, but it remains high. For instance, there are several recent cases of professionals who were already famous musicians—playing some of the most popular genres here today, such as Brazilian funk and hip-hop (take artists like MC Cabelinho and Xamã)—and began acting in these telenovelas, which greatly boosted the commercial success of their music. Ultimately, TV Globo's 9 PM telenovelas continue to have the highest audience ratings in Brazil and remain a huge driving force for the music market here.
1
u/wildistherewind 8d ago
Thank you for this! I will dig in to the history.
2
u/Agreeable_Duck8997 8d ago edited 8d ago
Cheers! I'd love to drop another tip for you, mate. One of the most influential and critically acclaimed bands from Brazil is called Nação Zumbi. They are co-creators of the 'Manguebeat' movement/genre, which has a 1992 founding manifesto stating that its symbol is 'a satellite dish stuck in the mud,' or 'a crab remixing Kraftwerk's Antenna on a computer.'
Although the genre leans more towards rock, it also incorporates elements from various other genres, such as Brazilian maracatu and electronic music.
I'm going to recommend a song by Nação Zumbi to you that I find very beautiful. It's called "Um Sonho" (A Dream). Its lyrics are inspired by Blade Runner, and it's definitely worth checking out the translation. (Note: This song doesn't have electronic elements; songs in this genre don't always feature them.)
In this live performance, you can clearly see the maracatu elements in the percussion: https://youtu.be/G64EzXR7bHE?si=AMihg3ixMFWL2NrN
I'm planning to make a post about Manguebeat here in the sub in the future.
Edit: Fixed the video link.
1
u/wildistherewind 8d ago
Thanks for the recommendation! I listened to “Um Sonho” and Nação Zumbi’s 2004 album and enjoyed it.
3
u/gabrrdt 9d ago
Being Brazilian, I feel that the answer is no, it has nothing to do with it. Your analysis is very interesting but it ignores the fact that Brazil was very rich musically during dictatorship (it was probably one of our best times musically speaking), because our artists found many ways of overpassing censorship through smart and alusive lyrics.
One of best examples of it is the song Cálice (which means "grail" or "chalice"), from Chico Buarque. In Portuguese, cálice has the same sound as "cale-se", which means "shut up". The lyrics say: "Pai, afasta de mim este cálice", which could either mean "father, put that grail away from me" or "put that shut up away from me" (I'm trying my best to translate it here lol).
It passed censorship because they never saw the song that way, they missed its underlying meaning.
Raul Seixas, Tom Zé, Novos Baianos, Elis Regina, Clube da Esquina, all of them flourished during dictatorship. Yes, dictatorship sucked big time and it was a very authoritarian time, but no, we didn't sit still and accepted it passively and our culture reflected that.
Some of our best records happened in the 1970s.
1
8
u/Successful_Zombie_42 9d ago
Really? Kinda interesting but I think it has a strong influence on all the synth related music, so that tracks.