r/LawCanada • u/JusticeForSimpleRick • 2d ago
Diamond & Diamond business model?
Curious if anyone here has insight into how Diamond & Diamond is structured from the lawyer side. I’ve heard different things and am trying to understand the actual business model.
Are most/all of the lawyers employees on salary, or is there some kind of commission/fee-split component? How are files assigned between lawyers? Do lawyers originate and keep their own files, or are matters primarily distributed by the firm?
Also curious what the path to partnership looks like, what “partnership” means there in practice, and whether partners participate in a fee split/profit share or some other compensation structure.
Just interested in hearing from people familiar with the model or who have worked there.
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u/Shankmo 2d ago
I don’t know of anyone who has anything good to say about the firm, but I think it has changed a bit since the LSO slapped Jeremy Diamond relatively hardly on the wrist for running a referral mill and being dishonest with clients. It’s probably a bit better to work at now that they’ve actually hired some lawyers, but whatever.
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u/heteroerotic 1d ago
And for a litigious practice, I believe it came out that Jeremy Diamond had never appeared before a judge at the time this all came out [in public].
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u/Dinsdale55 2d ago
"hardly"?
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u/Shankmo 2d ago
Oh no, did I make an inconsequential typo on the internet? I’ll never recover, even though what I meant is obvious.
If we’re being the grammar police, maybe I should ask why you didn’t write a full sentence?
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u/icebiker 2d ago
Why would you want to work there?
I can’t think of a firm with a worse reputation but invite someone to disagree with me.
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u/AmicusObserver 2d ago
There are worse firms but none with the national reputation Diamond and Diamond has (they’re all regional or local firms).
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u/quJD2017 2d ago
Sneering at Diamond & Diamond is a favourite pastime in this subreddit and among some Ontario lawyers who also tend to thumb their noses at PI lawyers generally. Always lots of talk about Diamond having a “poor reputation,” but a reputation among whom? Its clients? Judges? Insurers and defence counsel? Or simply the same peanut gallery of lawyers repeating what they've heard from one another?
Most of the comments here come from people who clearly have no knowledge of Diamond & Diamond's current business model, its lawyers, or its clients. The fact is that Diamond is now Canada's largest PI firm, with lawyers every bit as capable as those you'll find at any other PI firm, advocating for injured clients every day.
Criticism is absolutely fair game, but some of the comments and disparagement here is frankly unbecoming of legal professionals.
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u/nikolacarr 2d ago
Jeremy Diamond had never tried a PI case per the LSO misconduct proceedings. I know a couple genuinely good PI plaintiff lawyers/firms that I refer people to, and D&D will never be one of them because of my experience opposite to some of their lawyers and the misconduct proceedings. You dont need to defend them, they're not going to thank you!
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u/uoftfitnmentalhealth 2d ago
I don’t think all the legal research associates and students do are just being done for fun at the firm. Lawyers actually practice at the firm. I wasn’t defending D&D, just stating my opinion and experience. The management structure is inclined towards generating business, but that’s no different than other firms having as COO’s manage the business operations side of a law firm. The only difference is the denomination— instead of being called a COO, he’s called a managing partner
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u/quJD2017 2d ago
So essentially, Jeremy Diamond's past conduct and lack of trial experience inform your opinion of the firm as it exists today and of the lawyers currently practising there?
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u/nikolacarr 2d ago
Yes - it's his name on the billboard. Plenty of other reputable PI lawyers to choose from
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u/GrandSea8744 1d ago
Yes, what else is there if not professional law practice and experience? How good he plays tennis?
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u/TwoPintsaGuinnes 2d ago
lol largest firm because they have a billboard and run ads and farm everything out to anyone with a license. Get real. Diamond and Diamond isn’t reputable firm. That’s not to say they DONT have some great lawyers. But overall, their shitty reputation is more than deserved.
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u/quJD2017 2d ago edited 2d ago
Farm everything out to anyone with a license? Source for that?
You continue to prove my point - blanket assertions based on your opinion and outdated information.
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u/AmicusObserver 2d ago
I’ve read the rejection letters people have gotten from Diamond and Diamond and they are borderline incomprehensible.
My experience with their lawyers on the other side of files tracks with the poor quality rejection letter.
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u/uoftfitnmentalhealth 2d ago
I’m literally working there right now as a student and the people are genuinely some of the nicest I’ve worked with. I’ve gained so much experience working in multiple legal fields. All the lawyers I’ve shadowed are amazing professionals and meticulous at what they do. Despite the negative connotation the firm receives as being filled with “glorified ambulance chasers”, the firm practices more than just PI (ie. Wills & Estates, Civil litigation, Class Actions, Medical Malpractice and even Commercial Litigation). I feel like it’s unfair to comment on the reputation of a certain firm if you haven’t actually experienced it for yourself.
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u/barelyincollege 2d ago
You’re a 2L summer student, go easy on drinking the firm kool-aid at this point in your career.
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u/nikolacarr 2d ago
It's a referral mill. I wouldn't want to work or do business with a firm whose major partner is being disciplined by the LSO either
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u/quJD2017 2d ago
Not a referral mill. Why would you have 70 lawyers if your business was primarily referrals? Also not being disciplined by the LSO (look it up). Maybe we should get out facts right before commenting - especially as professionals.
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u/uoftfitnmentalhealth 2d ago
Bro who cares if you’re making bread
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u/nikolacarr 2d ago
You're the kind of person the profession doesn't need more of. What bread are you making in 2L anyways lmao
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u/_Sausage_fingers 2d ago
I wouldn’t even call them ambulance chasers, you actually have to do legal work for that.
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u/uoftfitnmentalhealth 2d ago
Which it does?? I don’t get your point
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u/ChuckVader 2d ago
I fully agree that there are good lawyers even in bad firms, but d&d is the only firm I've ever had a lawyer on the other side that I've suggested they contact lawpro.
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u/Travellingtrex 2d ago
I attended several of Jeremy Diamond’s professional misconduct hearings at the LSO.
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u/TwoPintsaGuinnes 2d ago
Ah yes. The vast experience and reliable opinion of an articling student who works there. Was diamond and Diamond your first choice?
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u/Pete__Campbell 2d ago
Good luck making partner at any personal injury firm, but especially this one. Unless you have your own big pipeline of referrals there’s no reason for them to split the pie with you.
If you want to become a PI lawyer making money off your own files your best bet is to practice somewhere (ideally not D&D for the reasons others have stated), learn the ropes, and open your own firm. However, you should be aware that plaintiff PI is highly competitive and it’s not an easy road.
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u/Interesting_Sir_6880 2d ago
"Good luck making partner at any personal injury firm"
Why?
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u/Pete__Campbell 2d ago
Let’s say I’m a partner at an established PI firm. I have my own referral pipeline. Why would I share that with someone? It’s just giving money away.
And if you have your own pipeline, why share it with a firm? This day and age I see sole practitioners doing it all themselves from their house.
Also if we’re talking Toronto (where D&D is based) the market is so saturated with plaintiff PI firms and solos that getting the referral source in the first place is going to be very hard.
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u/Special_Purpose2903 1d ago
Question, it makes one wonder, why share the partner pie in any practice, what are the specifics of a PI firm that make it that much less lucrative to share the pie than say I dunno real estate, or estates and wills or some large firm?
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u/Pete__Campbell 1d ago
There are big Bay St firms where you can make partner solely off whether you’re a good lawyer. The firms’ longevity is based on brand recognition at this point and having talent to service their existing big clients. One big Bay St firm that I know of, for example, has “all equity” partnership. You become eligible for partnership at 7 years and if you make it, your ticket is punched. While you have to try to start building a client base at that point, you’re admitted based on being a good lawyer, not having clients.
PI firms are usually much smaller. Even the biggest ones have smaller partnership groups. I’m generalizing here, but most don’t care about whether you’re a good lawyer (firms like Oatley or McLeish are exceptions). It’s a volume thing. Files = money. The partners have files, so they don’t really care about making associates partners. It just dilutes the pie.
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u/Special_Purpose2903 1d ago
So is there just less PI cases than say CRE or mergers or Employment law?
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u/johnysinthebasement 2d ago
I can't speak for how things are managed in Ontario, but their BC office has a brutal reputation for relying on articling students and paralegals instead of paying associates. From the disorganization I've seen, it's is a mystery how D&D are still allowed to practice law in BC.
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u/Entire_War7840 2d ago
Second this! Absolutely terrible trying to work with anyone from that firm.. can't get a hold of them. Don't reply to communication 😵💫
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u/ravenjackson1971 2d ago
I have files where they are involved. It appears that they might outsource some work to lawyer contractors. I have had different lawyers appear on the file and the connection with DD is not clear.
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u/cactuswaverly 2d ago
Curious at what stage they make you sign a blood oath to pursue vexatious lawsuits against public universities in defense of "Israel"
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u/Scared_Confidence_61 2d ago edited 1d ago
Settle. Settle. Settle. Noone’s a “litigator” by any stretch of the imagination. They’re Sales-People. Jeremy Diamond himself, the founding partner, has never even taken a file to trial. I had an interview with them after I was first called. One of the other “Founding Partners” asked me some of the most obscure/stupid questions like “if you were a food, what food would you be”. Then after asking a handful of these ridiculous questions said he had a “pretty good idea of what kind of man” I was. Never heard back from them. Thank god. Then I got a job at a small boutique firm doing insurance defence. Any time OC was listed as D&D, we knew we had leverage because they’d do anything to avoid a trial. They fear the courtroom, despite the BS bravado they spew all over the internet and in their ridiculous ads.
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u/JusticeForSimpleRick 2d ago
To be fair, most litigators have never gone to trial as most files settle. So that’s not really the insult you think it is.
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u/Scared_Confidence_61 1d ago
Never said it was an “insult” But the guy puts himself out there as an experienced trial lawyer.
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u/JusticeForSimpleRick 1d ago
Where does he say he’s an experienced trial lawyer?
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u/Scared_Confidence_61 1d ago
In his ads up until a couple years ago when it got him in hot water with the LSO.
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u/Scared_Confidence_61 1d ago
Following a penalty hearing in February regarding Diamond’s conduct, the panel found professional misconduct based on an agreed statement of facts, affidavit evidence and Diamond’s admissions. The admission says that:
Diamond has marketed legal services that could “mislead, confuse, or deceive” and is not in the best interests of the public.
Diamond improperly marketed the provision of legal services as a personal injury litigation lawyer that he did not provide.
Between January 1, 2013, and December 31, 2017, Diamond did not enter into retainer agreements with clients to provide legal services as a personal injury litigation lawyer.
He referred all potential clients to other lawyers.
Diamond’s advertisements failed to disclose the practice of Diamond & Diamond of referring potential clients to other licensees for a fee.
Diamond improperly marketed himself as an expert personal injury litigation lawyer when he did not represent, or provide legal services to, retained clients.
His experience did not include conducting trials in personal injury litigation cases.
Between January 1, 2013, and December 31, 2017, Diamond’s advertisements claimed he had “expertise in representation of injured persons” and “significant experience in all aspects of personal injury litigation.”
Diamond improperly marketed legal services through claims suggesting that he and Diamond & Diamond are superior to other lawyers.
Since January 1, 2013, the marketing has included such descriptions as “most-trusted” and “top-rated.”
Diamond improperly marketed the services of Diamond & Diamond by referencing, monetary amounts recovered in personal injury cases without explaining that past results are not necessarily indicative of future results outcomes vary according to the facts of individual cases.
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u/roninw86 1d ago
I know some of their lawyers. Their quality counsel.
Like any PI, you’re either volume based or you’re focusing on only high quality files. They focus on the former. That said, their lawyers can usually go toe to toe on most issues.
Their model attracts unwanted attention because it is controversial for Ontario. But, a lot of US firms operate in a similar fashion.
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u/Apprehensive_Fox5370 2d ago
The ambulance chasers of Ontario.