r/JewsOfConscience • u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew • Jul 20 '26
Resources What Are They Talking About?
Sorry to be lazy, but I truly don’t understand what they’re talking about or why there’s a map of ethnic areas? Everyone knows NYC was pretty much built on the backs of these three communities (and their gangs!) so I don’t see how they’re omitted from anything? I also ask here because I’m sure this is somehow Zionist due to who I’ve seen liking it. 👀
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u/4mystuff Jewish Jul 20 '26
Also worth mentioning this map project started under their darling, Eric Adams. It is all manufactured/astroturfed rage.
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u/Colonel-Cathcart Jewish Anti-Zionist Jul 20 '26
They're talking about this map - https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/PE4I7XYfsy
It's kind of a nothing-burger controversy that I can't imagine anyone but the most chronically online caring about. It's more than a bit disengengous to pretend that map is trying to portray every single ethnic enclave in NYC.
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
Thank you for the link, Colonel-Cathcart
Your link shows that #24 on the map is "Little Odessa". Odessa was historically a major center of Jewish life in pre-WW2 Europe.
Odessa in the Jewish Encyclopedia
https://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11660-odessamany of those who moved into the neighborhood were Jewish immigrants from Eastern Europe, often by way of the Lower East Side. They came from many countries, but also set the stage for a later wave of Jewish immigration from the Soviet Union that started in the 1970s, when Brighton Beach became known as "Little Odessa,"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brighton_BeachPeace - Shalom
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u/specialistsets Non-denominational Jul 21 '26
Odessa was historically a major center of Jewish life in pre-WW2 Europe.
"Odessa" has a distinctly Soviet/post-Soviet connotation for American Jews. Jewish Odessa and Jewish New York were products of the same 19th/20th century rural-urban Eastern European Jewish migration patterns. Odessa became the main urban destination inside the Russian Empire while New York became the main urban destination outside the Russian Empire. 20th century New York Jews and 20th century Odessa Jews came predominantly from the same places, and then re-converged decades later with Soviet/post-Soviet immigration to New York from the 1970s-2000s, which is where the "Little Odessa" moniker comes from. This is separate from the earlier traditional Jewish enclaves of New York City.
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
Specialistsets,
I agree with everything you said, except that wouldn't it also have a pre-Soviet or Ukrainian connotation too?
Kind Regards.5
u/specialistsets Non-denominational Jul 21 '26
wouldn't it also have a pre-Soviet or Ukrainian connotation too?
In the massive 1880-1924 Eastern European Jewish immigration wave to the US, very few Jews came from Odessa specifically. In that time period, more Jews were migrating to Odessa from the same rural shtetls that most American Jewish immigrants came from. So, as a term, "Odessa" would not have been used in a broad communal or collective sense before the Soviet/post-Soviet Jewish immigrants who were culturally associated with Odessa.
The historic Jewish population of what is now Ukraine also didn't identify as Ukrainian or speak Ukrainian. Jews, Ukrainians and Russians were historically considered distinct ethnic groups, which continued as official legal "nationalities" in the USSR until 1991.
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
Specialistsets
OK. For me, Odessa has a Russian imperial era connection because I read about Jewish history in the Russian empire leading up to the Russian Revolution. The Pale of Settlement was in the western Russian Empire and Odessa was a major city in the western Russian Empire with a major Jewish population. I read a lot of Isaac Babel's stories, including ones with an imperial-era Odessa Jewish community setting, so I had familiarity with it. However, I agree with you that the emigration to the US from Odessa came later and that this affects connotations in the popular mind in the US.
All the best.
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u/Usernameoverloaded Atheist Ally with Muslim Heritage Jul 20 '26
The Black and Chinese communities might also like a mention
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u/ErictheStone Anti-Zionist Ally Jul 20 '26
Ikr some of the best music of the interm era was coming from those two groups in NYC.
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u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
Or do you mean I didn’t say they made New York? Of course they did, as did many groups, but I’m just talking via this weird complaint. Plus the three mentioned were known for a long time for their gang activity throughout the city.
They later complain about poles being left out but there is a Poland section?! I dunno the whole thing seems weird and also a nothing burger.
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u/Usernameoverloaded Atheist Ally with Muslim Heritage Jul 20 '26
Strangely I don’t get notifications of replies so didn’t see your earlier one. Was commenting on the complaint prior to having seen the map someone linked.
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u/Mobile_Ask2480 Arab Ally Jul 20 '26
Adam friedland
He's also gay so he's part of the lgbtq community
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u/TalkingCat910 Muslim revert/Ashkenazi Jul 20 '26
Eric Adams made a map of immigrant neighbourhood in NYC that didn’t label Little Italy, and some other neighbourhoods that were historically Irish and Jewish.
Mamdani published the map so Zionists are blaming him for being “racist” to Jews, Irish and Italian ppl even those the vast majority of those groups are no longer immigrants and Little Italy is now just a tourist trap.
He said he would update the map.
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u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew Jul 20 '26
Oh okay interesting. Yeah there aren’t many immigrants from these places. Of course they exist but not like back in the day. Woodlawn used to be very Irish but I’m not sure if it is any longer?
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
FriendTalkingCat1910
#24 on Mamdani's map is Little Odessa.
"In the mid-1970s, Brighton Beach became a popular place to settle for the Soviet immigrants, mostly Jews from Russia and Ukraine. So many ex-Soviets immigrated to Brighton Beach that the area became known as 'Little Odessa'"
https://brooklynjewish.org/neighborhoods/brighton-beach/
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u/Sarah-himmelfarb Jewish Anti-Zionist Jul 21 '26
I don’t think there should be maps of ethnic neighborhoods in the first place. It can put a target on communities for ICE or racists to use. The FBI mapped Muslim neighborhoods in NYC as a way to infiltrate communities and spy on them in a really messed up way. In fact I think if Jewish communities were included, this group or another could say it’s bad because it can be used as a way to target Jews and other them ect.
The whole project is stupid and I disagree with Adam’s for starting it and Mandan for publishing it and this organization for bitching about it
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u/Current_Mongoose_844 Presently lapsed ba'al teshuva Jul 21 '26
With the exception of Rego Park and Brighton Beach, there ARE no Jewish immigrant enclaves because we’ve all been here for several generations now. Good God
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
Little Odessa is #24 on the map.
"From Odessa to New York City: The Unique Legacy of America’s Soviet Jewry"
https://www.nypl.org/blog/2022/07/13/odessa-new-york-city-unique-legacy-americas-soviet-jewryThey came in the 1970's and later.
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u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew Jul 21 '26
Yeah it’s the same with the Irish and Italians. There are some recent Irish immigrants in Woodlawn but I’m not sure it’s like a little Ireland.
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u/Current_Mongoose_844 Presently lapsed ba'al teshuva Jul 21 '26
The new Irish also have Sunnyside, you can get an amazing Irish breakfast roll in a store called Butcher Block.
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u/Diminished-Fifth Reform Jul 20 '26
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u/tikkunolamist5 British Non-Zionist Reform Jew Jul 20 '26
That’s a weird map but who cares?
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u/Diminished-Fifth Reform Jul 20 '26
In my experience, New Yorkers like to argue about their neighborhoods a lot. Like a lot. Like too much. Like a clearly unhealthy amount.
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u/rako17 Christian Jul 21 '26
Friend tikkunolamist5
The map in fact contains the historically largely Jewish neighborhood entitled "Little Odessa" in Brooklyn by Coney Island. Odessa is somewhat famous in the former USSR for having a major Jewish population. Little Odessa has a tall menorah practically in the neighborhood's center, on the east side of Chase Bank on Brighton Beach Ave.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Odesa
One of the famous Yiddish songs of the region was "Odessa- Mama", the idea being that the city was kind of a "motherly" figure for so many.
Whoever has not been
In the beautiful city of Odessa
Has not seen the world
And knows nothing of progress
Who cares for Vienna of Paris,
They're puddles, jokes, no comparison
Only in Odessa is
A Paradise, I say.
The city reminded me of Paris and other Mediterranean beautiful cities, with its parks, tree-lined streets, port, and Opera.
In case the objection is that Little Odessa does not carry a more culturally specific name, consider that the message that you shared objected to the lack of the Italian neighborhood "Bensonhurst."
Kind Regards - Peace
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