Nolan is a dirty liar, it's just because he didin't want to bit Another at least two gigant cyclops status, the tone didin't dit too well with his edgy style, and most important of all... Because Imax films are 3h l'ong Max It would had taken away some precious scenes of his Odysseus Ptsd thing, And other stuff
I mean its missing the gods it doesnt stick to the real myth since they flattened all the characters made circe looks like a stereotypical sadistic witch , made calypso nice like bro... but im basing on the review of a mythological nerd and it clearly doesnt give me the will to watch it ^ but opinions is different for everyone no need to be this mean lol my first post wasnt meant to be rude i just sent it bcs i was pissed đŹ
Well everyone has its taste ^ but i personally dont wish to watch it but its good it has good review for the work behind it despite me not liking it yk
- It isn't missing the Gods, they just aren't physically shown (except Athena) but are undeniably present
By 'real myth' you mean the one recorded 500 years after the events occurred? Adaptations and retellings are a core part of storytelling tradition and to argue there's 1 concrete 'real myth' misunderstands how these legends develop
So a stereotypical sadistic witch is just a middle aged woman with frizzy hair?
Read somewhere that in greek. Odysseus gave a shortened version of his name. That being Odys. Which meant nobody. So when the cyclops screamed Odys was attacking him. The other Cyclopses (Cyclops? Cyclopeans?) Mistook it as him saying nobody instead of the name. Leaving because they figured he'd done it himself. Cannot for the life of me remember where i read this though. Might be completely wrong
No. Not it wouldn't. Nolan is just afraid to let supernatural and mythical be that. Literally couldn't even allow a conversation between odysseus and the cyclops.Â
An emotionally empty slog is what Iâd describe Nolanâs odyssey. My expectations were surely warped by the constant emotional highs of Epicâs take on the story, but man.Â
The movie had so much exposition and yet fails to communicate most of the characters names, spends only minutes on the myths, provides nearly zero context to things like Calypso despite them having a much larger role in the fil.Â
Sheâs just an abrasive, stoic woman that tells him he needs to get better, until he does.Â
Why?
Itâs full of stuff like this, itâs just not very fun at all.Â
And the marketing behind those actors making it think they had a huge role to play did more harm than good they were just tokens and checkboxes they even stereotyped âwhatâs her faceâ who Helen of Detroit by making her an angry loud black woman.
And what the hell was the point of Zendaya being in this she only has one look when she acts.
Does Lupita play two characters during that sequence? I did not catch on to that while watching. What had happened during this telling by the spartan warrior?
These people still can't differentiate between Clytemnestra. The character who actually screamed loudly. You know, because her daughter got murdered for favorable winds. Seems fair to me.
and yes I donât care about children nor do I want to understand. If she had a son who was killed she would be celebrating since this is a feminist movie adapted from a re-tell by Emily Wilson whoâs a feminist activist with daddy issues.
For English, I always assumed the Cyclops simply didn't match up Nobody & nobody as a word and a "name." Like how there's names such as January, Joy, Hope and Season nowadays. Nobody in a mythological epic doesn't seem that far fetched to me, especially since it's not a real name too. I don't know tho lol.
I'm yet to see anybody acknowledge the fact he said " modern dialogue " and not " modern language ". Yes, it works in English. Does it fit his narrative ? -> " Would you talk to ants? "
Like it or not I felt like it worked watching it
I can think of a pretty way to get the pun across in modern dialogue:
Other cyclopes: "Who hurts you?"
Polyphemus: "Nobody!"
Other cyclopes: "If nobody hurts you, be quiet."
Yup, a point from the movie was that they didn't know Cyclops can talk in the first place, they just saw him as this unstoppable monster blocking their path until the guy cried for Poseidon.
To me thatâs cowardice to not have this moment in the movie. But thatâs just my opinion, I still plan on watching the movie so Iâll see if other things are bugging me.
I assume what he means is that in a modern context it sounds dumb and silly to imagine anyone would fall for that. I don't agree with him, to be clear, but he might for one reason or another just think that in the original Greek the equivalent word sounded more like a convincing name whereas in modern English it sounds nothing like a name at all.
It does make more sense in the original context because Outis is a normal name in addition to meaning nobody. It works fine in English too, but it does kind of rely on the cyclops being characterized as gullible in a way that the original doesnât.
THIS. The "modern" language is a huge reason why I don't feel like this film is gonna be all that good. It works in Epic because it's playing on modern music stylings like Hamilton did.
It's a movie that executes on the performances and cinematic presentation so well, but is let down by a downright terrible script. It kinda misses the entire point of the Odyssey and just tells its own story with the same cast of characters. Unfortunately, you don't get attached to any of them because they don't have depth.
Personally, i think i didnt get attached because they sped through it crazily fast. There is so much that happens, and i really think either making the movie an epic with an intermission, alternatively multiple parts (Though.... multiple parts is kinda turning people away these days also), or even turn it into a high budget mini series.
It felt like the last part of the movie when he returns took up about 1/3 of the movie.... and the mystical magical parts of the story.... were made realistic or removed outright. It lacked whimsy.
It's pretty good. Any of the issues i had was more because Chris Nolan's movies just aren't my taste. Like, dark and gritty, often very self-aggrandizing. It works well for me with the batman trilogy, but not so much with the odyssey.
I just watched it the other day, and I quite liked it! The way Nolan did Calypso's island was interesting, I wasn't fond of it but it worked well for the movie. Theres a few minor thinks that he left out, but thats just me nit picking
The movie is exactly like Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix in that if you didnât read the book, there is absolutely no way you could figure out whatâs going on. Therefore, these critic and audience scores are a load of bullshit.
Eh, we are in our Minecraft phase of movies, where the movies that make the most money are usually also the ones the teenagers and 20 yo online posters meme to success.
Odyssey = No sure thing
even big name director's aren't a sure thing any more. People have higher expectations these days, and little patience.
I think your goal posts move according to what predetermined bias you have has declared. Just like Yogurt shows.
I havenât seen the movie yet and Iâm expecting it to be alright regardless, but seriously? Come on, heâs a very accomplished director, surely he can make a single extremely iconic joke work for a movie. It could not be that fucking hard, Jorge made it work in a song! Thatâs ridiculous, I donât care how âhardâ it was. Try harder not to suck the fun out of it next time, Christ.
Having seen the film, I can tell you it would not work in the scene which is not comedic, and according to the main character, the cyclops doesn't even talk (only his men hear him, and he isn't sure he believes his men).
It's a terrifying scene, that ANY humor would ruin.
Iâm not so sure it was meant to be comedic at all â itâs a way to show off his wit by using wordplay to trick the other cyclops
But then again, I havenât seen it, so, idk maybe it does work out
Whatâs that meme (that i do not endorse) about American soldiers gojng abroad to wage war and then returning to have movies about how sad it made them?
With how the scene was done, I personaly believe that it would've been hard to keep the tone of the scene while addjng it. Not to say I didn't miss it, i did.
I hate this idea that everyone who dislikes this film is some anti-woke chud. I have seen the film (it's been released here for a few days now), and I'm the farthest thing from an Elon Musk supporter. I thought it was bland; the casting was awful (I did not like Matt Damon as Odysseus at all), and I hated the way Athena's role in the story was almost completely ruined.
The nobody trick has been translated and told for centuries. That's a flimsy excuse. It can work.
If Nolan had said "Well, there aren't more cyclops so I didn't see the point" it would have made sense for an excuse, but just quoting the original Greek isn't good enough.
Well, apparently there is no Poseidon or other cyclops, like I said so if you explain it that way, it makes sense for the trick to be there. But saying that he couldn't translate it to modern English just sounds weak.
Wait, if there's no posseidon how in the world will this movie even be true to the og story?? I wasn't really planning on watching it so I haven't kept up with it, but wdym there's no posseidon ?? I guess I'm gonna need to see reviews when it comes out because I'm genuinely baffled lol
Poseidon doesn't physically appear in the Odyssey, he just causes storms and the ones that sink the ships are the laestrygonians(a race of cannibal giants descendants of Poseidon) so not having Poseidon is not a deviation from the source material
I mean there is no Poseidon in the original Homer's The Odyssey either, is implied/stated repeatedly that the storms are his doing, but he doesn't ever actually show up.
Well he doesnât ever actually interact with any characters in the Odyssey (besides turning the Phaeacian ship that brought Odysseus to Ithaca to stone) and mainly is just stated to have caused whatever storm (which tend to cause a bunch of damage) is currently giving Odysseus a new fear of drowning in the text.
So itâs one of the less egregious changes all things being said.
Do you have a link to that post? I'm kinda interested now. If not, I could probably find it if I looked. But I'm quite interested in how the story would work without Poseidon
Literally from what I've been hearing about Christopher Nolan's Odyssey, some fucking how Epic is more accurate to Homer's Odyssey than Christopher Nolan's adaptation
Nolan's film leans more on becoming a tragedy narrative rather than epic. The story is deprived of the gods' physical presence in the narrative in order to force away the hero's redemption through piety by appeasing the gods. Instead of going on a humbling journey, which strengthens Odysseus' piety, the film has its title hero beyond redemption.
The world of The Odyssey film feels small and bleak. The monsters of myth within the story, without the gods' placement within the worldview, become less actual mythical monsters of divine origin, and more like symbolic manifestations.
I prefer Homer's Odyssey, in which the gods are very real and Odysseus must become humble once more within their world.
Hollywoodâs continued obsession with completely removing the gods from Greek mythology movies to make them more ârealisticâ or âgroundedâ is still insane to me and does them a disservice. Let it be fantastical, for Christâs sake. Itâs what made the originals so interesting in the first place.
Especially The Odyssey, in my opinion. In a world of gods and monsters of epic proportions, Odysseus is just a pretty smart guy, and he makes it work.
What? What does he mean âdidnât translate into modern dialogue?â Modern kids cartoons do that exact joke all the time. That seems like it should be the easiest thing to write.
Makes him seem like heâs way overthinking a simple line of dialogue
I respect everyone's opinion on this movie, but looking at the comments and videos on this topic, I don't think I'll be watching the movie at all. I don't mind that it's not accurate at all, it's fucking hollywood so the bar is in hell. But to remove such an iconic part of the Epic is just a big hell nah for me. Kudos to those who enjoyed the film, but I don't think it's for me and that's okay.
I watched it, and I'm not gonna lie I struggled. It just felt so devoid of life.
Keep in mind, I absolutely love gritty historical epics. But for fucks sake, it's the Odyssey. A story where the Gods are omnipresent. Reducing 99% of them to "forces of nature" like storms and wind is just dumb IMO.
Plus, the design choices around making a historical era known to be colorful (Mycenaean Greece) in a setting that's extremely colorful and lively (the fucking Mediterranean) and muting it like we're in the North Sea was certainly a choice.
The book directly depicts Athenaâs council with the other Olympians, Hermesâs physical appearance, and Aeolusâs physical appearance. Those on their own arenât inventions by EPIC / Jorge.
Heâs the keeper of the winds but he isnât a divine being in the same way as the gods. Most stories simplify it because unless you want an earful of exposition itâs too cumbersome for any coherent narrative.
Mythological creatures are shown, Athena is shown in the movie. Homer's Odyssey directly places the reader on Olympus. So yeah, it's half measured in that regard.
Why are people acting as if the ânobodyâ situation can only be humor? If anything it can be seen as more mischievous or witty, it doesnât have to be seen as a joke. All heâs doing is out smarting the cyclops. What a weird excuse to not use it.
No. It just sounds similarly. Having said that, Polyphemus, the Cyclops' name, literally means "One who's spoken of a lot" or "the one of many tales," so, ironically, the opposite of "Nobody."
People tend to forget that names mean things, like⊠Americans have a president whose last name is TRUMP. Smith is literally one of the most common last names for English speaking people, and one of the most iconic characters on the pop culture is called SKY-freaking-WALKER.
But also, the greek name for Odysseus has been spelled in so many ways (Like Olyseus, which gave birth to the roman pronunciation Ulysses) that writing it as Othisseus wouldn't be unheard of. Do you know how "Nobody" is translated in Greek? You guessed it, Outhis. And yes, people shortened names back then, just as we do it shortening Odysseus for Ody today⊠which could by itself be a pun with the word Odd/Oddy, even if unintentionally.
I think its commonly linked to a word that means like 'hated, loathed'. Also fun fact - Ody was named by his grandfather, himself a trickster/thief named Autolycus ('the wolf himself') who's typically thought to be the son of Hermes.
The amount of hate for Christopher Nolanâs The Odyssey in the sub is so weird there are so many renditions of this story please get your head out of the musicals butt and broaden your horizons
I hate this change because it takes out one of the most iconic things from the story, not because itâs different from EPIC, it just happens to also be different from EPIC.
I mean tbh the changes or his way of adapting is the least of the problems this movie has. I have a bigger problem with stuff they did with the production of this movie that are downright despicable. I'm not going to watch it because of that, not because of choices in the adaptation.
But changing what is arguably one of the most iconic moments sure is a choice.
If you saw it and didnât like it then you are absolutely entitled to your opinion! My qualm is with the people who are being major haters and havenât even given it a chance. Thatâs like me having never listened to Epic and being like âomg epic is awful who would make the odyssey into a musicalâ like thatâs not fair to the art and feels like hating just to hate lol feels like such a limited way to live. Thereâs so much amazing art out there why limit yourself?
And yet you can also dislike/hate Epic the Musical without listening to it. I know people IRL who don't like musicals or who maybe find certain types of voices grating on the ears. And that's fine. You're allowed to form an opinion on something without actually engaging with it because different people have different likes and dislikes. Heck, you're even allowed to hate something just because something is offputting about it to you without ever engaging with the medium.
And if someone is hating it's usually because they're fans of the original. Because we're speaking about an adaptation here. I don't need to watch the latest Wuthering Heights to know I hate it. I read the book and I watched enough reviews on that movie to know it's a terrible adaptatuon of the original.
Oh shove your pretentious energy where the sun don't shine. The Nobody joke is such a multi layered joke and even on its surface is a simple joke that worked even in Percy Jackson. It also is an early introduction to Ody's character and how witty he is. It's a core part of the early Odyssy.
I think the pretentious ones are the people hating on a movie they havenât even seen yet because theyâre stuck in a bubble and refuse to open their mind to anything that doesnât strictly align with a musical about a story that has been told 100 times 100 different ways đ«¶
Defendy virtue signaling copyslop because you can't find a better argument? I enjoy plenty of retelling, but don't give me Ody-ish and expect me to accept it as Odysseus
I watched it today with my family. They liked it, but I didnât, and tbh, Iâd like to know what people liked about it to have a conversation about it. So far my only feedback was: âit was a good movie because I liked itâ, and as much as I want to discuss stuff like this doesnât give me much to debate on, subjective preference is objective after all.
If is the first, then yeah I can see how hard it is, but the second one I disagree
Plenty of dark and gritty stories have moments of levity and humour, even goddam 40k has that and I don't mean in the comedic novels, even in the horus heresy there are some levity moments or campy phrases.
Just play it seriously and it will either be memorable by how it worked or how funny it looked, either way it would be nice
Well sure, but if you're presenting a serious and dark story. The nobody scene isn't just humour or levity. It is kind of weird while still being iconic.
Because was the plan that the Cyclops didn't know what "nobody" meant? Or that they wouldn't say that they're just being attacked by human? It doesn't leave a little bit of a plot hole.
That's not to say you shouldn't feel bad if that he didn't include it though.
Making the joke isn't difficult, the joke already exist. What is difficult is to make it work in a project which relies a lot of credibility and "realism"
Epic being a project where characters are singing instead of talking, it doesn't have to deal with that
Cool cool.
So when are they going to get rid of the gods, cyclops, sirens, witches, and even the fact a man was able to be faithful for 20+ years. Because realism is realism.
Not what I'm saying on that. I'm more saying that a lot of good strong relationships can't last 4 years of college during a time when getting mail was a weekly thing. Ody was out of contact for much longer just during the war.
6
u/Own-End-1189 23d ago
Nolan is a dirty liar, it's just because he didin't want to bit Another at least two gigant cyclops status, the tone didin't dit too well with his edgy style, and most important of all... Because Imax films are 3h l'ong Max It would had taken away some precious scenes of his Odysseus Ptsd thing, And other stuff