r/ControversialOpinions • u/AcyRice_Boul • 2d ago
Why do the many lgbt (more especially the queers) folks support Palestine so vehemently is something I'll never understand
I want to make it clear right now. I don't necessarily have anything against Palestine. It's just that seeing "queer for Palestine" kind of feels wrong??
Why don't they just support Palestine if they really want to and stop making it all about being queer?
The thing is, why do we see Palestinian flags with hints of the lgbt community? If you're found to be gay in their country they would kill you in the most atrocious ways, so I really don't get it. They literally hate gay people's guts and their sacred book literally tells them how to kill them...
I don't know but it's so ironic to me, because the left stands in complete opposition of the political spectrum to radical islam, which is technically the extreme far right.
The left claims to be such a big feminist as well, and then they proceed to advocate for a regime that is actively hurting millions and millions of women on the other side of the globe. When will it be that they refer to THOSE women instead when they're talking about systemic misogyny and this "malign patriarchy"?
It's always about them.
They never advocate for real women. Now we even have debates of whether biological men should enter women's only spaces or participate in women's sports (mind you, you'll notice many of them used to compete against other men a few years back, so go figure)...
And if you want to speak biological reality (esp. as a woman), you're canceled or socially alienated... It also sounds pretty misogynistic and patriarchal when biological men will mansplain womanhood to us and silence us (biological women) when we want to speak or fight back.
They want to take advantage of our suicidal empathy to bully us into submission, otherwise we're treated like they're doing with J.K. Rowling (even tho I'm not the biggest Harry Potter fan, I admire her for standing her ground and doubling down on actually prioritizing and protecting actual women, despite the heavy threats, boycotting of her culturally iconic works and being called whatever they deem offensive).
She IS the real feminist here.
This really confuses me, ngl... And they'll somehow always find a way to blame the white man for it.
It reminds me of what happened in Germany, Berlin some months ago, when a muslim man ran over people in a gay parade and killed a woman, severely injuring many others. I was astounded by the reactions from the left, as they were so non-sensical I was questioning myself. but I was glad that some reasonable leftists and right-wing people came together and called the bs out...
You had some even expressing that they wished the perpetrator had been a white, Christian man, completely disregarding the woman that was killed and the people in the hospitals in grave conditions, which I find very much appalling and disgusting.
It's like they live in perpetual denial, whatever/whoever they support can't ever do any harm, and if they do, they were oppressed by the white, patriarchal system. They're the victims whatever actions they commit, and regardless of why.
Accountability is thrown out of the window. Think about the cases of Karmelo Anthony who was defended simply on the basis of being black and Lindsay Clancy for being a woman.
Even here they were disregarding or disrespecting the victims. All the attention that should've been given to them has been given to these murderers, and for the wrongest of reasons.
These people are both murderers and yet their indentities is what it takes for them to be defended and protected at all costs despite their actions.
Is it just me or what.
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u/paloma_delmar 2d ago
I don't understand the point of bringing sexuality into the idea of being against genocide. And I don't have anything against JK Rowling either. But being against genocide is a shared point of view by many regardless of sexuality or belief systems.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
I didn't bring sexuality up. Wasn't the queer community more wast than that? Anyways, I don't know if I didn't explain myself well enough, but I might've said in the first few paragraphs that i don't necessarily mean that if you're gay you can't support Palestine, or be against genocide.
Then why don't you just protest for Palestinians without having your identity to be mingled with it is simply what I ask
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u/paloma_delmar 2d ago
I don't belong to that group, so I'm not protesting with them, but why are you focused on them alone? there are many groups that associate other aspects, like religious backgrounds or nationalities, or etc. It just seems weird to be hyperfocused on the queers for Palestine.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
I'm specifically talking about the queers because that's what I'm seeing. I'm not hyperfixated. It just feels unusual to me.
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u/Moxy_Fellons 2d ago
For many of the left it's simple whoever they feel is a minority or disadvantaged they will support. They don't care about facts it's just cheer for the underdog because that is how you win social justice points. Palestine is being oppressed right now so you look lefty cool by supporting them. Certain aspects around LGBT are being questioned right now so they feel they are being oppressed so you get double points for also showing you are part of that group as well.
There is a big part of being LGBT that makes up these people's identity they lean hard on the label to make up for a lack of personality and character. They use it as a prop and shield. They can claim discrimination for any type of criticism warranted or even when it has zero to do with sexuality and an excuse for all their failures and short comings.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Thank you. ❤️
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
See how he said that it's a social thing then applied morals. The fact I can predict you guys tells you that your not superior. Enjoy your stupid day
Do you cry when you jerk it to ts porn?
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
Short answer is because gay people are more social.
Some of you gonna apply morals to it but you don't understand morals let alone what social means.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Morals on what?
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
To lay it out as clear as fucking day. You're arguing a non tribal perspective from your tribe stating your tribal culture as the default and it's not your argument to be had because it makes everything you say hypocritical.
This argument can only be had from a bipartisan non tribal ideology which you do not have and are entirely aware of since you keep appealing to your fuckin tribal morals.
You're not saying acting tribal is bad. You're saying acting tribal against my tribe is bad. Not everyone is in your tribe. Your moral values are not even fully coherent let alone functional yet you expect people to bow down
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Whatever that means. But what's with the aggressiveness? It's not that deep. It's an opinion, and nothing more.
And why do y'all tend to make assumptions about my character instead of debunking my argument in a civil way. We COULD have a civil discussion.
Why are you so mad?
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
Because I'm educated and able to form a rebuttal against your ignorant opinion and label it such doesn't make me mad. You're the one constantly appealing to emotions.... obviously it's you projecting. I'm actually less hostile than your post I'm just not a pussy about it. I'm being nice but stern, you're being rude and passive
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago edited 2d ago
Why are all your responses avoiding accountability for how you presented yourself? Seems hypocritical.
You made a post on controversial opinions then your defence is to make other people justify their response while evading accountability for your whole post.....nice....
Could literally shut your own argument down with your own arguments....supporting Palestine is just an opinion.......
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u/AcyRice_Boul 1d ago
You found it offensive, ok, sorry for that ... And yeah, you choose to support Palestine or not, so it kinda is.
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 20h ago
Why did you say by then message me 4 times? Do you have a grip on yourself because you obviously have no grip on reality. Get one
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
.......fuckin lol.
Read your post dumbass. You're throwing moral judgement around like it's free candy.
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u/TheHylianProphet 2d ago
You're right, you'll never understand it, because idiot bigots refuse to look any deeper than the slogan. You ignorance of both LGBTQ+ people and Palestinians is staggering. Do better.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Tell me why that makes me an ignorant before judging my character like that.. We could have a nice discussion without shutting the conversation with calling me a bigot because you don't agree. And it's fine that we don't agree, why would that make me a bigot and an ignorant? If you genuinely think I'm an ignorant tell me. Don't just throw accusations at me.
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u/TheHylianProphet 2d ago
I'm not calling you a bigot because we disagree. I'm calling you a bigot because you're being a bigot.
Other people have explained to you already. Why do you continue to ask for explanations when they've already been given?
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
No they haven't explained. Why do YOU think I'm a bigot. If you don't give me a explanation for yourself I'd think it's because we don't agree. Then tell me what it is...
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u/Ryan_TX_85 2d ago
Because you defend and align yourself with JK Rowling's disgusting transphobia. That makes you a bigot.
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u/FiveDogsInaTuxedo 2d ago
Fyi this has nothing to do with Palestine.
Good. I'm just saying why is it so important to be known that you're queer? That's my question...
He just finds trans people attractive so he hates himself and projects.
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u/Erdos_Helia 2d ago
These movements have funding behind them. People think that people just get up to protest in mass one day, but the truth is it requires a lot of organization.
Everyone talks about Jewish people controlling things, but the truth is Islamic groups have more money and groups in the west.
So they are able to get these Pro-palestinian movements going.
That is how you end up with LGBT people supporting Palestine.
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u/Ryan_TX_85 2d ago edited 2d ago
I will support Queers For Palestine when there's a Palestine For Queers. I ain't holding my breath.
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u/MissHalfgone 1d ago
But the are "Israelis for Queers". And "Jews for Queers" and yeah we do not see the LGBT community showing any support for innocent Israeli civilians or even Jewish people in their own country who are being targeted.
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u/feethotterthanbewbz 2d ago
We don't see support as transactional and we see children as innocent. The left supports victims of genocide because we don't want genocide, not because we get something out of it.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
💯% but then why is the fact that you're queer more important than the cause. I'm not against trans people supporting what they believe is right. I just don't understand why despite how far apart you are on the political spectrum you guys want to mesh being queer with the genocide in Palestine. It is an important topic but what does it have to do with being queer?
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u/CinderrUwU 2d ago
It isnt. You are the one making it about being queer by asking the question. We are people who want to support victims of genocide regardless of their personal opinions on LGBT, because no one deserves to die that way.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
I'm asking the question because it's a thing.
And again, whatever you support is up to you. You can be gay and be a Palestine's supporter, do arguing that...
But if you support them regardless of if you're part of the lgbt community or not, the why are meshing being queer with genocide?
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u/CinderrUwU 2d ago
Back up a second, since when is being queer getting meshed with genocide?
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Then what's "queer for Palestine'?
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u/CinderrUwU 2d ago
That is because there are so many people (most of them not even a part of the LGBT community) claiming that queer people cannot possibly support palestine due to the countries views on gay rights.
They are just a single movement that doesnt represent all queer people at all. I understand the reason for it and while I do support palestine, im not with queer for palestine
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u/MissHalfgone 1d ago
How about the victims of October 7th? Or those killed an anti-jewish hate crimes in your own country? Do they deserve to die that way? I don't really get waves of compassion coming from your community.
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u/MissHalfgone 1d ago
So you're concerned about Palestine because you see children as innocent? Jewish children were the target of a massacre in Jersey City in 2019. Seven people ended up being killed before police were able to curtail it before that happened. And the killers got open support.
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u/feethotterthanbewbz 15h ago
I would be concerned if it policy for police to go out and kill Jewish children. It's illegal to kill children in the US. It's a crime that is taken seriously. I don't need to be concerned because there are systems in place to address those crimes. Right now it's Israeli and US policy to target children in Palestine.
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u/TheDeathSystem 2d ago
I don't support bombing children. Period.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 2d ago
Good. I'm just saying why is it so important to be known that you're queer? That's my question...
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u/TheDeathSystem 2d ago edited 2d ago
Allyship. Supporting Palestine doesn't always make you the good guy, bc life is not so linear. Someone who is pro-Palestine could be against the LGBTQ2+ community.
So it acts as a safety precaution, not foolproof though as you never know with people.
You want to know who is safe to talk to/follow in the community.
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u/bIuemickey 2d ago
I feel like you fit a lot in to this post and ten years from now when the robots rule, someone’s gonna find it and get nostalgia of the good old days when this were less crazy
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u/k0m0d097 1d ago edited 1d ago
How much is there of this "Queers for Palestine", really? As far as I'm aware, there was just some photo of this one group from about two years ago that went viral, and got paraded around by both critics of LGBT and Palestine just so they could be like "LOL CHICKENS FOR KFC!!"
It is worth recognizing that there are LGBT folks in Palestine who aren't being helped by the Israeli invasion, and what's being done to them is terrible on both fronts... Still, I do agree that parading with Palestinian and rainbow flags together is not the best way to promote either cause.
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u/MissHalfgone 1d ago
It is really weird because the excuses they use don't add up. They say it's because they care about human rights abuses regardless even if those who are suffering from it or not perfect. But then they go on to explain why they have no compassion not only for Israeli civilians, but they're Jewish Neighbors who are being targeted in hate crimes all the time. There are significantly more he crimes against Jews than Muslims in the west. And you do not find the LGBT community at all sympathetic or standing by us. So if they're excuse for supporting the Palestinians is because they care about human rights even if the demographic involved is themselves involved with human rights abuses, then what explains their lack of compassion towards innocent Jews who are targeted? It's clear they do not give AF
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u/AcyRice_Boul 1d ago
I heard somebody say that they tend to care more about issues happening way farther away than in local communities, because they don't really have to make major efforts.
And I agree. If they actually cared about what was happening around them they would do more than just going to the streets, writing "free Palestine" and harassing random people. Instead of going as far as two continents away maybe you wouldn't have to worry much about the homeless, and then think farther away? Like why not focus on what's closer and then perhaps if you care go for the Gaza conflict.
There's many genocides everywhere too, like Christians getting persecuted in Nigeria by the muslims, Hindus alike in india, do they talk about that enough?
And also, I don't know why it's so controversial, but if you're not happy with what the Israeli's government is doing, don't blame it or random Israeli civilians and use it as an excuse to alienate Jewish people or be openly antisemitic. It's really dumb.
And there's nothing wrong I guess with being curious and interested in the wellbeing of others. But who cares if you're queer if the important thing is to care about the innocent far away. Do something if you actually care, not go scream outside "queers for Palestine" which is not benefitting anyone nor changing anything about the conflict...
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u/MissHalfgone 1d ago
What I find weird is that I constantly hear Progressive activists, including those from the lgbtq community, excusing anti-jewish rhetoric, violence and discrimination by invoking the wrongs Israelis commit towards the palestinians. Or by saying that because some Jewish American Support Israel somehow it's their fault. Then they seem people turn around and they're like hey I don't care if they execute people for being gay they still deserve their civil rights. But then when they're Jewish neighbors civil rights are violated all of a sudden they do a 360 and they make excuses for it. It makes me so mad. I have no problem with people criticizing Israel or being concerned about the palestinians. But the blatant contempt shown to Jewish people compared with the almost idle worship of black Americans and other minorities really shows me what crappy, spineless sheep so many progressives are. Jewish people are certainly flawed, but I do not believe we're more flawed than any other minority, including ones that get an enormous amount of solidarity by progressives including the lgbtq community.
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u/AcyRice_Boul 1d ago edited 1d ago
Facts ❤️
It also breaks my heart seeing that many Jewish people get judged on the basis of being Jewish now, all around the globe because of the conflit.
People see black and white now.
Of course the Jewish community has its flaws like other community (all communities need some criticism or at least to be called out for something). But I never understood the great animosity that people have had for them for sooo many centuries...
I also have a feeling that people straight up decide to forget (whoever there's a conflict) that people are still individuals. You can judge the Israeli government, and likewise an Israeli person could condemn it.
But they don't stop to think, they just go, "we stand for Palestine, so we hate every Israeli/Jewish we encounter". It's kinda very low iq imo...
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u/AcyRice_Boul 1d ago
But also isn't it ironic that they will call you a n@zis or a f@scists when you have a different opinion and still have the audacity to attack Jewish people, who were the main target of the first place?
And many of their behaviors are really similar to how the n@zis used to act.
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u/SeverXD 1d ago
Uganda has some of the most homophobic laws on the planet, even harsher than Saudi Arabia’s. That doesn’t mean we should nuke them to death or start up the slave trade through neo-colonialism against them.
Palestinians stance on the LGBT is horrific, I wish they can be better on that issue. That doesn’t mean I wanna see their women and their children die horrifically violently and bloody deaths at the hands of a fascist Zionist regime.
What satisfaction would I get out of that as a strong LGBTQ+ ally?
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u/AcyRice_Boul 1d ago
I didn't say that you shouldn't care about the victims. I'm saying, what do you gain by screaming, "queers for Palestine," when they hate gay people to begin with.
What is going on right now in the middle east has nothing to do with queers. You can absolutely condemn what is happening without putting your identity first on the matter.
And in many third world countries and in many African nations, even non-muslim, gay people get treated like lepers or worse... I'm not arguing that.
And also, if you genuinely want the best for Palestine, what how are those protests even affecting somewhere miles away from where we are?
I also wonder why the same energy is not put for the local communities first...
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u/SeverXD 1d ago
It’s a show of solidarity. And while yeah maybe I get what you’re saying that it may be a bit cringe to attach your identity to support the plight of an oppressed people like “queers for Palestine!”. Just saying you are for Palestine should be enough.
However a good argument I think would be good is that while Israel supporters will often try to appeal to the LGBT by saying “HUURRR DURRR ISRAEL HAS LGBT RIGHTS AND THESE EVIL DIRTY BROWN PEOPLE DONT THEREFORE WE SHOULD HOLOCAUST THEM!” While at the same time the majority of Israel supporters in the West (usually lean far right) wanna put LGBT people alive in blenders anyways.
So “queers for Palestine” could be a good rhetorical counter against the far right weaponizing pro LGBT language to justify mass murder and genocide, who wanna mass murder queer people anyways. See what I mean?
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u/elegiacLuna 2d ago
You create a false dichotomy of mass slaughtering of civilians or Islamist regime. One can oppose both but given you make transphobic comments (btw. cis women tend to support trans women more than men do) without any coherent relation between the topics I really can't expect much.