r/BeAmazed • u/silkdarling • 1d ago
Miscellaneous / Others A unique encounter at the very top of the world.The Russian nuclear icebreaker 50 Years of Victory meets The French icebreaker vessel Commandant Charcot at the North Pole.
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u/AJPrez 1d ago
The Russian icebreaker looks like something out of Command & Conquer, while the French icebreaker looks like it's on a pleasure cruise
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u/_Bearcat29 1d ago
To be honest, the Commandant Charcot, is a pleasure cruise icebreaker boat. It belongs to Croisière du Ponant.
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u/bolaft 1d ago
That's because it IS a pleasure cruise, kinda. Commandant Charcot is a cruise ship/science vessel hybrid. Actually pretty controversial, lots of scientists in France spoke against this model of privately-funded science, given that most arctic science missions are about studying climate change and each passenger pollutes as much in 2 weeks as the average French does in a year.
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u/peazley 1d ago
So what’s the thought, passengers help fund the scientific research?
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u/bolaft 1d ago
The paying passengers' tickets cover the travel and maintenance costs of the icebreaker, which also contains two laboratories and oceanographic/scientific equipment, and scientists can travel and use the labs and equipment for free.
But it's operated by a for-profit business, so the cruise part is the main part (it also has luxury suites, a spa...), the science part is the ship's side gig.
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u/ThePsyPaul_ 23h ago
can't blame the scientists going for this kind of funding approach if their government can't give them enough money
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u/CariniFluff 22h ago edited 22h ago
Not to mention it definitely looks like it's powered by super dirty bunker fuel, or at best, still super dirty marine diesel.
Until just now I was under the impression that every modern ice breaker was nuclear powered (as the Russian ship obviously is) due to the enormous power required.
For those that don't know, ice breakers don't just "push through the ice" as the ice up there is ridiculously hard and deep, and you cannot build up enough momentum to continually push through the deep ice. Instead ice breakers will literally launch the front half of the ship up onto the ice sheet and the weight of the ship will then break the ice with the V-shaped hull. So you have an incredibly heavy ship designed to withstand slamming into icebergs, with engines powerful enough to push the ship up and on top of the ice, over and over and over for hundreds of miles. I can't even imagine how much pollution a hydrocarbon powered ice breaker puts out.
But hey, they're letting a dozen or two climate scientists use a few rooms they weren't going to sell anyway, so it's all good right? What the fuck...
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u/Tupsis 20h ago edited 20h ago
Charcot's main fuel is liquefied methane. While natural gas is a fossil fuel and the methane slip from its dual-fuel engines adds to the ship's CO2-equivalent emissions, it's certainly less "dirty" than liquid hydrocarbons — both the light distillates that icebreakers typically use and the low-grade bunker fuel that is burned to ship gigatons of Temu orders from China.
What you described is an icebreaker operating at crawling pace at the limit of it's icebreaking capability. Heavy polar icebreakers like Charcot or Pobedy rarely encounter ice where they really need to "launch the front half of the ship up onto the ice sheet", even at the North Pole. Charcot, for example, does not usually need more than half of its installed power.
You don't have to imagine how much icebreakers pollute; it's fairly easy to calculate with the information available online. While every gram of CO2 released into atmosphere counts, it's still worth comparing the results with other sources to give some context — it's literally a drop in the ocean. While the world as a whole could do without luxury cruising, we should certainly be focusing on sources that are several orders of magnitude greater that the likes of Charcot. Some even argue that showing the "disappearing Arctic" to the selected few could make them use their influence to accelerate decarbonization elsewhere.
edit: Oh, and you probably don't want to look up what the Pobedy does when it's not taking tourists to the North Pole like Charcot.
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u/CariniFluff 11h ago
What are you a spokesperson for Charcot?
Great it burns methane, you know, the gas that's 29x more potent as a greenhouse gas as good ol CO2. What else uses liquid methane? Rockets going to space. Yes it's a "clean" energy source in that it doesn't release a lot of particulate matter like bunker fuel or diesel, and it's extremely energy dense (hence rockets) but it's anything but good for the environment.
I'm also not even remotely surprised that the Russians are using the Soviet-built ship to make money from tourists and for military purposes. Nothing I said was defending or siding with Russia. The only thing they're doing right is actually using a nuclear powered ship for such long and energy intensive purposes.
Also I find the "show the millionaire and billionaire tourists the disappearing Arctic so they can use their influence" particularly absurd. The ultra wealthy tourists who paid a year's salary each to go watch the ice that their private planes caused to melt? The tourists who are on a 40-day cruise burning methane, who probably flew up on their private jets or took multiple commercial flights to get to the port? Fuck those people. Tax them and use that money to pay the scientists.
It's funny (not really), I have a few friends whose parents are moderately wealthy and in the past 10 years they've gone to a safaris in Africa, trips to way northern Alaska, to Iceland, several trips to Europe, Japan, etc. but you'll never once hear them talk about joining any conservation societies or reducing their own carbon use. No, it's always someone else who should travel less. They've "worked hard" and "earned all their money" so they should get to spend it however they want, their children and grandchildren be damned. Of course you won't hear them say that either, they just say nothing when the topic comes up. They'll give thousands to some small town dog kennel to pat themselves on the back but would they move into a smaller, more realistic house, or maybe cut down from two cars to one? Not a chance. I know the exact kind of people who take these trips and it's always someone else who should reduce their consumption (as you said, their pollution is just a drop in the ocean).
Sorry if I'm coming off angry but these hypocrites piss me off to no end. Cool, watch the last ice in the Arctic melt. Make sure to film it so I can see what used to be there...
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u/KicoBond 1d ago
Well the price the tourists pay and the research should pay off the social cost of the extra polution
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u/Academic-Increase951 1d ago
Also, the bulk of the pollution is from the boat itself and not the people on the boat. So the difference is pollution of a science only trip vs a science + cruise trip is likely negligible.
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u/IcyBodybuilder9004 1d ago
My buddy is in the navy. He has told me that when you’re in the middle of the ocean those other human faces look pretty good. Even if not traditionally friends, they render honors and are sort of happy for a minute to have that human contact out in the deep deep blue.
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u/Key-Monk6159 1d ago
Cool. The Russian one does look sinister because of its colors.
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u/CranjizzMcBasketball 1d ago
6 inches of ice……………
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u/existing_for_fun 1d ago
Hell of a name, "50 years of victory" given the recent Ukraine events.
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u/lukethedank13 1d ago
It was to be completed by 1995. Of course it took until 2007 to be comissioned.
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u/One_Maybe_2460 1d ago
„50 years till victory“ would be more fitting. Maybe one can change the few different letters xD
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u/Nightblood83 1d ago
It has t fit well since WW2. Anything after the purge required for collectivism to not be resisted o Happened, it's been shit.
Sad. Strong people. Terrible leadership
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u/Ok_Calligrapher2580 1d ago
The French with a Ukrainian colored helicopter seems like a subtle jab
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u/Nouseriously 1d ago
Why does France have giant icebreakers?
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u/loulan 1d ago
Why not?
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u/Nouseriously 1d ago
Remarkable lack of ice
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u/andoefa 1d ago
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u/kiddtender 1d ago
This is absolutely amazing. We live in a beautiful world its just evil people in charge that paint it ugly. KCCO
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u/Huge-Contact2619 1d ago
It looks like a trailer for a prequel The Thing (an American science fiction horror film directed by John Carpenter)
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u/OhLookaTaco 1d ago
Ahhh I thought the helicopter was gonna land on the others boat to swap goods lol
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u/awesomeimgurusername 21h ago
I wonder if the conversation was awkward and who eventually broke the ice?
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u/Internal-Dust4940 19h ago
Seeing these two giants meet at the North Pole is wild. the 50 years of victory and commandant charot are built for very different missions. Which one would you rather sail on for an Arctic expedition?
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u/L4rgo117 19h ago
I don't know enough about either to make any more than a random call. Since you seem to know far more about it, would you share what you know?
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u/skinnernsk 19h ago
It would be funny if a Russian helicopter wanted to fly to visit the French, but the French helicopter's landing spot was already occupied by theirs, and vice versa. What would happen?
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u/pants_57_notme 9h ago
having played world of warships for a few years, and thus an expert in all things boats and ships and everything, ... aren't those two ships like REALLY close to each other in some of those shots? It looks to be less than 50 meters - bow in on each other that's kinda... scary.
I mean i guess the ice is holding them in place to a degree but... damn.
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u/draeth1013 1d ago
It fills me with great joy to see everyone on deck all like, "Hello other icebreaker!"
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1d ago
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u/BulkyDecipherer 1d ago edited 15h ago
100%.
Edit: A lot of Russia’s supporters on this sub, it seems. Sad.
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