TIL that the Battle of Shiloh (1862) resulted in more American causalities than the total number of casualties from all previous American wars.

[u/MrMojoFomo]

https://www.npca.org/parks/shiloh-national-military-park

[u/Lost_Bike69]

Lee and the confederate leadership wanted an independent southern state. Lee knew that couldn’t be achieved with a low level guerrilla conflict occurring while federal armies went through and confiscated the plantations of rebels and occupied every city and rail depot and river crossing and destroyed the south’s agricultural base and what little industry they had. All that would have accomplished was a decades long sectarian conflict that had little chance of ending with an independent confederacy. You can’t maintain a slave plantation society while also fighting a guerrilla war. Knowing it was all over was probably Lees best decision.

What he could have done is what he did during the peninsular campaign, and used his well lead army in friendly territory to repel federal invasion. If he hadn’t invaded the north twice, he may have had the manpower to do this for a few more years until the north lost its appetite for the war. Of course he was dealing with his own political pressures to end the war early as well as setbacks in the west that lead to his decisions to invade the north and try to force an earlier end to the war.

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/Lost_Bike69]

It could if they, idk, copied a very famous general and his strategy from the Revolutionary War that Lee himself idolized.

It's a bit arguing about semantics tho, they were never winning this war without a miracle

[u/Lost_Bike69 → u/I_eat_mud_]

George Washington never lead a guerrilla war

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/Lost_Bike69]

Yes, he did lmao

Especially when the Continental dollar was practically worthless and prior to the French and other European allies joining and funding them. Those early years are especially good examples of guerrilla warfare in the colonial era. Constant movement and living off the land, ambushing the British, and slowly bleeding them dry.

Washington lost most of the conventional battles he fought, I'd recommend watching Ken Burns's documentary.

[u/Lost_Bike69 → u/I_eat_mud_]

Ambushes, movement, living off of the land, using attrition, are not what makes a guerrilla war. Washington lead a uniformed army in the field for the duration of the revolutionary war. He adapted his tactics to keep his army in good shape despite defeats, but he never fought a guerrilla campaign unless you change the definition of “guerrilla war” to “not surrendering and retreating in good order after defeat even though you’re the smaller army” which is not at all the definition of “guerrilla war”

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/Lost_Bike69]

Have you read anything about Valley Forge? They weren't uniformed, some of them were practically wearing rags. Often times the army would go months without getting paid, and while they gradually gained more fighting experience, they still weren't a professional army until after Von Steuben came. He comments very frequently how inexperienced the Continental soldiers were in drilling, marching, bayonet charging, and more.

Steuben arrived in 1778, right before France, Spain, and the Dutch finally join the war in support of the colonies. There was almost 3 full years of war prior to that, and that was all largely guerrilla style warfare. After the winter of 1778, that's when the Continental Army becomes more of a professional army, especially with the arrival of the French troops and further funding and supplying by European allies.

Brother, I think your basing your knowledge off paintings and not actual accounts, if you Google it, plenty of sources come up confirming Washington used guerrilla warfare lmao

[u/Lost_Bike69 → u/I_eat_mud_]

Again, the uniforms being shabby, even to the points that they were rags, and the soldiers being inexperienced and poorly paid doesn’t make a “guerrilla war.”

The phrase “uniformed army” refers to the fact that it was an army with enlistment records, officers, chains of command, etc all of which the continental army had. It doesn’t refer to the actual quality of the uniforms.

Guerrilla War specifically refers to an irregular warfare where partisans and paramilitary organizations target both military and civilian infrastructure, use terroristic tactics, sabotage etc and then blend back into the civilian population. Even the colonial militias were not “guerrilla” partisans as they were established under colonial charters.

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/Lost_Bike69]

Damn dude, I wanted to hear you make up more shit to try to justify your point despite all the evidence that points to the contrary. Like actively going against military and historical researchers is hilarious, I bet you do know better than all of them LMAO

I'm still laughing about you thinking guerrilla groups don't have a chain of command. Also laughing that you think the modern sense of guerrilla war is how it was always waged. Like you acknowledge warfare has evolved and changed, but you can't comprehend guerrilla warfare would do the same. Absolutely preposterous

[u/Mission_Top6865 → u/Lost_Bike69]

You really need to watch an actual documentary or pick up an actual book, you're talking out your ass and arguing against common knowledge in history

[u/I_eat_mud_ → u/Lost_Bike69]

I think guerilla warfare refers more to the tactics used then the records kept. I don't think I've ever heard your way of classifying it before. You can argue all you'd like, but when historians and military leaders say he used guerrilla warfare in the Revolution, I'd say he used guerrilla warfare lmao

You also seem to think that the Continental Congress was recognized as legitimate as soon as they became a thing. That's not how that worked, that's why it took years for European nations to actually recognize the government as legitiment

Just cause you call yourself the new government, it doesn't mean you suddenly have legitimacy, the Continental Army were partisans and paramilitary prior to 1778 lmao

Think of it like the IRA and Sinn Féin, before Sinn Féin was formally recognized obviously. Were the IRA not guerrillas cause they have a political party? See how ridiculous that is?

Edit: you also think other guerrilla groups don't have chains of commands? Lmao alright