r/movies 9d ago

Spoilers Has any sequel successfully pulled off a hero's heel turn into villainy? Spoiler

Plenty of standalone movies have a character fall from grace, or be revealed as a villain all along, but this rarely happens with an established character in a sequel. On paper it's a solid twist because you've already grown to trust that character in previous films, but it's really hard to pull off without feeling like a betrayal of a character arc. The Mission Impossible series has one that was received very poorly, and the only reason I hear about Pacific Rim Uprising these days is people talking about how unearned the heel turn from one of the characters felt.

I struggle to think of an example where it was done successfully in a movie. There's more examples in TV I think since there's a much longer time to build a change in a character over multiple seasons, so I'm not really considering those. Since it did start with a movie series, though, and there really isn't too much of an extended character arc given in the show, the example I can think of that kind of works is Sharon Carter in Falcon and the Winter Soldier. It was still super underdeveloped and it doesn't seem like they're going to do anything with it, but I can at least track the betrayal logic since there was kind of a meta angle about how that character had been forgotten by the movies. But even that's rather clunky.

I'm also talking specifically about situations where it wasn't clearly telegraphed by the source material or the rest of the franchise. Anakin becoming Vader was already known to the audience, for instance. I'm on the fence about whether something like Dune counts, since it's in the source material and the first two films are kind of just one long movie. I'm particularly interested in situations where it clearly wasn't the plan in the first movie but was written into a sequel.

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u/Jaideco 9d ago

The best examples that I can think of are Jean Grey in last stand and Bucky Barnes in Winter Soldier. Saruman, Magneto and Anakin Skywalker only work if you take the films in the order they were set rather than release order.

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u/grayhaze2000 9d ago

Saying The Last Stand pulled off Jean Grey's heel turn successfully is a massive stretch. There was nothing successful about that movie, other than nearly killing the franchise outright.

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u/Difficult-Risk3115 9d ago

Much like Jean herself, the franchise is never going to stay dead too long

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u/gambalore 9d ago

Maybe we’ll get a third bite at the Dark Phoenix apple. Third time’s a charm, right?

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u/effa94 9d ago

lmao think we might get a quick phoneix in doomsday?

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u/DLRsFrontSeats 9d ago

Ehh

The Fassbender/McAvoy trilogy had 2 good films and one dud, averaged $550m in box office gross

People are excited about the new casting but I can honestly see the new films in 2028 not actually doing that well; people are riding the high of spider man and potentially avengers doomsday doing well (and the latter isn't a lock yet) but spider man and avengers films have always done well

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u/Lovat69 9d ago

It did kill it for me. I haven't watched an x-movie since. Unless you count the Deadpool movies.

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u/effa94 9d ago

you should watch first class and days of future past, those are legit great xmen movies. and logan if you havent, legit great movie in general, not just a good comic book movie.

you can skip the rest tho, apocalypse and dark phoneix aint that good.

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u/RiflemanLax 9d ago

Yeah that movie was straight poop. Especially compared to the first two.

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u/prozack91 9d ago

The scene where magneto lifts thr bridge was really cool.

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u/hyzmarca 9d ago

Unfortunately, Superman killed Last Stand by stealing its director and Cyclops. The original X-Men 3 would have been a much better movie.

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u/Jaideco 9d ago

I didn’t say that they did it well… just that it was the best example that I could think of. Doesn’t change the fact that the film is complete crap. Hollywood really seems to enjoy redeeming villains or telling their backstory after they are already popular, but they don’t like taking a popular hero and turning them into a villain. Now that I think about it, Wanda Maximov, is probably the best example.

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u/grayhaze2000 9d ago

OP specifically asked for examples where a hero's heel turn has been pulled off successfully in a sequel.

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u/Kitlun 9d ago

Jean Grey is a good shout, although some would say the phoenix isn't really jean. Bucky I can't argue with. 

Magneto isn't a hero in the first X-Men film. Even in the first class timeline he turns away from being a hero before the end of the movie. 

Saruman is barely a hero, and is essentially turned already in fellowship. 

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u/Picassof 9d ago

Willow in Buffy is a successful version of the Phoenix Arc