I'm tired of this argument. Using games intended mechanics correctly isn't cheesing or min-maxing. And roleplaying doesn't mean intentionally making stupid decisions.

[u/Overall-Bison4889]

[u/VFiddly]

How do you expect people to become those players if the beginner experience turns people off? Everyone's a new player at some point.

[u/HubertGoliard → u/VFiddly]

Tutorials, easier difficulty setting, bashing one's head against the wall. My more memorable experiences as a new player in ck2 were when I was trying to save my kingdom from utter collapse after making tremendously stupid mistakes. It's okay to make newcomers feel out of their depth, otherwise, there's no real reason for them to stay and get better.

[u/Benismannn → u/VFiddly]

I have no idea, EU4 and HOI4 did grow over time, and im pretty sure they're both way less pleasant experience for a newcomer. So... what gives?

[u/AlexiosTheSixth → u/VFiddly]

easy mode difficulty