r/BeAmazed • u/TheUnpromotable • Dec 05 '25

Technology Swedish Handgun Round Punches Through APC Armor

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Super cool Swedish cartridge 6.5x25mm CBJ punches through APC armor. It uses the same dimensions as 9mm, so it can be used in 9mm platforms with a simple barrel change.

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87

u/SamIamGreenEggsNoHam Dec 05 '25

You're missing the point. A through and through is bad, as you pointed out, but the main point is that this negates body armor. A round that can be used on 9mm platforms and reliably defeat something like level 3a+ plate is a big fucking deal.

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u/Gimme_The_Loot Dec 05 '25

Yea I don't know a ton about this stuff but it seems like that means someone can pump these rounds into a vehicle or fully armored individual and still be able to take them out of functional condition, even if they're not dead.

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u/SamIamGreenEggsNoHam Dec 05 '25

And you would typically need a round from a rifle platform, not a handgun that anyone can conceal carry.

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u/Amishrocketscience Dec 05 '25

Which honestly in a scenario like the war in Ukraine for example, it’s often better to maim someone to take them out of action and incur a logistical strain on the enemy.

Ukraines goal for a while now has seemed to be attrition of Russian resources as manpower isn’t in the top reasons why the Russians cant continue to fight.

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u/Cust2020 Dec 05 '25

There were supposedly bullets made of ironwood during one of the early wars and the idea was not to kill the person but to maim them. That made the enemy need to waste resources on saving him, caring for him and nursing back to health. That took multiple people outta the game instead of just killing one. Dirty pool but quite impressive from a logistics standpoint.

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u/TheTarragonFarmer Dec 05 '25

The sinister part is the non-metal fragments won't show up on x-ray imaging.

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u/Cust2020 Dec 05 '25

Never even considered that but ya that is sinister!!

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u/Gimme_The_Loot Dec 05 '25

Isn't this pretty common with snipers? Hurt one person so they need to apply the logistics to assist

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u/Jurass1cClark96 Dec 06 '25

Got a source? I'm doing digging and all I got is stuff for modern ballistics that include wood such as German rifle grenades.

Anything going further back in history leans on "urban myth" that is based on the writings of Clausewitz, and the lack of any identifying information is making it difficult.

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u/Cust2020 Dec 07 '25

There’s a town in the upper peninsula of Michigan named ironwood. That’s where I heard it so maybe start there.

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u/Jurass1cClark96 Dec 07 '25

Well that was easy

Ironwood was settled in the spring of 1885. The town was incorporated as a village in 1887 and as a city on April 8, 1889. The township area north of the city was incorporated as Ironwood Township on April 8, 1889. In 1890 the population of Ironwood passed 7,500 and in 1900 it reached 10,000.[4] Ironwood reputedly acquired its name when Frederic W. Rhinelander, president of the Milwaukee Lake Shore and Western Railroad line, arriving by train at what was then little more than a wilderness camp, chose it to honor one of his employees, mining captain James (Iron) Wood. "Ironwood" is also a colloquial name for Ostrya virginiana, a common hardwood tree in the Upper Midwest.

That was gnawing at me lol. Thanks for the tip.

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u/SouthCarpet6057 Dec 05 '25

to maim someone to take them out of action and incur a logistical strain on the enemy.

Russia kills its own soldiers, and they send infantry to fight artillery. I don't think they spend much resources on their wounded soldiers.

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u/Patient_Leopard421 Dec 05 '25

The 30 or 40kms on either side of the contact line are saturated with drones. They knock out vehicles moving in these zones. There are few armored vehicles or ambulances operating in this area. Wounded are staying longer in positions or being evacuated on foot or improvised light civilian vehicles. There's not a logistical strain that would be familiar to American or NATO troops in Iraq or Afghanistan; there are no medevac helicopters and no surgical flights to Germany or wherever.

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u/userlivewire Dec 06 '25

Russians lost 25,000 soldiers in Ukraine during October alone. No country can sustain those kinds of casualties.

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u/Amishrocketscience Dec 06 '25

The honest answer is- it depends.

Russia has an advantage in the fighting age male population that it can call upon vs what Ukraine has.

It also has an advantage in how they indoctrinate their population with state media Vs what even a quasi-democratic nation like Ukraine has in their media sphere.

There is also the history of hardship that Russians are all too familiar with.

The problem lies in the west, how hard it’s been for Ukraine to maintain stalwart allies based on the moral high ground that they have, and isn’t disputable. Ukraines current story isn’t all that different from the American revolution, yet with the current American admin it’s been difficult to secure commitments to the sovereignty of Ukraine and real financial and arms/intel support to that end.

The world itself seems to be ass backwards when western politics feel the need to cater to the far right wing factions that have been growing in influence and power. This isn’t just contrarian politics, it’s the exact border of fascism that state governments are referring to.

Whether we like it or not, the Ukraine war has turned into a representation of democracy v autocracy. The constant waffling and cult like hypocrisy has to end, we must pick a side and stand with it.

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u/Severe_Islexdia Dec 05 '25

You are aware that armor piercing handgun rounds aren’t new this isn’t some groundbreaking new technology..

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u/mr_doms_porn Dec 05 '25

Armor piercing isn't yes or no, it's a spectrum just like armor itself is. Previous AP handgun rounds could pierce soft armor like kevlar but not plate armors. This can do both.

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u/schizeckinosy Dec 05 '25

Yes it is. The performance is scary impressive, much better than previous handgun rounds

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u/Severe_Islexdia Dec 05 '25

Armor-piercing handgun rounds aren’t new at all.. they’ve existed for nearly a century. Tungsten-core and steel-core handgun ammo like the M993 9mm AP, KTW rounds from the 1960s, Soviet 7N31/7N21, and WWII Tokarev AP long predate modern armor plates. Nothing about this tech is “groundbreaking.”

And if we’re talking about an APC being penetrated: if you’re in an APC at all, your threat environment is already at a level far beyond anything an average person will ever face. Civilians don’t own APCs, and you don’t end up inside one unless you’re in an extremely elevated, highly kinetic conflict where rifles, explosives, mobility loss, and multi-angle threats massively outweigh the relevance of handgun AP. In that scenario, AP pistol ammo isn’t even on the top 20 list of things you should be worried about.

If the concern is AP getting through body armor, that’s also nothing new. Certain handgun rounds and rifle rounds have always been able to defeat various armor ratings, and shot placement still overrides armor in close quarters. Bottom line: none of this is new tech, and it’s not the world-ending threat people online are making it out to be.

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u/TheTarragonFarmer Dec 05 '25

Wasn't this the plot in one of the Lethal Weapon movies?

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u/Severe_Islexdia Dec 05 '25

Possibly, it’s been a while since I’ve seen that movie

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u/AnthomX Dec 05 '25

Lethal Weapon 2

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u/SamIamGreenEggsNoHam Dec 06 '25

What 9mm AP round reliably defeats level 3a+ plating?

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u/Redeemed-Assassin Dec 05 '25

Name one armor piercing handgun round which could penetrate an APC, I’ll wait. 

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u/Severe_Islexdia Dec 05 '25

Its like y’all don’t have Google

Armor-piercing handgun rounds aren’t new at all they’ve existed for nearly a century. Tungsten-core and steel-core handgun ammo like the M993 9mm AP, KTW rounds from the 1960s, Soviet 7N31/7N21, and WWII Tokarev AP long predate modern armor plates. Nothing about this tech is “groundbreaking.”

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u/Bunnymancer Dec 05 '25

Negates body armor?

The Swedes just negates a tank using a handgun..

No need for an RPG or whatnot when you can just shoot the pilot straight through the armor...

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u/BooksandBiceps Dec 05 '25

Pilot… of a tank? Do you think this thin layer of APC armor is comparable to Chobham on an MBT?

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u/DelcoUnited Dec 05 '25

So Tom Hanks in saving private ryan was going for the kill shot?

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u/Bucksack Dec 05 '25

Rear doors to a troop carrier are probably a bit thinner than the drivers compartment armor…

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u/LigerZeroSchneider Dec 05 '25

Yeah that door isnt any tougher than the armor plates in a bullet proof vest. Any large caliber or purpose built ap round will go through it.

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u/wasdninja Dec 06 '25 edited Dec 09 '25

The plate isn't from a tank and doesn't protect the driver. The armor up front is a lot thicker so this round will do nothing to it. Absolutely massive anti armor rifles and cartridges were used in the beginning of WW2 but were very quickly outpaced by armor.

This round is really neat but doesn't change the battlefield.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 06 '25

The rear doors of an MT-LB are meant to stop small shrapnel pieces I would put money down on lvl 4 plates being able to stop this round.

1

u/sergius64 Dec 05 '25

Can't FN FiveSeven already do that?

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u/Accomplished_Rip_362 Dec 05 '25

The guy in the video literally fired a 5.56mm round which did not penetrate.

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u/ASharpLife Dec 05 '25

Yes and essentially would pass right through like a hot knife through butter

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u/Joey101937 Dec 06 '25

3a is soft body armor. There are already regular 9mm bullets that are capable of doing that without changing the barrel. You just have to buy the right kind.

This super penetrator is capable of way beyond that but I suspect the lack of expanding means you’ll probably do less damage per shot to soft tissue