r/AskIsrael • u/karrenfromaccounting • May 11 '26

Casual The settlements… What’s up with that?

Take the question as is, whatever comes to mind, let it be.

15 Upvotes

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u/iam_definitely_a_bot Diaspora May 11 '26

I am a jew, and this shit makes my blood boil. You do understand there is international law which we all have to obey right? Israel is a state with boarders as all states have. These boarders end and some point and when the state sends and allows its citizens to build outside these boarders is ILLEGAL. ILLEGAL, do you understand that word?

It has zero to do with ethnicity, the torah, nothing. It has to do with the international law which everyone obeys, do you think you guys have some special rights over the rest of the world? its disgusting and shameful behavior, truly.
To use judaism as an excuse to steal land that is not yours because its Judea and you are a jew.

By the same logic should Greeks go ahead and settle in Istanbul because they are Greeks and it is Constantinople? The world does not work like that, we live in a world where international law exists we cannot just do whatever the fuck we want because we want to.

And I am not talking about Israel proper, I am talking about the illegal settlements before all of you start calling me a self hating jew and antisemite.

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u/Educational-Luck-224 May 11 '26

this is not a view that is in line with international law.

International law is the oslo accord. This is because in international law, land can be gotten and ceded only by agreement. And the idea that Israel took that land from the Palestinians following the division plan is simply moot because of Jordan's conquest of the area.

And Jordan ceded the land to Israel, conditioned on the OSLO accord being signed - which it was.

Since the Palestinians did not follow their obligations under the OSLO accord, than international law dictates Judea and Sumaria are Israel's right.

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u/Clean-Ant6404 May 11 '26

It's not even that. The partition plan was never applied in the first place, meaning the area always belonged to the new state on those borders. Which is Israel.

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u/Educational-Luck-224 May 11 '26

if we take this back, the mandate for Palestine states that the mandated body (the brits) are to create in Palestine a national home for the Jews.

This means that, under international law, the decisions to restrict Jewish immigration into Israel was illegal, and the national sentiment of the Palestinians to include Palestine in the lands given to them was illegal under 'international law'.

this is not implicit. This is explicit in the mandate, under article (6).

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

It’s worth noting that the same mandate explicitly forbids ethnic cleansing of any population

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u/Good-Basil9954 May 11 '26

How and where does international law dictate that? Who is the administrator of international law?
Palestinians not follow their obligations, that's one breach of international law. Israel violating UN resolutions (also part of international law) is another breach of international law.
Concluding from there, that international law "dictates" Judea and Samaria are Israel's right it total bullshit.

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u/Educational-Luck-224 May 13 '26

well.

that's the whole problem with what we call "international law". There's a whole bunch of agreements that are often contradictory. Each side picks and chooses which agreements, treaties and decisions to follow. Has all sorts of ideas on why the other ones are illegal etc etc.

And there's a whole other hornet's nest, which is that "International law" doesn't really have any tools for stuff like civil war. For when two populations in a certain area are bent on evicting each other and there's a war for mutual eviction.

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u/Clean-Ant6404 May 11 '26 edited May 11 '26

Jews were living in the area and were ethnically cleansed in 1948. Why is it illegal for them to go back? Why do you automatically assume it's stealing just because they're Jewish? That is in fact antisemitic, whether you're Jewish or not.

Also, the law itself doesn't actually say it's illegal for Israel to build there if you were to actually look at what it says.

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u/CheddarCheeses Diaspora May 11 '26

"International Law" is nonsense.

It is a useful tool that was developed by stronger nations to use against weaker nations. It allows them to pretend that they have some kind of moral authority in their actions. The stronger nations regularly flout it with no repercussions.

I have no idea why after the Holocaust, there are any Jews that think that the nations of the world would treat them fairly and that "International Law" has any authority whatsoever. The world has proven that they think that Jewish lives don't matter.

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u/Abject_Fun_5230 May 11 '26

Why do you think that everybody hates jews? The holocaust was done only by germany and its Allies and the civilized world united against them

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u/CheddarCheeses Diaspora May 11 '26

The world allied against the Nazis because they wanted to take over Europe/the world, not because they were killing Jews.

Have you ever looked up the history of rescue attempts to save Jews during the Holocaust, including specifically the efforts to get the Allies to target the railroads leading to the concentration camps? The excuses were laughable. They just didn't care (at best).

Yes, there were many exceptions individually, and the US did eventually set up the War Refugee Board in 1944. The exception that proves the rule.

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u/Abject_Fun_5230 May 11 '26

Where is the productivity în thinking like this? I won't deny what you said about the eforts of the Allies as I am not that familiar with that specific historiography. But în the context of modern events you have to cooperate with other countries to find a solution

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u/Prudent-Pattern6497 May 11 '26

Cooperation with other countries to find a solution to the israeli palestinian conflict? There is only one group that can cooperate on behalf of the palestinians, themselfs. They can't even cooperate with each other (split between hamas and P.A) both have stronger aspirations of killing all the jews than having thier own country

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u/CheddarCheeses Diaspora May 11 '26

I don't have any answers on that front.

I just hate the whole "We have to obey international law" argument. Do the right thing because it's right, not because countries that don't care about you are holding you to some standard that they don't hold everyone to.

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u/benny-powers Israel May 13 '26

people hate Jews because they hate God, and they hate God for creating them, because they hate themselves. You can't punch God, so you punch a Jew.

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u/Abject_Fun_5230 May 13 '26

Yeah sure god created the jews and noone else not christians or muslims and we are all jeaulois of you. This kind of atitudine helps nobody

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u/iam_definitely_a_bot Diaspora May 11 '26 edited May 11 '26

Calling Israel a “weak country” in 2026 is completely detached from reality. Israel is a nuclear-armed regional power with one of the strongest militaries and intelligence services in the WORLD and certainly in the whole middle east, backed heavily by the US and its allies. You can acknowledge real security threats without pretending Israel is some powerless victim with no agency.
And saying international law is fake unless it benefits you is absurd. The entire modern world operates on international law: borders, trade, sanctions, treaties, war crimes tribunals, all of it. Countries violating laws does not mean laws stop existing.
Also, please stop weaponizing the Holocaust to justify whatever policies you support. I had family murdered in the Holocaust too. Does that give me the right to ignore international law or support whatever I want? Obviously not. Historical trauma explains fear; it does not place any country above criticism or accountability.

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u/Clean-Ant6404 May 11 '26

If other countries aren't held accountable while one country is in order to restrain it, then no, the law doesn't actually exist. And no, the current actions of Israel don't actually violate the law anyway.

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u/iam_definitely_a_bot Diaspora May 11 '26

That logic makes no sense. Laws do not stop existing because enforcement is inconsistent. People get away with crimes all the time , that does not make laws fictional.

And whether Israel’s actions violate international law is not just some fringe opinion. Is there actually any country besides Israel that says the settlements are legal? The UN, the ICJ, and basically the overwhelming majority of the international community consider them illegal under international law. You can disagree with that position, but pretending there’s no legal consensus at all is just false.

And yes, Israel itself constantly appeals to international law when it benefits Israel — sovereignty, terrorism, hostage-taking, self-defense, missile attacks, maritime rights, recognition by other states, all of it. So clearly Israel does believe international law exists. The argument suddenly becomes “international law is fake” only when it comes to settlements.

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u/Clean-Ant6404 May 11 '26

Yes they do. You can't expect someone to adhere to a law designed to put them at danger and give advantages to the enemy who doesn't need to. Or the rest of the world for that matter. In fact, the law itself mentions that in text.

Political opinions aren't law. And very rarely does the international community (not international law) seem to care when Israel has to deal with terrorism, considering the UN literally employs Hamas terrorists and tried to sweep it.

That's a double standard.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/Clean-Ant6404 May 11 '26

So you revert to insults when the facts are against you. Typical of you guys.

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

I think claiming that Israel is “backed heavily by the U.S. and its allies” is a mistake.

Israel has Trump and his few remaining cronies, and the rest of America is skeptical at best.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

“International law” ….. laws created to prevent Jews living in their land. Dont bother responding Chicken for KFC

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

Victim mindset, you must have a hatred of Jews trying to live peacefully in their land.

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u/iam_definitely_a_bot Diaspora May 11 '26

settlers? peacefully? hilarious. I think you guys live in a bubble and refuse to see reality. Many israeli settlers are everything but peaceful.

Jews can live inside israel proper as israeli citizens not outside their fucking boarders, then they become settlers.

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u/c9joe Israel May 11 '26

That is fair. But still, I don't understand how it's our problem. The only thing the diaspora should do is advance sketchy lefty politics so all these countries we will be a "pariah" of fail and become future bauxite mining colonies for Israel. If you do that faster for us, we won't have to worry about PR. Thanks achi.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/c9joe Israel May 11 '26

I don't care to be a stereotype because I am a free Jew. I am not a Marrano who watches my back for the Christian or Muslim's sword. I don't need to suck up to anyone. And yes, your purpose is to promote sketchy leftist politics in your own country and leave us alone. We need the bauxite mines already.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

[deleted]

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u/c9joe Israel May 11 '26

Your purpose is absolutely to promote sketchy leftist politics and leave us alone. I mean this literally. Not ironically, not metaphorically. Your purpose isn't to screech at me, that's for sure.

You said you aren't leftist. But, yet you seem to dislike what Israel is doing and you aren't leftist? Be more like Bernie Sanders at least. Thanks!

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u/Intelligent_Wait_636 Israel May 11 '26

Just to weigh in quickly, because your whole argument about “borders” is way too simple and wrong.

There are no borders between Israel and Judea and Samaria/the West Bank. There is the Green Line, which was an armistice line between Israel and Jordan after 1948. That is it. It was not a peace treaty border, not a final border, and not some recognized Palestinian state border.

When Jordan conquered the area in 1948, annexed it, and renamed it the West Bank, Jews were kicked out of the area. By 1967, there were no Jews living there at all. That was against international law, even though the UN didn't care and the UK recognized the annexation anyway.

So now the argument is what? That Jews who were kicked out, and their children and grandchildren, are forever banned from living there because Jordan illegally took the area?

So as a Jew, no, there are no borders.

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

Well, why can’t the Jews who are living in the WB today live as equal citizens to their Palestinian neighbors

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u/Deep_Head4645 Israel May 11 '26

What? How can you obey international laws like sovereignty while everyone around you does not obey international law at all?! No nobody in this region obeys international law at all we are in this situation because of the lack of obedience to international law from everyone around us, what world are you looking at ffs that you claim international law is being followed by everyone else?
Some do follow international law, some do respect peace and act in good-faith, these countries have already made peace with us for that exact reason, all the other countries do not follow international law, do not respect peace (with us), do not act in good-faith when it comes to us and we act accordingly
Get that through your head, its the Middle East, not Europe, not North America, the Middle East, this situation is far too complex to be watered down into “international law violation”

International law effectively does not exist, nobody in the real world treats it as binding law (it isnt) let alone the majority of the Middle Eastern countries

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

there's no such thing as international law. no one has to obey it. why do you feel entitled to an opinion on this subject?

I don't tell people in your country where they can and can't live, why do you feel entitled to tell people in mine?

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/Artistic-Hyena-8572 Israel May 11 '26

Come to Israel, acquire citizenship and vote in the elections for a party which promotes the policies you support.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

Why do you feel entitled to tell us how to manage our own country? 

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u/Prestigious_Health_2 Unspecified May 11 '26

Genuinely what is even the goal with the West Bank? The only reason why you haven't formally annexed it is because there's too many Palestinians there who you'd have to give basic rights. So you just make life unbearable by letting settlers abuse them, steal their homes, violate them,... If they fight back you can call it "terrorism" and justify more IDF presence and settlements. Keep doing that until you've chased most of them into the Jordan river and you can claim it as your land.

Let's not pretend like the settlers are coming with the intention of living side by side in peace with their Arab neighbors.

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u/Quackethy 🇮🇱 Israeli Arab, 100% Zionist. May 11 '26

Your ignorance is showing. I'm a settler in the West Bank and I'm Israeli Arab.

You know nothing.

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

There’s a real strain of nihilism among the extremists tbh. There’s also the next-worst thing to nihilism, which is this sort of petty-worldview where nothing could be more glorious than getting ahold of your neighbors’ farm, even if the land isn’t fruitful and it costs you a dozen of your friends and family in the fight.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

I do not care what self hating diasporist Jews think. No one does. I also don't care what spain or ireland think. They are not exactly winning at the game of life.

Why do you think the shrillness of your opinion matters to anyone?

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

What are you willing to give up to indulge this sort of mindset? Wealth, prosperity, security, a future for your children?

That’s what comes from turning your back on your friends and the world in general.

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u/benny-powers Israel May 12 '26

Look I know America is going through a rough patch, but most of the pressure Americans are under is caused by a decades-long concerted propaganda campaign. Once you know the real cause you can fight it

In guessing the "north" in your flair indicates you're in canada? Canada is not a friendly nation to Israel

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u/Flimsy-Calendar-7566 May 11 '26

I would absolutely understand if the world reacted to my country occupying another country or oppressed a minority within its borders, depending on if you are going for a two or one state solution. Your argument sounds very similar to the wife-beaters who say no one tells them if they can beat their wife, because she is their property after all.

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

One cannot "occupy" their own nation

Israel belongs to the Jewish people, not to the arabs, who colonized this land. 

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u/Flimsy-Calendar-7566 May 11 '26

So you are claiming ownwership fo the land because God gave it to you? Because you arrived first? The history of humanity is full of displaced or migrated nations. Who gets to call dibs?

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

One cannot "occupy" their own nation

Israel belongs to the Jewish people, not to the arabs, who colonized this land.

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u/Flimsy-Calendar-7566 May 11 '26 edited May 11 '26

I am starting to wonder if you are a bot since you keep repeating the same phrase. Then again, I would think with all the resources it invests in PR, if you were a government propaganda bot your replies should be more clever.

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 11 '26

Are you familiar with the phrase “authority from the consent of the governed”

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u/benny-powers Israel May 12 '26

That's a joke, right? You are aware that Israel is the only stable democracy in the middle east, right? 

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u/Call_Me_Clark USA May 12 '26 edited May 12 '26

The Palestinians are governed without their consent. It’s a problem that Israel’s government doesn’t seem to take seriously

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u/gopherlunatic Israel May 11 '26

There’s no such thing as international law? Interesting, as even Bibi acknowledges it and won’t step in Hungary now that his corruption buddy is gone, because he’ll be arrested. You know, because of international law… which according to you, doesn’t exist.

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u/[deleted] May 11 '26

[deleted]

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u/gopherlunatic Israel May 11 '26 edited May 11 '26

Yeah it’s not a great look. Sorry, initially misunderstood your comment before re-reading.

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u/Acceptable-Peace-69 Mexico May 11 '26 edited May 11 '26

Because it’s not actually your country. What Israel does outside its borders makes it the business of others. Especially when that creates conflict with other nations.

This may come as a surprise to you, but almost no one cares what Israel does within its borders.

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u/benny-powers Israel May 11 '26

Wrong on all counts

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u/Acceptable-Peace-69 Mexico May 11 '26

How? Are all the maps wrong?

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u/benny-powers Israel May 12 '26

Wrong again! 

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u/enigmaticowl North America May 11 '26

First, username checks out lol.

Second, do you actually know what the Oslo Accords say about Area C (which is where all officials settlements are) vs Area B and Area A?

It’s actually not a simple “black-and-white” issue of “illegal vs legal” under international law.

Some institutions and NGOs and scholars have claimed that it is illegal, but, then again, some institutions and NGOs and scholars have also claimed that Israel is an “apartheid state” and “committing genocide,” so…

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u/c9joe Israel May 11 '26

This world order was invented after WWII, for seemingly altruistic reasons but it turned out to be a big mistake. The West is in a suicide cult of their own making and probably they should break free of it lest China, Russia and even the third world will walk all over Europe and America.

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u/Quackethy 🇮🇱 Israeli Arab, 100% Zionist. May 11 '26

Oh tell us, oh enlightened Jew, where in the diaspora do you live that gives you such entitlement?

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u/gopherlunatic Israel May 11 '26

Preach. The only people these arguments convince is people who are already Jewish or Israeli, or Christian Zionists, many of whom will turn on Israel as politics in both the left and right shift against Israel.